A few surprises in the fifth month of retirement

[ER Eddie]

I already posted on surprises in the first and second months of retirement. There were no real surprises in the third or fourth month, but here are some from the fifth month:

1. I'm spending more than I thought I would, and that's fine. My quarterly spending is about $1000/month more than I projected, based on tracking my expenses a few years back. The difference is likely due to three factors: I'm intentionally spending more; I was fairly restrained in that earlier tracking period; and I'm very early in retirement so I'm sort of letting loose.

Despite the increased spending, I have no worries. I'm at about a 2% withdrawal rate. I actually think I should be spending more, because I'd rather not end up dead with a big bank account, but I've never cared that much for expensive stuff (cars, houses, vacations, etc.), so an extra $1000/quarter is about all I'm actually interested in doing.

2. Adopted a new dog. My old friend crossed over about 6 months ago, and I waited until it felt right to get a new dog. He's a two-year old Papillion mix, and he's a great little guy -- very calm, friendly, and peaceful. We're spending a lot of time getting to know each other.

3. Struggles over "meaningful work" and volunteering. I expected that retirement would involve a long period of decompressing from work and just taking it easy, not being much concerned with issues of meaning and purpose, but it reared its head quicker than I thought. I guess I shouldn't be too surprised, because that's always been a big concern of mine.

It wasn't that I had a lack of things to do, but I did feel a sense that I needed a meaningful project of some type, beyond just learning and growth, which is what occupies a fair chunk of my time.

At first I thought it would be volunteering at the animal shelter. I've always loved animals, and I figured that would be a way I could give back. However, when I got involved, I didn't find it that satisfying. I didn't like having to be there there every week at a certain time. I didn't like having to follow all the rules and policies. I didn't like the tasks (e.g., cleaning kennels) and the very programmatic system. I felt like I was basically just unpaid labor. I also felt weird about being an older male mixed amongst young female college students, most of them there because of school or scholarship requirements.

Anyhow, despite knowing all the benefits of volunteering and feeling a desire to help animals, I just couldn't find the motivation to do it. I think part of the problem was a mismatch between me and that specific volunteer gig. I'm not ruling out volunteering in the future. But I also think that, right now, I don't want anything that resembles a job or work.

I understand better now why some people here refer to it as "w*rk" or a "j*b." When I was working, I would naturally try to see the upside of doing so -- the meaning derived, the collegiality, the intellectual stimulation, etc. But now that I'm free of the obligations and commitments of work, I want nothing to do with it. It feels like my first priority is to retain this sense of freedom and ease that I have.

I am still interested in meaning, but I've reframed it for myself from "meaningful work" to "meaningful activity."

4. Decided I'm not interested in pursuing a long-term relationship with a woman, at this stage of my life. This is not really that surprising, since I haven't dated much at all in the past decade. My pattern would be to occasionally sign up for a dating site, then watch my interest completely drop off within a couple weeks. That happened repeatedly. I thought maybe it was just lack of time, and so I'd think, "When I have more time, I'll get around to it." But when I had more time (when I went part-time, then when I went full retirement), same thing happened. So inside, I already really felt/knew that it wasn't something I was really interested in.

There are a lot of factors involved, which I won't go into, but I'll mention two things. One was a pro/con list, which was weighted heavily against (about 10 to 1). The second was calculating the probability of finding a woman in my area who would be a good fit for a genuinely satisfying LTR. That turned out to be about a 1 in 20,000 chance of finding 1 woman like that -- absurdly low odds. So that helped to put the idea to rest.

5. I am surprised at how long ago work feels. It's only been about 5 months since I retired, but it feels like another lifetime ago. It feels so distant.

6. I haven't gotten over how nice the freedom feels. I figured maybe I would habituate to it, and maybe I have to some degree, but there are many times when I'll just stop and appreciate how nice it is to have nothing that I have to do -- and not just for today or the weekend, but for the rest of my life. That's a pretty relaxed feeling.

I reflected to myself not long ago that this is one of the first times in my life where I have absolutely nothing to worry about -- nothing coming up that I have to "deal with," no problems on the horizon, no work stresses, no health issues, no Monday responsibilities, no relationship stresses, no worries at all, just a lot of freedom to do what I feel drawn to do. Feels pretty nice. *knock wood* I have to say, my life's been pretty difficult at times (not saying I'm a victim; my difficulties have often been self-chosen, in a sense), and so I'm enjoying this period of freedom, ease, and relaxation. I kinda feel like I deserve it.

[Bir48die]

* That is a bunch over budget. I found with extra time on my hands that I would look at new things to buy. Just had to discipline myself. Your WR is well within reason so maybe you were just testing how low you could go.

