WSJ: A Retirement Wealth Gap Adds a New Indignity to Old Age

[Fedup]

We don't have a HOA but the current housing prices in California combined with Prop 13 make for some eclectic neighbor mixes. We have elderly residents in our neighborhood in homes with peeling paint, falling down fences and dead lawns next to yuppie families with remodeled houses, manicured lawns and a Tesla and BMW in the driveway.

Somebody started a neighborhood group asking for volunteers to clean houses and do errands for the low income, elderly homeowners, which seemed a bit odd to me since these people are sitting on expensive real estate, while there are so many homeless in the area that literally don't have roofs over their heads and need help much more. The cash poor elderly in the expensive homes can either move or get a reverse mortgage and pay for all the help they need.

Why is it a problem helping seniors. Why comparing them to homeless people. I’ve already helped my neighbors regardless of whether they are rich or poor. But I think seniors even deserving more help regardless of their equity.

 

[redduck]

Existing... but the point is that common facilities benefit all members, even members that don't use them.

A key is what buyers in that market expect for common facilities... in our area a pool is expected.

Thanks. OK, I'll kick in to maintain a pool that already exists.
I'd also vote for new chairs to replace the 16 year old chairs (not your post).

But, I would strongly object to putting in a pickle ball court (with or without bleachers) or buying a golf course (not your post). I would also object to putting in a swimming pool (not your post).

 

[redduck]

We don't have a HOA but the current housing prices in California combined with Prop 13 make for some eclectic neighbor mixes. We have elderly residents in our neighborhood in homes with peeling paint, falling down fences and dead lawns next to yuppie families with remodeled houses, manicured lawns and a Tesla and BMW in the driveway.

Somebody started a neighborhood group asking for volunteers to clean houses and do errands for the low income, elderly homeowners, which seemed a bit odd to me since these people are sitting on expensive real estate, while there are so many homeless in the area that literally don't have roofs over their heads and need help much more. The cash poor elderly in the expensive homes can either move or get a reverse mortgage and pay for all the help they need.

Yeah, that might be us in a few years. Except we can't figure out how moving or getting a reverse mortgage will help the homeless.

 

[HI Bill]

The cash poor elderly in the expensive homes can either move or get a reverse mortgage and pay for all the help they need.

Who was there first? The cash poor elderly may have health problems, and they may have been there longer than the new buyers have been alive. When you're in your 80s, house maintenance may not be important, or even possible.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Yeah, that might be us in a few years. Except we can't figure out how moving or getting a reverse mortgage will help the homeless.

My point is someone asked me to clean houses for free for people I don't know who are living in large, seven figure homes. I would rather spend my volunteer time or money to help the truly needy, not people sitting on $1M plus in assets. Of all the charities in our area asking for time or money, millionaires are pretty low on my list for charitable giving. YMMV.


Our city already has free lunches, door to door transportation, discount produce, a nice senior center, with all sorts of activities and social services for seniors paid for with tax dollars.

 

[Jeffman52]

I frequently drive past a prime example of this and may stop some day and take a photo to post. Someone built and sold five very nice houses in a rural area - no zoning, no HOA. Four of the houses are attractive and well maintained but the middle of the five is an absolute disaster area with old cars, piles of junk and a yard that has never seen a mower.

Bet those four neighbors wished they had a HOA.

I escaped from an area like that. Nice 250K - 350K houses but so few would do upkeep. Yards a mess. My neighbor had 7 or 8 cars in the yard in various states of disrepair. Foot tall grass (I use that term loosely) in some yards. They mow 3 times a year whether it needs it or not. When I moved there it was an unfinished area. Houses were built and people moved in that just had no idea how to take care of a house and property.

I was lucky to break even when I sold although I took a beating on the improvements I had done to the property. (Outbuilding, irrigation, sod, landscaping, etc etc) due to the value increasing over the time I was there. The new house I bought, the cost was not so different but the neighborhood upgrade was obvious. I wont make that mistake ever again.

 

[Fedup]

My point is someone asked me to clean houses for free for people I don't know who are living in large, seven figure homes. I would rather spend my volunteer time or money to help the truly needy, not people sitting on $1M plus in assets. Of all the charities in our area asking for time or money, millionaires are pretty low on my list for charitable giving. YMMV.

I can say the same thing except it will be with ACA subsidy. I rather help the truly needy one versus the one with large equity in the most expensive area in the country. What do you think about that?

 

[pb4uski]

Thanks. OK, I'll kick in to maintain a pool that already exists.
I'd also vote for new chairs to replace the 16 year old chairs (not your post).

But, I would strongly object to putting in a pickle ball court (with or without bleachers) or buying a golf course (not your post). I would also object to putting in a swimming pool (not your post).

In most associations, if the majority decided to add that pickleball court or golf course or whatever then object all you want, but you will be charged for it like everyone else... if you don't like it then you can move. I have no problem with that.

 

[Fedup]

In most associations, if the majority decided to add that pickleball court or golf course or whatever then you will be charged... if you don't like it then you can move. i have no problem with that.

You can’t expect seniors to move. It’s easier said then done.

 

[pb4uski]

The reality is that there is that they have no choice... they can stay and pay, or stay and not pay and create a lien on the property, or move... there are no other choices and they certainly do not get preferential treatment. Sorry.

 

[redduck]

In most associations, if the majority decided to add that pickleball court or golf course or whatever then object all you want, but you will be charged for it like everyone else... if you don't like it then you can move. i have no problem with that.

You mean that you'd trade me for a pickle ball court?

 

[Fedup]

The reality is that there is that they have no choice... they can stay and pay, or stay and not pay and create a lien on the property, or move... there are no other choices and they certainly do not get preferential treatment. Sorry.

