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Old 03-25-2010, 08:10 AM   #81
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I can't follow this back to the lead-in post. What is the typo? This bill has always been portrayed as costing close to $1T in the first decade. Thus the regular contrast with the Bush $1T tax cut deficit that non of the health care deficit hawks seems to get crazy about. The $1.2T savings allegedly comes in the second decade as cost cutting impact takes hold.
The links were updated by KFF with new summaries. Texas Proud found one of the summaries had omitted the word "Billions" in a sentence about the cost of the program. I suspect few people came to the wrong conclusion about the total cost...
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Old 03-25-2010, 08:12 AM   #82
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There is an updated summary here http://www.kff.org/healthreform/uplo...bill_final.pdf

It still compares the law with the senate and house versions - not sure why - but it is more detailed and written to be understood.
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Old 03-25-2010, 08:17 AM   #83
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Well, the way our legal system works, you can call anything unconstitutional and attempt to sue based on that. Health insurance is actually already mandated in a number of states by state law, and most states have some form of mandatory insurance (such as auto), so...I wouldn't jump to the conclusion it is likely unconstitutional just because it is mandatory, that is quite a reach.
The exception being that driving is a privlige - not a right. You don't have to drive (if you have alternative means, such as living in a city with good public transportation).

However, this is a bit different (that's all I'll say )...
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Old 03-25-2010, 08:58 AM   #84
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I can't follow this back to the lead-in post. What is the typo? This bill has always been portrayed as costing close to $1T in the first decade.
I see the answer has been provided and the text corrected for this, but on your other comment... (underline mine):

Quote:
Thus the regular contrast with the Bush $1T tax cut deficit that non of the health care deficit hawks seems to get crazy about.
Maybe because this is 2010, not 2003? I know many conservatives who voiced disapproval of the cut-and-spend approach of that admin. George Will conservative enough for you?

A Questionable Kind Of Conservatism (washingtonpost.com)

It is just FYI, I'm not going to pull out any quotes as they are not relevant to this thread. But you might find it interesting reading. Now, back to:


Will the new healthcare law make it easier for me to retire early?

-ERD50
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Old 03-25-2010, 09:12 AM   #85
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And I thought this was gonna be the first health-care threat without delving into partisan politics. Shows you what I know ...
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Old 03-25-2010, 09:16 AM   #86
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Nope, quite the opposite. I am very personally acquainted with Avastin and how such modern cancer drugs are priced.

Audrey
Then your comment makes no sense..............
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Old 03-25-2010, 09:20 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by donheff View Post
I can't follow this back to the lead-in post. What is the typo? This bill has always been portrayed as costing close to $1T in the first decade. Thus the regular contrast with the Bush $1T tax cut deficit that non of the health care deficit hawks seems to get crazy about. The $1.2T savings allegedly comes in the second decade as cost cutting impact takes hold.
So, it cost almost a trillion in the first decade, and supposedly saves $1 trillion in the next decade. Taking that at face value, there's no real saving and deficit reduction at all, correct?
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Old 03-25-2010, 09:31 AM   #88
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So, it cost almost a trillion in the first decade, and supposedly saves $1 trillion in the next decade. Taking that at face value, there's no real saving and deficit reduction at all, correct?
So, by that reasoning we have covered 30 million people and killed off pre-existing conditions and rescissions for nothing-- pretty good result
It's actually $1.2T so there is some projected savings. But, like many who oppose the bill, I expect that it will cost significantly more when the dust settles. Nevertheless, covering 30+ million is worth some investment.
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Old 03-25-2010, 09:40 AM   #89
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Does anyone happen to know if a conversion to a Roth IRA is currently considered to be income for the purposes of Medicaid or other government benefits? I've googled on this for almost an hour now and can't find anything.
I have seen references to AGI as the determining factor for government benefits. Roth Transfers do figure into AGI, so my guess is yes - transfers will be treated as income.

This should not be surprising since you are paying income taxes on T-IRA to ROTH-IRA transfers.
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Asset test and Medicaid
Old 03-25-2010, 10:07 AM   #90
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Asset test and Medicaid

Hi all:

I did more research and and found out that most states do not have asset test for Medicaid and CHIP eligibility. California for example do not asset test.

