Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 04-22-2016, 03:34 PM   #61
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt34 View Post

But to me frugality also has a strong connection to efficient use of the means available, and I like efficiency.
Now, I can relate to this. Why would anyone want to waste money? I think we are pretty good at getting the biggest "bang" for our buck. Regardless of how many bucks you spend this would seem the best approach. Within reason of course.
__________________

__________________
Danmar is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 04-22-2016, 03:37 PM   #62
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 621
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danmar View Post
That's sounds reasonble but will you still do this once your are retired and spending the money that you saved being frugal? That is, when does frugality and LBYM end? Or does it? Does it simply end up go to your heirs?
That's where safe withdrawal rate comes in. At that spending rate, in the worst case (subject to some assumptions, of course), you're living at your means, and in most cases you're living below your means.

How much one spends in retirement vs when w*rking varies. In my case, I pulled the plug when I could safely spend what I had been spending.
__________________

__________________
Which Roger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 03:56 PM   #63
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,891
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danmar View Post
That's sounds reasonable but will you still do this once your are retired and spending the money that you saved being frugal? That is, when does frugality and LBYM end? Or does it? Does it simply end up go to your heirs?
If I knew when and how I'd die it would be a lot easier. I might just not wake up some morning or I might spend years in an Alzheimer's facility before I finally cash it in. So, in retirement I continue to be frugal. If I go easy and cheap someone gets an inheritance. If I go slow and expensive, it doesn't bankrupt my wife and I have a humane ending.
__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 04:31 PM   #64
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,146
Agree with last two posts. If I may summarize: " Intend to live at my means but keep a fairly good cushion just in case". That is my approach as well.
__________________
Danmar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 04:35 PM   #65
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 402
I guess I'm just an old reincarnated soul, so it's second nature not to waste things. Being frugal means not to waste resources or use more than needed. Early on in my life, I read a Zen Koan - "One day a monk disciple was trying to throw used bathwater away, and his Master told him - why are you wasting water ? You see the plants out there - they need that water. Don't waste a single drop." Why waste food when many people are hungry, why waste electricity when it pollutes the environment to generate power, why waste used water when plants need it. My wife tells me 'why eat out, when they are pumping hormones on those GMO food. It's cheaper to cook organic food at home'. We do eat out maybe 3x a month, but not much. We know someone who inherited $150,000 and he used that money to eat out everyday until it was gone. He literally ate his inheritance.
__________________
No to consumerism, Living a simple life, enjoying the experience - not the material stuff
cyber888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 05:06 PM   #66
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 331
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danmar View Post
That's sounds reasonble but will you still do this once your are retired and spending the money that you saved being frugal? That is, when does frugality and LBYM end? Or does it? Does it simply end up go to your heirs?

Short answer: yes
Long answer: I will most likely have way more than I need when I retire, so LBMyM will be inevitable. And even if I up my lifestyle to live at my means (unlikely), I still would probably do it in a frugal way. Like only upgrading to first class when it's a few hundred dollars more, not when it's $14,000 more (as was once offered to me). I can't imagine ever not being frugal. You can live a luxurious life and still be frugal.
__________________
FI by 2024 is offline   Reply With Quote
Why are you frugal?
Old 04-22-2016, 05:21 PM   #67
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
imoldernu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Peru
Posts: 4,616
Why are you frugal?

'Cuz' ... nothing to add. Y'all covered my answers quite well.
__________________
imoldernu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 05:30 PM   #68
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,385
I am frugal because I am not a billionaire


Sent from my iPhone using Early Retirement Forum
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 05:33 PM   #69
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 903
Quote:
Originally Posted by FI by 2024 View Post
There have been a few posts about the difference between frugality and LBYM. I think of it like this:

- LBYM is the fact that I can afford and budget for $5000 worth of travel each year, but I usually spend ~$3000 each year and put any remainder into investments early in January each year. That way I can afford even more vacations in retirement

- Frugality is picking the airfare that is $100 cheaper, the room that is $30 cheaper, and walking from the hotel to the museum instead of taking a cab when I'm on those vacations. That way I can afford extra trips on that same $3000
Guess that's proof I'm not frugal.

I'd rather pay more for a non-stop flight that fits my schedule. Also, a more expensive hotel that's on-site or closest to my planned destination to avoid having to rent a car (hate driving in unfamiliar areas) or take a cab. I find that saves me both time and frustration if not money. I may or may not spring for the suite with a Jacuzzi but the walkability factor is a big thing for me.

Granted, I'm willing to take less vacations (not like I have a lot of vacation time I can use anyway) as long as I can have them in relative comfort. I really am more homebody than adventurer.

Still, I reckon the fact that I'm saving 20-30% of gross (will be 30-40% after I receive some pay raises) qualifies me as LBYM even if I'm not exactly frugal.
__________________
hnzw_rui is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 05:41 PM   #70
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,690
I come by it honestly. Hereditary....Scots Presbyterian background. Brought up to focus on value as well as price.

Now retired I think I focus on value even more. Not because of income but because I now have the time to do it for many things, not just the larger ones. But on the plus side 'things' and clothing have never done much for me. Just has happy in my old Honda as I would be in a new bimmer.
__________________
brett is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 06:54 PM   #71
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
I am frugal because I am not a billionaire


Sent from my iPhone using Early Retirement Forum
Do you think you would need $1billion to not be frugal? Maybe $100million? Or $10million? Just wondering where your frugality threshold is? Or are you just joking?
__________________
Danmar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 06:58 PM   #72
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by brett View Post
I come by it honestly. Hereditary....Scots Presbyterian background. Brought up to focus on value as well as price.

