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View Poll Results: How did you do RELATIVE to S&P500?
5 or more % less than S&P 500 5 4.50%
3 to 4% less 10 9.01%
1 to 2% less 13 11.71%
Same as S&P 500 (11.7%) 17 15.32%
1 to 2% better than S&P 500 26 23.42%
3 to 5% better 23 20.72%
6 to 10% better 9 8.11%
11 to 20% better 6 5.41%
21% or more better 2 1.80%
Voters: 111. You may not vote on this poll

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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 07:42 PM   #21
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

13.3% ytd
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 07:47 PM   #22
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Re: YTD 2006 investment


Quicken portfolio view shows a YTD ROI (total return) overall at 12% as of today.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanky
Commodity (PCRIX) returns 7.09% (purchased in 3/06).
I guess timing is everything.

Quicken's portfolio view also shows a YTD ROI of only 2% on our PCRIX holdings. (no purchases or redemptions this year) That fund has had a great run in the past couple of years though.

Jim
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 08:14 PM   #23
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

15.14% - 401K
14.26 - Advisor Manged - Post Wrap Account fee(0.5%)

I am probably doing as good as my advisor but he manages ~70% of the Liquid NW.

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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 08:27 PM   #24
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by LOL!
Once again, you have to tell us how you determined your YTD return
Let's keep it simple. Use any method you want. Let's say the YTD is around 10%. My calculation returns 10.2%, and your gives 9.8%. Does not make much difference, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by retire@40
Very true. And I would guess the majority of answers here are a best-guess estimate, not a precise scientific calculation.
I think most people here well versed in this rather simple calculation. So I would say their numbers are acurate enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikerdude
What's wrong with taking your balance on 1/1/06 and comparing it to what you have now minus expenses if any?
Thank you Bikerdude.
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 08:35 PM   #25
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikerdude
What's wrong with taking your balance on 1/1/06 and comparing it to what you have now minus expenses if any?
This might be OK if you didn't add or take out any money from the account. But why should we subtract out expenses?
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 08:37 PM   #26
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

If I take what I have now and compare to what I had 12/31/2005, then I'm up 20% YTD with a 80% stock, 20% fixed portfolio.

But suppose I started with $10,000, contributed $100,000 and lost $98,000, so I ended up with $12,000. That would calculate to a 20% return by the "what I have now" versus "what I had then". Would you be happy with a 20% return on your way to losing $98,000?
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 08:56 PM   #27
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

The ER portfolio (93% stocks, 7% cash) is up 14% YTD according to Quicken's "ROI YTD" column.

Thank you, Warren Buffett and those wild-eyed hard-partyin' boys at Tweedy Browne...
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 09:10 PM   #28
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by LOL!
But suppose I started with $10,000, contributed $100,000 and lost $98,000, so I ended up with $12,000. That would calculate to a 20% return by the "what I have now" versus "what I had then". Would you be happy with a 20% return on your way to losing $98,000?
You're correct. I calculated my return based on my circumstances only. It's not appropriate for everyone. Especially if you're adding substantial amounts during the year although it can still be calculated in the same manner just not quite as simple or quite as accurate as other methods.
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 09:20 PM   #29
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

MS Money's ROI column says my portfolio of 97% individual stocks is up 13.9% YTD.
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 09:27 PM   #30
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmpi
This might be OK if you didn't add or take out any money from the account. But why should we subtract out expenses?
By expenses I mean living expenses taken from your account not investment expenses. Sorry for any confusion.
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 09:41 PM   #31
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikerdude
What's wrong with taking your balance on 1/1/06 and comparing it to what you have now minus expenses if any?
Because if everyone follows that formula they would get the wrong result.

That formula only works if you don't add any new money to your investments and/or take money out.

The part that messes a lot of people up is the intra-year additions and deductions in their portfolios. That's what happened to the "Beardstown Ladies."
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 10:02 PM   #32
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Thank you all for your vote. As expected, the majority does better than S&P 500. This is indeed the ER forum
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 10:25 PM   #33
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmpi
You all must be 100% (or more) invested in stocks.
How do you do more than 100%? You must be talking about margin? No, I quit margin a long time ago
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 10:31 PM   #34
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

The Quicken answer using "Current Year" is 10.4% which is how I voted to compare directly to S&P YTD. Based essentially on a 60/40 portfolio and in Cdn$.

Cannot use the Quicken YTD calculation methodology because it is important not to presume current ROI as of today is projected through to year end.
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-29-2006, 11:01 PM   #35
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

MSMoney says current year is 13.9%. Our portfolio is 80% equities, 10% bonds and 10% cash.

AltaRed, MSMoney does the same thing with YTD returns: it annualizes them, so gives something like 15.4% YTD.

Alrighty, I guess this means a 15% correction in December?
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-30-2006, 12:06 AM   #36
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

nm
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-30-2006, 01:25 AM   #37
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by retire@40
Very true. And I would guess the majority of answers here are a best-guess estimate, not a precise scientific calculation.

For example, if somebody held cash and invested that cash immediately before the market surged a couple of months ago, that person cannot use the reported YTD return on that investment as his own YTD return.

Personal ROI is a more complicated calculation when personal funds are added and subtracted from investments and transfers are made between various investments.
I borrowed 114K on my house the first of August and invested it in mutual funds. They are up about 10% already. I invest twice a month the first 8 months of the year and once about the 5th of January so I don't bother to try to figure out my YTD or anything it isn't really important to me. I made about 31K total this year so far but had all different amounts invested for different amounts of time.
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-30-2006, 07:27 AM   #38
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by old woman
I borrowed 114K on my house the first of August and invested it in mutual funds. They are up about 10% already. I invest twice a month the first 8 months of the year and once about the 5th of January so I don't bother to try to figure out my YTD or anything it isn't really important to me. I made about 31K total this year so far but had all different amounts invested for different amounts of time.
Exactly what I'm talking about. I don't even think JG can figure that one out.
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-30-2006, 08:23 AM   #39
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Quote:
Originally Posted by retire@40
Exactly what I'm talking about. I don't even think JG can figure that one out.
What I do is used a "time weighted capital" approach.

Two examples:

If you start the year with $100 and end with $110, it's easy -- 10%. ($110-$10)/($100 * 365/365)

If you have $50 on 1/1/06, add another $50 on 7/1/06 and end with $110, you weigh the 1/1/06 capital at 100% and the 7/1/06 capital at 50% (half of the year), so you make $10 on a investment of $75, or a 13.3% return. ($110-100)/(($50*(365/365) + ($50*(182/365)))

I don't know if this is the "correct" or "professional" approach, but it gives me meaningful results. I have no idea whether this is an accepted method of calculation b/c I made it up for my own calcualations.
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Re: YTD 2006 investment
Old 11-30-2006, 08:25 AM   #40
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Re: YTD 2006 investment

Time-weighted is a reasonable way to do it, but any method introduces distortions when you have capital flowing in and out intra period. I have money flowing in and out all the time, so it is tough to get more than horseshoe close on performance numbers.
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