You're lucky you are able to retire early because....

[Chuckanut]

Well, I am not so early as many of you folks, but I am earlier than many of my peers who are going all the way to 66 when they can get full SS benefits and no deduction on their pension for retiring early. What did I do wrong? OH, a career switch that caused me to drop to the bottom of my pay scale. Two kids who soaked up money. And an ex wife who took off with half of the assets we planned to use for ER.

[youbet]

Quote:

Originally Posted by W2R Actually I have never seen any "typical description" of what early retirement is on this board. It varies all over the place. Perhaps more than any other description, I have heard that retiring before SS full retirement age (66 for many of us) implies early retirement. Many of us, like me, REWahoo, Rich_in_Tampa, and many others retired in their 60's and oddly, I'm not aware of any of us who feels like we failed in doing so.

I'm going by both the descriptions of board participants and by the description of RE in the FireCalc introduction which refers to it as retiring before pensions and SS are normally available. Hence, the need to accumulate a Fire portfolio of investments used to fund life without income form w*rk. FireCalc is useful for testing the survivability, historically, of a RE scenario given a portfolio and a time frame.

Where in my post did you see a reference to you, REWahoo or Rich_in_Tampa? Are you reading something into my post that isn't there?

[Chuckanut]

Quote:

Originally Posted by W2R Actually I have never seen any "typical description" of what early retirement is on this board. It varies all over the place. Perhaps more than any other description, I have heard that retiring before SS full retirement age (66 for many of us) implies early retirement. But still, I would not say this definition is typical any more than any other. Many of us including some of our oldest and most often posting members retired in their 60's and oddly, I'm not aware of any who feel they somehow failed in doing so.

I would say it is fair to use the SS age of ER (before 66 for mosty of us) and/or the age at which the pension(if one has a pension) does not get reduced for retiring early. Or maybe it should be the age where you get discounted National Park pass??

[W2R]

Quote:

Originally Posted by youbet I don't know what exact age you'll finally retire at Chuckanut, but I'm guessing you've failed to check out of the working world as an early retiree and are perhaps in your 60's and still working. Since you've failed, by the typical description of "early retirement" on this board,

Quote:

Originally Posted by youbet I'm going by both the descriptions of board participants

Which I think anyone would agree are all over the place;

Quote:

Originally Posted by youbet and by the description of RE in the FireCalc introduction which refers to it as retiring before pensions and SS are normally available.

Right, in one's mid 60's, as far as the model is concerned.

[youbet]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuckanut What did I do wrong? OH, a career switch that caused me to drop to the bottom of my pay scale. Two kids who soaked up money. And an ex wife who took off with half of the assets we planned to use for ER.

Hey, you didn't necessarily do anything "wrong." You just had life circumstances that prevented you from hitting the goal. (I'm assuming that your participation on this board means your target was RE as opposed to normal retirement.)

In your case, I guess this kind of stuff just caused you to miss RE. For others, similar things are causing them to miss even the "normal retirement" target. Sh*t happens as they say.

I've often reflected on my decisions which caused me to stay hitched to the plow until 58. No real regrets here. There were some investment decisions I'd like to have another go-around with. And a career move or two that could have been orchestrated more advantageously. But again, sh*t happens.

I'm sure you have items you'd like to go back and improve on so perhaps you could cut the apron strings from wo*k despite your unavoidable life issues. We all do.

[mickeyd]

Quote:

lucky you are able to retire

Luck has nothing to do with it.

[youbet]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mickeyd Luck has nothing to do with it.

While I generally agree with you mickeyd, sometimes when I look back it's really, really tough to not label a few events in life as being "lucky" or "unlucky."

When my grandson was born with cerebral palsy, it's soooo tempting to describe that as "unlucky." But, of course, the decision to fund a trust for him (and delay my retirement) was strictly my own, so I suppose that removes the "luck" aspect from that decision, at least as it pertains to RE.

I had some investments do very well despite me not thinking these would be investments that would soar. I've convinced DW it was my doing. But in the back of my mind, I can't help but feel a little lucky.

I could name a few other perhaps "lucky" or "unlucky" scenarios in my life but I won't bore you with them. And again, I'm not disagreeing with you regarding the concept of making our own luck. Just rambling that sometimes I struggle to not think of a few things as having a bit of "luck" or "unluckiness" associated with them.

Your're fortunate to be able to have things be so black and white, to be able to know that your own personal circumstances, good and bad, are 100% your own doing.

[youbet]

Quote:

Originally posted by W2R Many of us, like me, REWahoo, Rich_in_Tampa, and many others retired in their 60's and oddly, I'm not aware of any of us who feels like we failed in doing so.

I'm not saying (and referencing my post see nothing to imply that I did) that folks who retired in their 60's "failed" or that they should have any regrets. (And I made NO mention of you, REWahoo or Rich_in_Tampa.) Quite the contrary, I'm one of those folks who thinks that before we laugh at those still working and unable to RE, we should be thankful for our own circumstances that have brought us to our happy outcomes. Observing some geezer toiling unhappily to put bread on the table brings no extra joy to my RE status. If he/she feels I'm "lucky," so be it. I don't need to look down at them and laugh from my fortunate position.

