Why haven't I ever heard Psst...Wellington?

[Midpack]

Yes I realize they're different AA's and I'm not suggesting one is preferable over the other. But they appear to have similar investment philosophies, so I'm surprised I've never heard Pssst...Wellington. Surely some here have target AA's closer to Wellington than Wellesley, and less interest in dividend/income?

 

[FIREd]

My IRA is fully invested in Pssst...Wellington and has been for years. Wellesley seems to be more popular with retirees (higher income, more conservative allocation, less volatility) which may be why it is talked about so much around here.

 

[REWahoo]

Psst on you...

One of us has 75% of [-]my[/-] their portfolio invested in a mix of Wellesley and Wellington.

 

[easysurfer]

My HSA is fully invested in Pssst...Wellington.

 

[Bestwifeever]

Psst on you...

One of us has 75% of [-]my[/-] their portfolio invested in a mix of Wellesley and Wellington.

When we take SS in a couple of years we plan to put our remaining cash into Wellington to increase our equity level a bit. We had a big chunk of our pre-ER 401k in it but moved it all to money market when we rolled it over to an IRA while we figured out our retirement AA. Still trying to figure it out .

 

[Tyro]

Could it have anything to do with, as the graph shows, total return?

 

[Moemg]

I've had psst Wellington a long time before I added psst Wellesley !

 

[Midpack]

Could it have anything to do with, as the graph shows, total return?

Good catch.

Edit: I removed the graph since while true, it was not representative of the expected long term relative returns.
Translation: My bad...

 

[REWahoo]

Good catch.

Edit: I removed the graph since while true, it was not representative of the expected long term relative returns.
Translation: My bad...

I think it would be interesting to show the same graph and include the S&P 500 for comparison.

 

[aaronc879]

Wellesley is my most aggressive investment. Wellington is quite a bit more volatile. Even Wellesley's ~33% equity allocation is a little high for my tastes but it's worked out well so far.

 

[ERD50]

I think it would be interesting to show the same graph and include the S&P 500 for comparison.

Here's a performance chart you can play with - looks like it goes back ~ 12 years.

PerfCharts - StockCharts.com - Free Charts

-ERD50

 

[potto0213]

I'll hazard a guess and say that it might be because many people ask how they can generate the "magical" 4% return for ER and Wellesley fits that particular requirement better than Wellington.

 

[pb4uski]

I think it would be interesting to show the same graph and include the S&P 500 for comparison.

How's this? Value of $10k over 10 years in Wellington, SPX 500 index fund and Welesley - all Admiral shares.

It is interesting to me that wellington and SPX were hovering on top of each other for about 5 years until the stuff hit the fan and the pattern since Oct 08 is very similar.

 

[REWahoo]

How's this? Value of $10k over 10 years in Wellington, SPX 500 index fund and Welesley - all Admiral shares.

+1

Now, please post a chart showing 2013 through 2022.

 

[ducky911]

+1

Now, please post a chart showing 2013 through 2022.

Yes, i would like that chart also.

thanks

bob

 

[mathjak107]

the big test for wellesly will be when rates rise. being chock full of bonds wellesly had the wind at its back and a 30 year bull market in bonds to keep it humming.

those same bonds may be a big weight in the near future.

 

[Midpack]

+1

Now, please post a chart showing 2013 through 2022.

Here you go, you know how read it I assume...

 

[REWahoo]

those same bonds may be a big weight in the near future.

The operative terms being 'may' and 'near' future.

Average duration of Wellesley bonds is 6.2 years. If they take a hit due to increasing rates in I think I can hold on until the fund recovers.

 

[ejman]

+1

Now, please post a chart showing 2013 through 2022.

Not a problem. I'll be happy to post that for you on 1/1/2023 (If I'm still around to do so...)

 

[LakeTravis]

I remember the first time I checked into Wellington, looked back at it's history since inception. That's a long track record of solid performance.

Then I checked out Wellesley. I've pretty much decided our simple investmant plan would be the majority of our after-tax investment portfolio in Wellington and the IRA's in Wellesley.

Plan is to initially draw down on the Wellington over the first 14-16 years of FIRE, allowing the Wellesley to continue to grow before switching over to distributions from it year 15-17 until the end.

 

[ejman]

I remember the first time I checked into Wellington, looked back at it's history since inception. That's a long track record of solid performance.

Then I checked out Wellesley. I've pretty much decided our simple investmant plan would be the majority of our after-tax investment portfolio in Wellington and the IRA's in Wellesley.

Plan is to initially draw down on the Wellington over the first 14-16 years of FIRE, allowing the Wellesley to continue to grow before switching over to distributions from it year 15-17 until the end.

When I look at the performance of my portfolio over the last 25 years (multiple funds and fund families -buying, selling, exchanging, slicing and dicing) vs just Wellington/Wellesley - I could have bought just those two, gone to sleep, avoided all the drama and come out just as well if not better. Now Wellsi/Welltn is 40% of my retirement nut and it keeps inching up. Maybe when I'm at the dribble on my shirt stage those two will serve as my pretend annuity.

 

[pb4uski]

the big test for wellesly will be when rates rise. being chock full of bonds wellesly had the wind at its back and a 30 year bull market in bonds to keep it humming.

those same bonds may be a big weight in the near future.

Probably not. If interest rates rise the most likely cause would be an economic recovery. If that was the case, then the drop in bonds caused by higher interest rates might be offset by increases in the equity portfolio.

 

[mathjak107]

thats what we would hope but its still going to be tough going . with the average historical average rates around 6-7% that can represent a big drop on the bond side possibly.

even though rates will be increasing in the fund your always behind the curve.

while duration makes everything okay in treasuries if you stay long enough thats not true in corporate or high yield bonds.

the ever changing credit ratings these bonds have are the wild card that can un-do higher rates on the bonds as the fund sells and buys.

there is no doubt that would make wellesley not have the performance we are all used to seeing.

im not saying it wont have a positve return. i am saying more then ever the past will not represent the future in balanced funds.


the effect of their first bear bond market is going to be felt for the first time in 30 years to many retirees as well as investors .

this could spur an exodus out of bond funds sinking prices further on bonds.

all those retirees in those target funds that reached the income stage are going to see a dip in their funds value and never realized that could happen and like always many will panic and flee.

 

[Tyro]

Good catch.

Edit: I removed the graph since while true, it was not representative of the expected long term relative returns.
Translation: My bad...

I'm sorry, but I'm not following you. Would you mind explaining that as if to... a tyro?

 

[eytonxav]

I have been in both for quite some time