* Work does become a distant memory quickly. That's ok. It's more about the separation with people you liked at work.

* Don't worry about the volunteer thing. Do some short term gigs that just test things out. It took me a year to fall into what I'm doing now every year.

* Find a "friend with benefits" that you can take out and go to events. There are plenty of men and women later in life that are looking for the same thing.

Good luck

[ckelly78z]

1 If you are "overspending", and still only at 2% WR, I wouldn't be worried at all, and may even make a conscious effort to spend more.

2 Nothing like anew dog to make your life more enjoyable.

3 You will find a sense of self fulfillment by doing good things for others.

4 A LTR is something that not many folks are looking for these days. I think a "freind with benefits" would be a wonderful option for both of you while allowing space, but still having a connection.

5 Unfortunately, i'm not there yet...i've been working non-stop since 1982.

6 I know for a fact that I will enjoy this most of all.

[davebarnes]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ER Eddie I have absolutely nothing to worry about -- nothing coming up that I have to "deal with,"

No house issues?
I find that there is always some maintenance to be done.

[ER Eddie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bir48die * That is a bunch over budget. I found with extra time on my hands that I would look at new things to buy. Just had to discipline myself. Your WR is well within reason so maybe you were just testing how low you could go.

I don't think it's all that much. It works out to about 4K/year. No big deal.

As I mentioned in my second month thread, I decided I wasn't spending enough, and I intentionally shifted to spending more, so that's part of what's going on, and it's expected. Another part is what you alluded to, although I don't think of it as a self-discipline thing. I think of it as filling my time with interesting new activities, and there's some spending associated with that -- more money on books, music, trips, stupid ****, dogs, bikes, etc.

Quote:

* Find a "friend with benefits" that you can take out and go to events. There are plenty of men and women later in life that are looking for the same thing.

I haven't ruled out a short-term relationship or a FWB, just the LTR or marriage. I'm not particularly motivated for an STR or FWB, but it's not off the table.

It helps for me to have the LTR thing ruled out, because it saves me further wondering, vacillating, and wasted energy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckelly78z 1 If you are "overspending", and still only at 2% WR, I wouldn't be worried at all, and may even make a conscious effort to spend more.

Yeah, that's my thought, too. I am making a conscious effort to spend more.

Quote:

4 A LTR is something that not many folks are looking for these days. I think a "freind with benefits" would be a wonderful option for both of you while allowing space, but still having a connection.

Yes, I saw a study showing that 40% of single women and 25% of single men in my age group (50-64) are "definitely not interested" in having a relationship. The study was done in the Netherlands, but I'm guessing it's similar in the US.

"The older single people are, the more likely they are not to want a steady relationship. Women in particular, are reluctant to have a steady partner at older ages. Nearly 40 percent of single women aged 50-64 years say they definitely do not want a relationship any more, compared with one quarter of single men in this age group. For the ages 65-79, this is even the case for nearly 70 percent of women."

https://www.cbs.nl/en-gb/news/2015/0...a-relationship

As for a short-term relationship or FWB, I haven't ruled it out, but it's not something I'm all that motivated to pursue, at least for now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by davebarnes No house issues? I find that there is always some maintenance to be done.

Well, there's probably something I could find to do, but I don't feel like it. I'll wait until something falls apart.

[travelover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ER Eddie ".............Nearly 40 percent of single women aged 50-64 years say they definitely do not want a relationship any more'"

Hell, I think is probably true of 40 percent of married women.

[pacergal]

Congratulations on adopting a new companion dog! They can add so much to our lives.
And yes, freedom is nice. Thats what saving and LBYM is all about--so when you retire, you can do whatever you want, including just sitting doing nothing but enjoying life and petting your dog

[Dtail]

You stated that your quarterly spending was a 1000 more a month.
I assume you mean a 1000 more quarterly or 4k yearly.

[Mr._Graybeard]

Re volunteering: My BiL also volunteered at a local animal shelter and had a similar experience. He wanted to help, but picking up poop in a cage got old really quick.

I've been a volunteer for several years with a small museum and a dog-training class that sees a lot of new owners of shelter rescues and other "challenging" dogs. A big reason why I stay involved is the people I meet and help.

I'm an introvert by nature, so I'm normally not inclined to seek out interaction with others. But I've found that new, friendly faces are a pleasant addition to a lifestyle where I'm no longer required to go out in the world.

