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Old 11-10-2014, 04:10 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by EastWest Gal View Post
Everything earned during the marriage. The ex will not be entitled to 1/2 the 401k, just maybe 1/2 of the 401k contributions and earnings during the marriage. Huge difference. This is also true for all assets. They can't take 1/2 a house your friend owned before the marriage, for example, even in a community property state.

Not entirely true unless the assets are kept separate. Once assets are commingled all bets are off. I was divorced in NM, a community property state and it wasn't pretty. Fortunately I learned from my mistakes and am happily remarried with the only DD being of the pleasurable kind.


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Old 11-10-2014, 04:40 PM   #22
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Possibly true. But they'd been married for 20+ years and probably had nothing when they got married, so it was all marital property. Fortunately, TSP is only part of our retirement plan, and friend managed to fend off a court order forcing him to share his pension with her, as well.

A.

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Everything earned during the marriage. The ex will not be entitled to 1/2 the 401k, just maybe 1/2 of the 401k contributions and earnings during the marriage. Huge difference. This is also true for all assets. They can't take 1/2 a house your friend owned before the marriage, for example, even in a community property state.
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Old 11-10-2014, 10:55 PM   #23
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I know of a fellow, very successful, his wife decided to divorce him and run off with some other fellow, so she took 1/2 of everything.
He thought ok, I'll just work longer to age 60 and be golden.
ex-Wife came back after about 4 yrs having spent all her $$. Incredibly they got re-hitched, and then 3 years later she did it again!
Now his plan is to work until age 75 !!
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Old 11-10-2014, 10:58 PM   #24
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I did it after one divorce. I just kept my head down and saved like crazy - like 50% of my salary. And yea, depending on their particular situation expect to pay half of real estate and savings, including 401(k) and IRAs.
And get a prenup if one is foolish enough to remarry.
Or simply marry Up !!
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Old 11-11-2014, 05:53 PM   #25
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I know of a fellow, very successful, his wife decided to divorce him and run off with some other fellow, so she took 1/2 of everything.
He thought ok, I'll just work longer to age 60 and be golden.
ex-Wife came back after about 4 yrs having spent all her $$. Incredibly they got re-hitched, and then 3 years later she did it again!
Now his plan is to work until age 75 !!
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Old 11-11-2014, 06:47 PM   #26
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As someone who has had the same live-in GF for 24 years,
You stay classy.
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Old 11-12-2014, 05:33 AM   #27
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First and Last Spouse - 50 years this coming April. What is this thing called Divorce?
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Old 11-12-2014, 08:40 AM   #28
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First and Last Spouse - 50 years this coming April. What is this thing called Divorce?
Congratulations, but don't break your arm patting yourself on the back. It takes two to make a marriage but only one to make a divorce.
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Old 11-12-2014, 10:42 AM   #29
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I know of a fellow, very successful, his wife decided to divorce him and run off with some other fellow, so she took 1/2 of everything.
He thought ok, I'll just work longer to age 60 and be golden.
ex-Wife came back after about 4 yrs having spent all her $$. Incredibly they got re-hitched, and then 3 years later she did it again!
Now his plan is to work until age 75 !!
He is a fool and deserves his fate.
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Old 11-12-2014, 11:56 AM   #30
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Unless one is young and planning to start a family, and both partners are willing and able to do this, why get married?
The arguments I've heard note that it greatly simplifies health care and end-of-life issues. A legal spouse has many more rights than a live-in-boyfriend when issues like dementia start to rear their ugly head. When one spouse dies, all property automatically transfers to the surviving spouse, whereas a common-law spouse or live-in-partner will have a fight on their hands. Also, things like corporate pensions and health plans have survivor benefits that apply to married spouses, but not live-in partners. Common-law would apply, but can be more difficult to satisfy (as opposed to simply showing them a marriage certificate).

Plus, you know, .... Romance!
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Old 11-12-2014, 12:02 PM   #31
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Also, the statement that "50% of marriages end in divorce" is a gross oversimplification. It suggests that the outcome is completely random, and any given marriage between 2 people has 50/50 odds of succeeding of failing. The truth, of course, is much more nuanced.