This whole thread with its piling on, laughing and finger pointing at others not doing as well as ourselves just left me a little cold.

Sorry if I'm spoiling the fun.

Merry Christmas. Happy holidays. Have a great 2012.

[Alan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuckanut I would say it is fair to use the SS age of ER (before 66 for mosty of us) and/or the age at which the pension(if one has a pension) does not get reduced for retiring early. Or maybe it should be the age where you get discounted National Park pass??

I'd just like to say that everyone is welcome on this site whether they retired at 30 or are still working at 90.

Happy Holidays

[W2R]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan I'd just like to say that everyone is welcome on this site whether they retired at 30 or are still working at 90. Happy Holidays

+5000 This is what I am trying to say. We are all welcome here and nobody should feel like they don't belong. Being an early retiree is something we can each define for ourselves when it comes to what "early" means and what "retiree" means. Probably 99.9999% of us define this for ourselves already.

Happy Holidays, everyone! For those who celebrate it, this is our one and only Christmas Eve, 2011.

[ChrisC]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mickeyd Luck has nothing to do with it.

“…luck plays a large role in every story of success; it is almost always easy to identify a small change in the story that would have turned a remarkable achievement into a mediocre outcome.”

Daniel Kahneman, Thinking, Fast and Slow

I'm struck by how we tend to believe that "luck has nothing to do with it." It's comforting to think that we are self-made success stories. But even Michael Jordan or Bill Gates would say that a measure of their success involved luck!

[Bestwifeever]

I feel luck, both good and bad, is a huge component of achievement or lack of--at least that is true in my life, and if it's not in yours, all I can say is, "good luck with that"!

[grasshopper]

Not luck, but loving kindness has attracted much of the blessings in my life.

Enjoy the holidays with friends and loved ones.

grasshopper.

[braumeister]

I don't think anyone has mentioned this, but I had an interesting conversation with a couple of friends (both younger than I am) recently.

The point I took away from the conversation was that neither of them had ever sat down and done the math. We know that innumeracy is rife in this country, but this is fairly basic math, after all.

Their position was that they would need far more than they would actually need, even assuming full retirement age Social Security benefits. The concept of earning on their nest egg while spending it at the same time was just too complicated for them to contemplate.

I wonder if this isn't the reason many people won't consider early retirement.

[52andout]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan I'd just like to say that everyone is welcome on this site whether they retired at 30 or are still working at 90. Happy Holidays

at the very least by reading this board and with good planning, even if you can't retire early you will be far better prepared to have the quality of life you want. Not everyone is willing to give up big boats etc. and that is OK. It is being aware that is the key and not end up destitute at age 75.

[Spanky]

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Not everyone is willing to give up big boats etc. and that is OK.

We do not have too many things to give up since we have been living a very modest life style.

[pletal]

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Originally Posted by flyfishnevada I think the lucky thing is just a way of assuring themselves that their poor choices aren't the reason they can't retire. It's just bad luck.

Bad luck be damned. Family including sibling and brother in laws on way over on this Christmas day. All of them will have to work till they die. I'll be done at fifty. Got lucky to work seventy plus hours a week for over two decades. Only one kid, only one marriage. Statement about luck is real covering up someone being jealous. Family, if not FI or planning on ER are the worst. Anyone else experience this? How you dealing with it? I'm feeling guilty, should I just write them all checks?

[ziggy29]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mickeyd Luck has nothing to do with it.

This is just as wrong, IMO, as a belief in "predestination" which justifies one's own bad situation by claiming they have no power to change it. I think people tend to use this belief to justify their dismiss all other less successful folks as unworthy of our charity or safety net. (Not you necessarily, but I see a lot of this out there. The idea seems to be that if they are struggling, it's entirely their own fault for making stupid, reckless and/or irresponsible decisions and that is 100% of the reason for their struggles, and thus they deserve none of our sympathy or financial assistance. I've seen way too many counterexamples to jump on this bandwagon.)

[Midpack]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ziggy29 This is just as wrong, IMO, as a belief in "predestination" which justifies one's own bad situation by claiming they have no power to change it. I think this belief is heavily correlated with the "I got mine, now screw the rest of you" that seems to be increasingly prevalent in a social and political environment which seems determined to pit one class of ordinary people against another.

+1

Even those who planned and worked hard to reach FI and/of RE, may not have been able to do so had they been born in many other countries, or simply many other families. And market conditions in the next 30-40 years may not be as favorable as the 30-40 we've just been through, it may be considerably more difficult for the generations that follow this community.

Luck has played a part for all of us whether we can admit it or not...just not entirely as some casual observers may believe, like the OP example may suggest.

[Milkman]

I have heard the "luck" comment as well. My reply is that I was "lucky" enough to have been divorced twice, widowed once, and fired three times in my adult life. Despite this "luck," I have still managed to accumulate what I have. Life happens, and luck or happiness is a choice.
Milkman