[Scuba]

Eddie, it sounds as though you’re really enjoying your retirement and settling into it well. Love that you adopted an adult dog. And I completely agree with you re not wanting to do volunteer assignments that require a routine schedule. For me also, this felt like unpaid work. I have found some enjoyable volunteer work mentoring university students. This is done on a non-routine schedule that I largely control so it works well for me. I learn a lot from students I mentor and find it rewarding to help them establish their careers. Maybe in time you can find a way to “give back” that fulfills you without seeming like a job.

I understand your feelings about a LTR, although having a loving partner certainly enhances my life. However if something happened to DH, I’m not sure I’d want to search for a replacement. YMMV and best wishes for continued enjoyment of ER.

[jollystomper]

Quote:

Originally Posted by davebarnes No house issues? I find that there is always some maintenance to be done.

I agree, but in my own retirement I have found that the majority of house (and car) maintenance tasks are enjoyable. Perhaps because I feel less of a need to rush and get them done, and can take more time to study, plan and resolve the situation.

[ER Eddie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dtail You stated that your quarterly spending was a 1000 more a month. I assume you mean a 1000 more quarterly or 4k yearly.

Yeah, that was my mistake. I meant to say I am spending $1000/quarter more than expected, not $1000/month.

As I mentioned, that's partly an intentional choice to spend more, and I'm still at a 2% withdrawal rate, so no worries.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pacergal Congratulations on adopting a new companion dog! They can add so much to our lives. And yes, freedom is nice. Thats what saving and LBYM is all about--so when you retire, you can do whatever you want, including just sitting doing nothing but enjoying life and petting your dog

Yes, I seem to be doing a lot of that lately.

It's been beautiful weather lately -- the leaves have turned and are falling, the temperature is perfect, the sky is blue with a nice mix of white clouds. Just beautiful. I'm spending plenty of time out in the back, hanging out with the birds and squirrels, or going for walks in the park with my new buddy.

I'm grateful to have this much free time. I used to hate it when the weather was great, and I'd be stuck an office building, working. No more. I can enjoy every beautiful day that comes my way.

[CaptTom]

Speaking of house maintenance, I'm starting to think I didn't retire, but simply changed jobs. Now I'm the full-time maintenance guy for the house, boat, car and truck.

OK, I did all that stuff before I retired, too. But now I take on bigger projects and there's a bit more motivation to do it myself rather than hire it out.

As for volunteering, I've always been involved in a various unpaid activities. Whether it was work-related user groups or outside interests, I tend to find things I want to do, then get sucked into helping out in some way.

[ER Eddie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr._Graybeard Re volunteering: My BiL also volunteered at a local animal shelter and had a similar experience. He wanted to help, but picking up poop in a cage got old really quick. I've been a volunteer for several years with a small museum and a dog-training class that sees a lot of new owners of shelter rescues and other "challenging" dogs. A big reason why I stay involved is the people I meet and help. I'm an introvert by nature, so I'm normally not inclined to seek out interaction with others. But I've found that new, friendly faces are a pleasant addition to a lifestyle where I'm no longer required to go out in the world.

I think part of why volunteering at this particular shelter didn't pan out is that I didn't feel like I was helping the dogs so much as helping the shelter staff with their routine duties. I want the feeling of directly helping the dogs, not just helping the shelter carry out its daily chores.

I'm a big ol' introvert, too -- not shy; I just don't have as much desire/need to be social as most people do, and I often find it more draining than rewarding. But part of why I wanted to volunteer was to connect with other animal lovers. The problem was that the other volunteers were all 20 year old college girls. They were nice people, but as a 58 year old dude, I felt out of place. I need to have a gig with other old codgers like me, not a bunch of co-eds (do they even call them "co-eds" any more? probably not...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scuba Eddie, it sounds as though you’re really enjoying your retirement and settling into it well. Love that you adopted an adult dog. And I completely agree with you re not wanting to do volunteer assignments that require a routine schedule. For me also, this felt like unpaid work. I have found some enjoyable volunteer work mentoring university students. This is done on a non-routine schedule that I largely control so it works well for me. I learn a lot from students I mentor and find it rewarding to help them establish their careers. Maybe in time you can find a way to “give back” that fulfills you without seeming like a job. I understand your feelings about a LTR, although having a loving partner certainly enhances my life. However if something happened to DH, I’m not sure I’d want to search for a replacement. YMMV and best wishes for continued enjoyment of ER.

Thanks, Scuba. Appreciate your input as always.

I do think that the fixed schedule was a part of my dissatisfaction. It felt too much like a commitment. I'm not in the mood for any commitments right now. "Give me liberty or give me ..." well, not death, I wouldn't go that far ... How about, "Give me liberty or give me a really solid rationale for giving some of it up!" (not as catchy, I admit).