There are many factors that alter that "50%" figure one way or the other. If you are a young, educated, ethnically-similar couple with identical outlooks on childrearing, religion, and finances, on your first marriage, your odds are much higher than 50%. If you are a middle-aged couple, both already divorced at least once, with children from previous marriages, of different religions, and different financial philosophies (i.e., grasshopper vs. ant), then the odds of that marriage succeeding are terrible, certainly worse than 50%.
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Old 11-12-2014, 12:12 PM   #32
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The arguments I've heard note that it greatly simplifies health care and end-of-life issues. A legal spouse has many more rights than a live-in-boyfriend when issues like dementia start to rear their ugly head. When one spouse dies, all property automatically transfers to the surviving spouse, whereas a common-law spouse or live-in-partner will have a fight on their hands. Also, things like corporate pensions and health plans have survivor benefits that apply to married spouses, but not live-in partners. Common-law would apply, but can be more difficult to satisfy (as opposed to simply showing them a marriage certificate).

Plus, you know, .... Romance!
You can get around a lot of this with the proper documents--but you need to plan. Durable Healthcare Powers of Attorney, and well crafted wills/trusts are a start. (Which married couples should have as well--including contingent decisionmakers for predeceased situation, or in case you both get hit by the same truck, literal or figurative.) BUT, you can't get the estate tax benefits (assuming one or both have estates greater than 5.25 mill, or whatever the exclusion is at time of death), nor the pensions and Soc. Sec. benefits. Also there are asset protection benefits (vary by state) that are not easily duplicated by documents.

_______
on the other side of 30 years married; DW makes more and has more assets in her name, but I think I'll stick with her!
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Old 11-12-2014, 01:55 PM   #33
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So after one has done all this paperwork so as to duplicate marriage without actually being married, what is the difference?
.
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Old 11-12-2014, 03:49 PM   #34
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So after one has done all this paperwork so as to duplicate marriage without actually being married, what is the difference?
.
Roughly half, by my calculation.
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:29 PM   #35
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Anyone FIRE with 2 Ds under there belt

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So after one has done all this paperwork so as to duplicate marriage without actually being married, what is the difference?
.

You've defined your responsibilities in the relationship and who owns what rather than letting the state define it for you. Big difference.

I was divorced in NJ in 1997 so things may be different but I kept all of the investments in my name. It was a property settlement my Ex and I negotiated with our lawyers and the court approved it. He refused any settlement that required him to pay CS so it was written that I got to keep the investments (all brought into the marriage or made out of my pay during the 13 years we were married while I bore more than my share of joint expenses). That was in lieu of CS. I had a good lawyer and I'm forever grateful. My Ex was a deadbeat and never would have paid a dime.
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Old 11-13-2014, 09:31 AM   #36
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Congratulations, but don't break your arm patting yourself on the back. It takes two to make a marriage but only one to make a divorce.
Thanks Travelover. believe me she deserves a lot more credit than I ever will. I came from a "broken home" as we used to call it so I actually have some very sad experiences with divorce.
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Old 11-13-2014, 09:52 AM   #37
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The arguments I've heard note that it greatly simplifies health care and end-of-life issues.
Also children related things and immigration / emigration issues.

Trying to move elsewhere without being married is triple the pain.
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Old 11-13-2014, 10:15 AM   #38
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Any words of encouragement for this person?
Yeah...don't get married. Of course, it's a little late for that

Don't know at this point in my life if I would ever marry or not. There is ZERO chance I'd ever risk my finances in a relationship, I don't care how much I think I might love somebody. My finances are the only thing that's going to allow me to FIRE and quit working for other people. No way I'm putting that at risk, for anybody. Ever.

Anyway, didn't mean to derail...good luck to your friend, and I hope it all works out!
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Old 11-13-2014, 10:34 AM   #39
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Life could not be better!

but an unhappy marriage?... could not be worse.
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Old 11-17-2014, 09:16 PM   #40
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Am on 3rd marriage, and been together for just over 25 years. This AFTER 2 divorces. And yes, I retired early.
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