WSJ article - Variable Annuities were a good investment

[ERD50]

So can we add another notch to the gunbelt on this one, or is our EIA-shill-of-the-month still at it?

I think we should add a topic to the Early Retirement FAQs - "Threads with wild promises of fame and fortune that turned out to be made by self-promoting salespeople who underestimated the combined experience and knowledge of this forum".


BTW, excellent thread by you that REWhoo referenced:

http://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f28/how-to-replicate-an-equity-indexed-annuity-eia-34656.html

I understand the concepts, but this was a great breakdown of the mechanics. I saved it to my hard drive this time (just for reference and understanding - I wouldn't do it either ). Nice work.


-ERD50

 

[audreyh1]

Hey - did a post disappear? The "real life example"?

Audrey

 

[REWahoo]

Hey - did a post disappear?

Our policy is to not comment on specific moderator actions. However, I will point out we have a "take no prisoners" policy when it comes to spam, including the immediate deletion of posts and termination of forum membership.

 

[Nords]

Hey - did a post disappear? The "real life example"?

Our policy is to not comment on specific moderator actions.

If you really want to know all the grisly details of the story's brutally merciless conclusion, then you have to volunteer to be a moderator!

 

[brewer12345]

Well, maybe our salescritter will try again without the spam...

 

[brewer12345]

But you get the advertised protections and gains?

Generally yes, with two caveats. One is the aforementioned surrender penalty. The second is the nasty tax treatment that annuities get when you cash them in, especially if you are under 59.5 YO.

All this assumes the carrier doesn't go bust.

 

[kaneohe]

Generally yes, with two caveats. One is the aforementioned surrender penalty. The second is the nasty tax treatment that annuities get when you cash them in, especially if you are under 59.5 YO.

All this assumes the carrier doesn't go bust.

Thanks, brewer. Reason I asked was I thought at least some of these things get preferred treatment......but only if you annuitize. Maybe I'm mixing up
the floor and participation guarantees w/ an additional annual return guarantee.

 

[Independent]

Our policy is to not comment on specific moderator actions. However, I will point out we have a "take no prisoners" policy when it comes to spam, including the immediate deletion of posts and termination of forum membership.

I feel somewhat responsible for this because I was the one who encouraged him to back up his general statements about the value of EIA's with real numbers. I figure EIAs are an appealing concept, but that they usually fall down when you look at the hard numbers. (In fact, the reference to perpetual motion is pretty relevant.)

Maybe you can say something in general about about "spam".

Is describing and pointing out the pros a specific product (and not giving equal time to the cons) unacceptable "spam"? Or, does it become spam when you are simply cutting and pasting sales material? Or, only when you're dumping sales material into an unrelated thread?

 

[kaneohe]

I feel somewhat responsible for this because I was the one who encouraged him to back up his general statements about the value of EIA's with real numbers. I figure EIAs are an appealing concept, but that they usually fall down when you look at the hard numbers. (In fact, the reference to perpetual motion is pretty relevant.)

Independent......I'm w/ you. It would have been interesting to have seen the claims and then a point by point critique. I think it would have been educational.

 

[FUEGO]

I feel somewhat responsible for this because I was the one who encouraged him to back up his general statements about the value of EIA's with real numbers. I figure EIAs are an appealing concept, but that they usually fall down when you look at the hard numbers. (In fact, the reference to perpetual motion is pretty relevant.)

Maybe you can say something in general about about "spam".

Is describing and pointing out the pros a specific product (and not giving equal time to the cons) unacceptable "spam"? Or, does it become spam when you are simply cutting and pasting sales material? Or, only when you're dumping sales material into an unrelated thread?

I'm not a moderator so I'm bound by no requirements to not discuss anything. The annuity salesman posted his email address and asked for individuals to contact him about annuities. That is most likely the issue with him posting here. I think our community rules say something like "no soliciting". Especially by annuity salesmen.

 

[ERD50]

Independent......I'm w/ you. It would have been interesting to have seen the claims and then a point by point critique. I think it would have been educational.

Yes, sunlight is the best disinfectant.

A critique could be posted in the FAQ section, and the next time a salescritter comes calling, we could point them to the trail of bones....

I saw the post before it was deleted, it was clearly a solicitation for business (surprise!), and therefore in violation of the rules, so I'd guess that is why it was deleted. But most people would not know that. Kinda leaves everyone hanging.

-ERD50

 

[REWahoo]

Maybe you can say something in general about about "spam".

Is describing and pointing out the pros a specific product (and not giving equal time to the cons) unacceptable "spam"? Or, does it become spam when you are simply cutting and pasting sales material? Or, only when you're dumping sales material into an unrelated thread?

As others have mentioned, spam is using the forum to solicit business, something clearly prohibited by our Community Rules. Including links to commercial websites and/or posting email addresses where members can go for "more information" are two examples.

The most obvious form of spam activity on the forum is of the "Cheap Nike Shoes!" variety. More subtle, yet equally short-lived, is "comment spam" where a (usually new) member posts short, innocuous "nice post" comments and includes a link to a commercial site at the bottom of the post. Occasionally a new poster appears to be straightforward, but begins to migrate the conversation to a particular subject where they provide - as a simple courtesy of course - an email address or link where you can go to find more information.

The first two types of spammers are usually dispatched within a few minutes (seconds?) of appearing as the membership reports them to the moderators using the Report Post button.

The last type often lasts longer and sometimes leaves a lingering aftertaste...

 

[Rich_by_the_Bay]

REW has a genetic abnormality called Spam-Dar. I know from my days as an administrator here that one is well advised not to question him when the spam antenna starts sizzling.

I got decent at it by the time I stepped down, but he takes it to a whole other level which no mere mortal can approach.

 

[REWahoo]

REW has a genetic abnormality...

I thought that was considered PHI under HIPPA...

Actually I don't believe it is genetic. All our mods have the ability to [-]smell[/-] spot a spammer a mile away - even in the dim light of a computer monitor.

 

[yakers]

REW has a genetic abnormality called Spam-Dar. I know from my days as an administrator here that one is well advised not to question him when the spam antenna starts sizzling.

I got decent at it by the time I stepped down, but he takes it to a whole other level which no mere mortal can approach.

True, but as Ha said, 'we (on this board) can take care of ourselves'. Haven't seen too many kayak or pancake bunny posting lately, I was just getting ready to ask for some kayak financial advice but was too slow.

Now to keep things clean for the newer or less sophisticated folks , the moderators do a good job (IMHO) of filtering out inappropriate posts while still letting things run fairly freely.

 

[Independent]

As others have mentioned, spam is using the forum to solicit business, something clearly prohibited by our Community Rules. Including links to commercial websites and/or posting email addresses where members can go for "more information" are two examples.

The most obvious form of spam activity on the forum is of the "Cheap Nike Shoes!" variety. More subtle, yet equally short-lived, is "comment spam" where a (usually new) member posts short, innocuous "nice post" comments and includes a link to a commercial site at the bottom of the post. Occasionally a new poster appears to be straightforward, but begins to migrate the conversation to a particular subject where they provide - as a simple courtesy of course - an email address or link where you can go to find more information.

The first two types of spammers are usually dispatched within a few minutes (seconds?) of appearing as the membership reports them to the moderators using the Report Post button.

The last type often lasts longer and sometimes leaves a lingering aftertaste...

Thanks. That's a line I can understand.