Maybe I'll find a volunteer gig that doesn't feel like a job. I am intellectually convinced that it is a good idea -- I know it would be good for me and good for others. I've seen the research (e.g., that people volunteering live longer, are happier, etc.); I've experienced the benefits of giving/helping myself many times; it is something taught by all spiritual traditions and makes good sense. I just can't get myself to do it. I just don't feel like it. I don't think it's an issue of selfishness, because I spend a decent portion of my day giving/helping, albeit in small ways, and I spent most of my career serving/helping, sometimes at pretty significant personal cost.

I would like to find a good volunteer gig eventually, but it may be that the timing (this early in retirement) might not be right. I'm really enjoying the feeling of freedom and spaciousness that comes with retirement, and I have this instinctive resistance to anything that threatens it. Maybe with time that'll abate a little, and I'll seek out other volunteer opportunities.

[Dalmore]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptTom Speaking of house maintenance, I'm starting to think I didn't retire, but simply changed jobs.

While I am not quite there yet, I am looking forward to being "Self" employed. I see retirement as taking care of my projects (and the DW's), not someone else's projects.

[Elbata]

Hey Eddie. I really enjoyed your post, especially the part about dating or finding a woman.

My wife has a lot of single friends so I get to sit on the sidelines and hear their travails. They have all tried dating, and they have all given up. I'm sure if someone comes into their lives, they'd entertain the idea. But doing the personal ads, they're done with it.

As we get older, we know more who we are, and comfortable in those shoes. Having someone new come into our lives, especially at this stage is quite the change.

Also at our age, at least for me, the sexual part would be nice, but really not that important. I'd just want to be around someone, to share ideas, good conversation and a healthy mutual respect.

[igsoy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ER Eddie Anyhow, despite knowing all the benefits of volunteering and feeling a desire to help animals, I just couldn't find the motivation to do it. I think part of the problem was a mismatch between me and that specific volunteer gig.

Working with a pet rescue organization might be more rewarding to you. They always need foster parents to take care of the rescued dogs or cats in their home while waiting on adopters. While they are living with you, you may be helping them with socialization or other training they may have missed out on so far in their harsh lives. You do get attached to them and their different personalities, and sometimes it's hard to say goodbye when they get adopted, but you know you are making a very real difference for them.

[ER Eddie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by igsoy Working with a pet rescue organization might be more rewarding to you. They always need foster parents to take care of the rescued dogs or cats in their home while waiting on adopters. While they are living with you, you may be helping them with socialization or other training they may have missed out on so far in their harsh lives. You do get attached to them and their different personalities, and sometimes it's hard to say goodbye when they get adopted, but you know you are making a very real difference for them.

Yes, I've thought about potentially being a foster dad. I assume I'd have to undergo some training, because I have no experience. It is something I might consider down the road, once I get my new dog settled.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elbata Hey Eddie. I really enjoyed your post, especially the part about dating or finding a woman. My wife has a lot of single friends so I get to sit on the sidelines and hear their travails. They have all tried dating, and they have all given up. I'm sure if someone comes into their lives, they'd entertain the idea. But doing the personal ads, they're done with it. As we get older, we know more who we are, and comfortable in those shoes. Having someone new come into our lives, especially at this stage is quite the change. Also at our age, at least for me, the sexual part would be nice, but really not that important. I'd just want to be around someone, to share ideas, good conversation and a healthy mutual respect.

Yes, there are a lot of single men and women in my age group who are no longer interested in looking for an LTR. Some are happily single (I'm in that group), and some are unhappily resigned to singlehood, although they'd be in an LTR/marriage in a minute if they could be. But they've had bad experiences (divorce, previous relationships, or even just dating), and they've basically given up. I can't blame them. There are some bad stories out there.

It can also keep people trapped in lousy marriages. I've heard plenty of those stories as well -- lonely married people who feel trapped and stuck in the marriage, because they're afraid of being alone, and they've heard from their friends how hard the dating scene can be. So they choose the devil they know, rather than the one they don't.

I agree that as I get older, the friendship elements are more important than the sexual ones. I still have sexual desires, of course, but those biological urges just aren't as pressing anymore ... thank goodness. It makes actual friendship with women a lot easier than it was at, say, age 25 or 30.

[MarieIG]

I enjoy reading your updates. So chill and enjoy your time with your new buddy. No need to engage in volunteering until and unless you're ready. No need to force relationships that you're not feeling.

[ER Eddie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarieIG I enjoy reading your updates. So chill and enjoy your time with your new buddy. No need to engage in volunteering until and unless you're ready. No need to force relationships that you're not feeling.

Thanks, Marie. Couldn't agree more.