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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 03:58 AM   #21
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

Today, I am an engineer. It never bothered me to do something that would bring a grievance, if I thought it should be done. But...

Once, I was a union member. They never did much for me, per se, then, but in a manner of speaking, they did once upon a time. Things were once really bad for the working man and woman (and child! don't forget!), for no good reason. Bad management created unions, and they deserved them. Unions changed the world, and God bless 'em.

Today, unions don't have the power they used to have. That's OK. Management doesn't have the power they once had, either. Niether side has a free ride today. If a company is too nasty, their employees will leave. If a union or unions become too difficult to work with, that company will fail and their jobs will go away. I call that good. I see nothing wrong with a world where working people are treated decently but are required to work hard.
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 04:43 AM   #22
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

All problems are caused by "Management." In the case of GM, management created the union power buy being easily blackmailed by threats of labor unrest. Forty years ago they could easily pass the extra cost along because "what else are they going to drive."

Some managements didn't understand the importance of safety. Some where just opportunistic a***s wanting their corporate perks and really didn't care about anything else.

I never ran in the upper levels but I got to see them reguarly. There were a few "work horses," a lot of "show horses," buy way too many horses a***s. I will say that being political and kissing up seemed to be a more effective gambit for that "big promotion" than doing a good job and "getting your numbers."
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 06:19 AM   #23
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

I believe unions still have a place when it comes to safety and the way employees are treated, it's just that some of the unions have gone over board and now hurt some workers more than they help. As for mining unions, I can't even imagine the deaths and injuries there would be without the unions.
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 06:27 AM   #24
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

Unions served a very productive role, but many of the things they fought for are now enshrined in law.

Work Place safety is a major factor, there are laws to protect the workers, but some one must monitor the situation, in most cases it is a Government Body.

Unions are big business, dues are huge revenues, the only time most workers are aware of their Union is if it is Confrontational and organises a strike.

Canadian Teachers have a very aggressive Union, frequently striking, it is impossible to fire a Teacher, and they now have Incomes approaching $100,000 at the top levels.

Nurses have a Union, it is illegal for them to strike, sometimes they are settling 2 to 3 years after a contract expires and make no where near what Teachers make, inspite of being equally qualified and working much harder and longer(Teachers in Canada work 198 days a year, 5 1/2 hours a day).
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 06:50 AM   #25
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

Hmmm

The Cocks of the Walk where I grew up were the Longshoremen. The PacNW was relatively strong union territory.

But the Pulp and Sulphite Hall had the best rock and roll on Saturday night.

heh heh
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 08:33 AM   #26
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

I have worked on both sides of the union and I can tell you it was pure hell to be a young supervisor in a union shop trying to make medical products. The union was the Teamsters and they were entrenched and arrogant. I was forced to spent far more time trying to comply with the union contract than I did tying to assure we met federal laws. My experience taught me to NEVER work in that environment again. After wasting 5 years of my life in that climate I got out and never went back. The plant folded up a couple of years after I left due to their inability to move fast enough to compete and because their costs were too high.

I ran into a former union steward a few years later. He was on of the most arrogant pricks you could ever meet. He used to threaten non-union laboratory chemists with trashing their cars or physical harm. I had on pretty vocal guy that worked for me that would not join the union. He had some words with the steward and when he left to go home, found that his car had been trashed. The ensuing altercation left my employee on the street without a job while the union steward walked away scott free. His new job? Wrking at the 7-11 on the night shift. I got some small amout of satisfaction from his lot in life.

I see a need to keep a balance between worker rights and running a successful business. The companies I have worked for since were very good to their employees (hourly anyway) and did a lot to avoid the kind of issues that create the desire for unions. If a company does what it can to give employees a decent work environment with employment and promotions based on performance and experience and they provide a means to resolve management issues then there is very little reason for a person to want to pay a chunck of their check to some slick talking union.

Unions are a business too. They don't provide their "sevices" for free and their officials are always looking for ways to expand the business.

I for one am very glad I don't have to manage people in a union environment. It was however, very educational for me as a young supervior right out of college. It is a shame that some industries cannot conduct themselves in a manner that prevents the need to them. It is also a shame that some union members see their membership as a ticket to cheating the company out of a fair day's work for a fair day's pay. Abuse of any system will eventually cause cracks to form and the collapse of that system. Just my 2 cents adjusted for inflation.
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 08:57 AM   #27
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

I guess the irksome thing that I see here at my condo building is these union guys showing up every morning, parking illegally, bring lounge chairs, coolers, etc and generally being pricks while getting paid by a union to harass.

If they were not union, the police would get involved to move them.

At one hotel on S. Michigan, a Hotel Workers Unions has 50-60 pickets out there 24 hrs a day. Shouting there stupid mouths and being a-holes.

No sympathy from me. Get a job. Wait, better yet, get a life.
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 09:23 AM   #28
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

I say fire em all, then drive a couple dozen buses to Mexico and offer $10/hr for able-bodied men (and women : ). You may want to pick up a couple Spanish/English translators while you're at it.



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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 09:28 AM   #29
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

Sounds like the plot for the next blockbuster movie...

Get Adam Sandler involved, and it'll make 400M the first weekend.
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-28-2006, 09:41 AM   #30
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sr. Senor Cute 'n' Fuzzy Bunny
Sounds like the plot for the next blockbuster movie...

Get Adam Sandler involved, and it'll make 400M the first weekend.
Leno "Headline" from last night regarding the first weekend for a new realase:

"Big Momma" has huge opening

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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-29-2006, 07:56 AM   #31
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

Quote:
Originally Posted by justin
I say fire em all, then drive a couple dozen buses to Mexico and offer $10/hr for able-bodied men (and women : ). You may want to pick up a couple Spanish/English translators while you're at it.
My car mechanic hires Mexicans and charges me about 10% discount from regular ongoing rate of $96 per hour at other shops. He must be making a very good profit since he now drives a Lexus GX470 compared to a beat-up car that he drove two years ago.

P.S. I am tempting to do some of repair since the rate they charge becomes ridiculous.
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!
Old 03-29-2006, 12:06 PM   #32
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Re: Whoa, bad news for Delphi workers!

As long as your mechanic doesnt have the same sign as the guy I used to go to 20 years ago:

"Labor - $36 an hour"
"Labor for stuff you tried to fix yourself and screwed up before coming here - $48 an hour"
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