Just has happy in my old Honda as I would be in a new bimmer.
Or more appropriately a new fully loaded F150 ( as discussed in a previous auto thread).
__________________
Danmar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 07:04 PM   #73
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,423
If I had more money I might be even more frugal, if we define one's means as 3 or 3.5% WR.

How do I spend 3.5% of $100M each year? Or 3.5% of $1B? Society pressure would make me spend money on things I do not want to.

Good thing I do not have the above problem. It would drive me nuts.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 07:08 PM   #74
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
RobbieB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Central CA
Posts: 2,491
Never forget this old tale;

Once upon a time there was a Miser who used to hide his gold at the foot of a tree in his garden; but every week he used to go and dig it up and gloat over his gains. A robber, who had noticed this, went and dug up the gold and decamped with it. When the Miser next came to gloat over his treasures, he found nothing but the empty hole. He tore his hair, and raised such an outcry that all the neighbours came around him, and he told them how he used to come and visit his gold. "Did you ever take any of it out?" asked one of them.

"Nay," said he, "I only came to look at it."

"Then come again and look at the hole," said a neighbour; "it will do you just as much good."

Moral of Aesops Fable: Wealth unused might as well not exist
__________________
Retired at 59 in 2014. Should have done it sooner but I worried too much.
RobbieB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 07:10 PM   #75
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,423
Look at the hole? Nah, not unless I fill it with some fake gold coins.

Nowadays, we have no gold coins, not even paper money. And not even stock certificates. Just some numbers on the PC screen. It may be all in the matrix, for what we know.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 07:39 PM   #76
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by brett View Post
I come by it honestly. Hereditary....Scots Presbyterian background.
+1, to all of that including the Scots Presbyterian background.

I was brought up by Great Depression era parents, as well. My mother was such a penny-pincher that she wouldn't even buy fresh any vegetables because she might buy too many, and then some of them might spoil. That was a bit much for me, but most of what she did was sensible. She re-used EVERYTHING. I could go on. She was a sweetie and taught me a lot of useful life skills including how to live on very little and reuse things.

For most of my life I have been frugal, although I don't know that I fit into that category any more. I have been trying to loosen the purse strings a little in the past few years, and even bought a nicer house last year. Variety is the spice of life, or so I'm told.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 07:44 PM   #77
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 423
Well, I'm the son of educated immigrants from a 3rd world country. We joke that our native country's largest export is folks seeking their fortunes elsewhere.

My parents worked hard and smart here in the USA and gave me a good education, both college and the school of hard knocks. They taught me that to succeed I would have to do what most people couldn't or wouldn't do. They taught me about financial freedom and the sacrifices needed to get there. They taught that success was different from just stuff and "bling".

I am forever grateful. Thanks Mom and Dad!

FB
Class of 2015
__________________
Living the dream...
FreeBear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 07:46 PM   #78
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Dawg52's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Central MS/Orange Beach, AL
Posts: 7,438
Quote:
Originally Posted by W2R View Post
+1, to all of that including the Scots Presbyterian background.

I was brought up by Great Depression era parents, as well. My mother was such a penny-pincher that she wouldn't even buy fresh any vegetables because she might buy too many, and then some of them might spoil. That was a bit much for me, but most of what she did was sensible. She re-used EVERYTHING. I could go on. She was a sweetie and taught me a lot of useful life skills including how to live on very little and reuse things.

For most of my life I have been frugal, although I don't know that I fit into that category any more. I have been trying to loosen the purse strings a little in the past few years, and even bought a nicer house last year. Variety is the spice of life, or so I'm told.
Pretty much the same here. My parents were very frugal. I'm living large compared to them. Compared to other people......not so much.
__________________
Retired 3/31/2007@52
Full time wuss.......
Dawg52 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 08:11 PM   #79
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 182
It must be inherited. Both parents were Depression Era. There were seven kids in mom's family and dad was a street kid who quit school at 12 years old. Even though both were college educated professionals they were both extremely frugal. Always kept a strict budget and reused things until they fell apart.

I just back from a week in Ohio to move dad from his senior apartment to a special care unit. At almost 95 he still saved things he might need (paper clips, pens, small cans with lids, chop sticks, aluminum foil, etc.).
__________________
pjm-7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 09:24 PM   #80
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 18,282
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
I am frugal because I am not a billionaire
...


I am frugal because I want to become a billionaire, and then I will no longer have to be frugal!

More seriously, that's actually kind of true. I always saw being frugal (I'll define that as being careful to spend wisely, not necessarily depriving oneself in any great way), as a way to have more to spend in the future. Not just $ for $, but saving now helps provide leverage so you can spend more than the $ saved in the future.

Partially by investing and hopefully beating inflation in the long run, but also in many other ways. Having a great credit score means a lower mortgage rate, lower insurance. Having an emergency fund means being able to handle emergencies w/o doing something drastic (like sell the car you need to get to work). And having $ saved means one can take advantage of opportunities.

Living frugally can mean taking advantage of a company match in a 401k, etc. Over time, all these things add up in a big way.

And to the OP's question - I think it can be both or either. I've actually had people tell me they learned the value of frugal living from my example. DW and I have seemed to instilled it in our kids. But it might be something built into a person's DNA to some degree?

-ERD50
__________________

__________________
ERD50 is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Are you unnecessarily frugal? Midpack FIRE and Money 42 02-13-2010 03:45 PM
Are you frugal or a cheap b@$t@rd? Grizz FIRE and Money 108 09-29-2007 08:50 PM
How frugal is too frugal? setab FIRE and Money 36 05-18-2006 01:51 PM
Are you frugal or are you stingy? Martha Other topics 60 03-25-2006 03:30 PM
So, frugal people, what DO you allow yourselves? LRAO FIRE and Money 131 11-25-2005 01:21 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:22 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.