Can anyone confirm this?
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Old 03-25-2010, 10:09 AM   #91
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So, by that reasoning we have covered 30 million people and killed off pre-existing conditions and rescissions for nothing-- pretty good result
It's actually $1.2T so there is some projected savings. But, like many who oppose the bill, I expect that it will cost significantly more when the dust settles. Nevertheless, covering 30+ million is worth some investment.
Even the CBO can't provide a good estimate because the cost of the "fixes" during reconciliation will undoutedly raise the number. I heard yesterday one of the "fixes" was to allow pre-existing conditions for CHILDREN, apparently the House bill only had pre-existing conditions for adults?? Talk about confusing.....

I wish President Obama and everyone would NOT talk about COST SAVINGS because it looks like there won't be any.......

Does the bill say what the basis of coverage is, whether you have to be an American citizen or anyone can get it?
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Old 03-25-2010, 10:34 AM   #92
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Will the new healthcare law make it easier for me to retire early?

Back on topic!

I was thinking this could help those wanting to semi-FIRE by going part time at their current employer or finding a new part time gig. Your income may drop down low enough such that you get subsidized health insurance for cheap, and you can tell your employer that they don't need to provide health insurance for you.

From a cost perspective, an employer would not want to pay for a whole health insurance policy for someone working 20 hrs a week as much as they would someone working 40+ hrs per week because, on a per hour basis, the employer is paying more for the part time employee's health insurance (at least from my consulting firm's eyes).

But then I recall there is a provision in the bill that penalizes employers if an employee doesn't receive company coverage and gets subsidized coverage. So maybe it isn't realistic to expect to walk into an employer and proudly proclaim "you can save money on me as a part time employee because I don't care if you give me health insurance". Unless the employer is a small company under 50 employees.

I can foresee a lot of gamesmanship with employers trying to be flexible with employees and their health insurance choices, while trying to get employees to not make choices that stick the employer with a big tax penalty/fine. Maybe the 1099 contractor will become a more favored employment relationship vs the standard W2 employment.
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Old 03-25-2010, 10:46 AM   #93
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Maybe the 1099 contractor will become a more favored employment relationship vs the standard W2 employment.
I have been a 1099 employee for some time now, and it IS the best way to go...........
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Old 03-25-2010, 10:48 AM   #94
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I can't follow this back to the lead-in post. What is the typo? This bill has always been portrayed as costing close to $1T in the first decade. Thus the regular contrast with the Bush $1T tax cut deficit that non of the health care deficit hawks seems to get crazy about. The $1.2T savings allegedly comes in the second decade as cost cutting impact takes hold.

The article said $938 DOLLARS... not BILLIONS OF DOLLARS...
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Old 03-25-2010, 10:58 AM   #95
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Note: here's a simple subsidy calculator on kaiser's web site...

Health Reform Subsidy Calculator -- Premium Assistance for Coverage in Exchanges/Gateways
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Old 03-25-2010, 11:06 AM   #96
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Does the bill say what the basis of coverage is, whether you have to be an American citizen or anyone can get it?
Repeated references to American citizen or legal resident.

Quote:
I did more research and and found out that most states do not have asset test for Medicaid and CHIP eligibility. California for example do not asset test.

Can anyone confirm this?
Every state has asset eligibility requirements for Medicaid and they are quite strict.

Quote:
The article said $938 DOLLARS... not BILLIONS OF DOLLARS...
Technically, on page one it says $938 dollars and on page three it reads says $938 billions. Still, good find.
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Old 03-25-2010, 11:47 AM   #97
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I second this. Having worked in the actuarial profession for 23 years (specializing in personal auto insurance) before I retired in 2008 at age 45, I do plan to chime in soon on this thread. I have a long, busy day ahead tomorrow so it will have to wait until Friday.

Keep on posting here, everyone. I am finding this a great read in the meantime.
I'll third this and also say that I'm so happy to see that politics has rarely entered in, thus keeping it a useful thread.
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Old 03-25-2010, 01:06 PM   #98
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Are pensions considered income? Roth distributions? It may be worth skipping the Roth IRA if it could be used in the future to reduce future health care benefits.
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Old 03-25-2010, 02:15 PM   #99
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I'll third this and also say that I'm so happy to see that politics has rarely entered in, thus keeping it a useful thread.
Agreed. Let's keep politics out of this thread if we can.
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Old 03-25-2010, 02:44 PM   #100
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Technically, on page one it says $938 dollars and on page three it reads says $938 billions. Still, good find.
That is why I actually copied the exact quote... like most others, I had put the billion in on my own.. but thought... that looks funny....
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