I always like your posting, but in this case, I have to disagree. It’s like putting a gun to my head and say, pay up or else.

 

[pb4uski]

You mean that you'd trade me for a pickle ball court?

Yes, but reluctantly.

 

[pb4uski]

I always like your posting, but in this case, I have to disagree. It’s like putting a gun to my head and say, pay up or else.

It isn't an opinion... it is just the way things work.... majority rule is one of the aspects of belonging to a condo or HOA... why some people don't like them.

 

[Fedup]

It isn't an opinion... it is just the way things work.... majority rule is one of the aspects of belonging to a condo or HOA... why some people don't like them.

Thanks goodnes, I have a very large homeowners in my association. Spread out the cost.

 

[MichaelB]

It isn't an opinion... it is just the way things work.... majority rule is one of the aspects of belonging to a condo or HOA... why some people don't like them.

I think you need to see the bylaws before reaching that conclusion. The HOA can probably carry out extensive repair and maintenance with no vote by the community, but capital additions may require a separate and more rigorous approval process.

 

[redduck]

The reality is that there is that they have no choice... they can stay and pay, or stay and not pay and create a lien on the property, or move... there are no other choices and they certainly do not get preferential treatment. Sorry.

OK, suppose you live in a small, but extremely luxurious community. You can afford it but you are living a bit above your means--partially due to your laxness in rebalancing your portfolio.(You should have listened to audreyh1). But, you and your wife think it's worth it as family is close by (children and grandchildren). Then several ridiculously wealthy families (worth many 100M's move into the community and buy properties for themselves and for their relatives. Then they decide that the community needs an airplane. They win the vote. You can't afford it. Your wife can't stop crying. Do you simply move out after living there 16 years? Do you counter with the idea of putting in a pickle ball court (with bleachers) in lieu of the jet plane?

 

[redduck]

Yes, but reluctantly.

Thanks. I appreciate the love.

 

[redduck]

We don't have a HOA but the current housing prices in California combined with Prop 13 make for some eclectic neighbor mixes. We have elderly residents in our neighborhood in homes with peeling paint, falling down fences and dead lawns next to yuppie families with remodeled houses, manicured lawns and a Tesla and BMW in the driveway.

So you're saying that elderly homeowners should take out a reverse mortgage or move because their neighbors have a Tesla and a BMW in the driveway? Do you even understand this? And besides, what are those cars doing in the driveway anyhow, shouldn't they be in the garage?

emphasis by redduck

My point is someone asked me to clean houses for free for people I don't know who are living in large, seven figure homes. I would rather spend my volunteer time or money to help the truly needy, not people sitting on $1M plus in assets. Of all the charities in our area asking for time or money, millionaires are pretty low on my list for charitable giving. YMMV.

OK, I get it now. Somebody started a volunteer group to clean homes and run errands for the elderly. Since this sort of volunteer work is low on your list, you became incensed with the idea and decided the elderly should take out reverse mortgages or move.

 

[pb4uski]

I think you need to see the bylaws before reaching that conclusion. The HOA can probably carry out extensive repair and maintenance with no vote by the community, but capital additions may require a separate and more rigorous approval process.

Agreed... in the case of our association, material alterations (aka capital additions) in excess of $10k a year only require a majority vote, and I believe that is fairly common... though if the documents are silent then 75% is required (under Florida law).

 

[pb4uski]

OK, suppose you live in a small, but extremely luxurious community. You can afford it but you are living a bit above your means--partially due to your laxness in rebalancing your portfolio.(You should have listened to audreyh1). But, you and your wife think it's worth it as family is close by (children and grandchildren). Then several ridiculously wealthy families (worth many 100M's move into the community and buy properties for themselves and for their relatives. Then they decide that the community needs an airplane. They win the vote. You can't afford it. Your wife can't stop crying. Do you simply move out after living there 16 years? Do you counter with the idea of putting in a pickle ball court (with bleachers) in lieu of the jet plane?

If they win the vote then my choices are to 1) pay up, 2) not pay up and accept a lien on the property or whatever other remedies exist in contract or law or 3) sell and move or 4) get a reverse mortgage to make the payments (which is similar to 2).

The offsetting thing is that if there are buyers out their who appreciate having access to an airplane through the condo association then I might be able to get top dollar for my property.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

"So you're saying that elderly homeowners should take out a reverse mortgage or move because their neighbors have a Tesla and a BMW in the driveway? Do you even understand this? And besides, what are those cars doing in the driveway anyhow, shouldn't they be in the garage?"


I didn't post that, you added that to a post I did make and I am not sure what it even means.

 

[Music Lover]

The offsetting thing is that if there are buyers out their who appreciate having access to an airplane through the condo association then I might be able to get top dollar for my property.

Or, there may not be enough buyers who want that because perhaps a few blocks away they can have a similar place that has a third of the HOA fees because it doesn't have to maintain a plane. So, instead of an increase in property value there is a decrease.

 

[Retch The Grate]

So you're saying that elderly homeowners should take out a reverse mortgage or move because their neighbors have a Tesla and a BMW in the driveway? Do you even understand this? And besides, what are those cars doing in the driveway anyhow, shouldn't they be in the garage?

No, California was specified as the location. We don't keep cars in garages here, the weather is mild, cars stay outside, garages are precious precious storage space.

 

[pb4uski]

"So you're saying that elderly homeowners should take out a reverse mortgage or move because their neighbors have a Tesla and a BMW in the driveway? Do you even understand this? And besides, what are those cars doing in the driveway anyhow, shouldn't they be in the garage?"


I didn't post that, you added that to a post I did make and I am not sure what it even means.

^^^ agreed... not sure where bolded part cam from... might have been redduck's comment and he mistakenly put it in the quoted part.