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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-13-2005, 05:31 PM   #61
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Re: Been thinking lately

HaHa,
Tell me about it, a drug dealer go shot right next to my condo in Torrance.

If you're familiar, it was Torrance Blvd/Vermont Ave, right in the LA strip near Carson. 700 lb Somoans in Luckies with shopping cart tied together like a mule train.

Them were the days. Just makin the little lady happy. No logic at all.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-13-2005, 06:59 PM   #62
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Re: Been thinking lately

Quote:
Originally Posted by HaHa
Maybe doesn't fit in Hawaii, but over here you just go to your local Home Depot and look around the parking lot for a Mexican with a truck.

Soon, the second law of demography will see to it that the USA is just as miserable as any third world country that hasn't been quarantined.

Second Law of Demography: At equilibrium, given porous borders, misery will flow from areas of high misery to areas of low misery, until everyplace is equally miserable

Ha
I'm impressed. Not easy to do.

JG
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-13-2005, 10:08 PM   #63
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Re: Been thinking lately

Quote:
Originally Posted by HaHa
Maybe doesn't fit in Hawaii, but over here you just go to your local Home Depot and look around the parking lot for a Mexican with a truck.

Soon, the second law of demography will see to it that the USA is just as miserable as any third world country that hasn't been quarantined.

Second Law of Demography: At equilibrium, given porous borders, misery will flow from areas of high misery to areas of low misery, until everyplace is equally miserable

Ha
One word Ha----Brilliant!
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 02:36 AM   #64
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Re: Been thinking lately

Thank you, that is very kind.

Ha
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 08:41 AM   #65
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Re: Been thinking lately

Hmmm

Club of Rome? Now that I'm here - lets shut the gate

Happens every generation - duh - I think it's biologically driven.

Heh, heh, heh, heh.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 12:26 PM   #66
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Re: Been thinking lately

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Originally Posted by unclemick2
Now that I'm here - lets shut the gate
Heh, heh. HaHa is right. Things have gone downhill with our open borders. Ask any Native American.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 02:05 PM   #67
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Re: Been thinking lately

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Originally Posted by wabmester
Heh, heh.* *HaHa is right.* *Things have gone downhill with our open borders.* *Ask any Native American.
Perhaps, but the Native Americans also have a saying in this day and age of growing reservation casinos -- "They took our land, but now we take their money".
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 02:22 PM   #68
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Re: Been thinking lately

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Originally Posted by wabmester
Heh, heh.* *HaHa is right.* *Things have gone downhill with our open borders.* *Ask any Native American.
Very funny, but beside the point. If you think SOTB immigration will produce anything like what the Euro-USA has produced, OK, but I guess I know how to evaluate your posts.

The only beneficiaries of uncontrolled immigration are the immigrants, to whom we owe nothing, and the business-political cabal that will happily screw citizens for their own ends.

After all, they can just repair to the ranch at Crawford if the old family neighborhood gets a little rough.

Oh, BTW, Wab, have you noticed that the London bombers were "law abiding Muslims", with no prior police run-ins?

I don't suppose that could happen here? Nah, impossible.

Ha

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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 02:27 PM   #69
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Re: Been thinking lately

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Originally Posted by Jay_Gatsby
Perhaps, but the Native Americans also have a saying in this day and age of growing reservation casinos -- "They took our land, but now we take their money".
Hey, they've been doing that since they sold us Manhattan Island...
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 02:29 PM   #70
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Re: Been thinking lately

Nope - we don't need no foreigners - the good old boys do just fine - Oklahoma City, Columbine and others in history.

The natives will get better with practice.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 02:40 PM   #71
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Re: Been thinking lately

Quote:
Originally Posted by HaHa
Oh, BTW, Wab, have you noticed that the London bombers were "law abiding Muslims", with no prior police run-ins?

I don't suppose that could happen here? Nah, impossible.
HaHa, you like directional bets, right? Put all of your money on nationalism and xenophobia futures. Just a hunch.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 03:03 PM   #72
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Re: Been thinking lately

They were citizens of the country, too. So a wall around the country (well, they have a moat already) wouldn't have helped. But I'm with y'all on this one, I wouldn't want to be a Muslim in the U.K. right now.

I read three of them attended the same mosque, and it was known for a pretty rabid anti-western message. Freedom of speech is one thing, advocating violence is antother.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 04:06 PM   #73
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Re: Been thinking lately

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Originally Posted by Laurence
I wouldn't want to be a Muslim in the U.K. right now.
It's really the xenophobia that bugs me more than all of the "dangers" associated with immigration. Without getting too mushy, we are all human. That means that the stuff that motivates us in life is far more similar than different. But part of being human is noticing the differences and quickly categorizing them in simple terms like good and bad. It'll never change. We'll always have a herding instict. We'll always distrust people we don't know and things we don't understand. And we'll blow stuff up when we think others are the root of all evil.

Back to the original topic, saving the world is tough work. Hell, even attempting to understand it is a full-time job. I think you should stick with bond trading, Brewer.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 08:59 PM   #74
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Re: Been thinking lately

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurence
They were citizens of the country, too.* So a wall around the country (well, they have a moat already) wouldn't have helped.* But I'm with y'all on this one, I wouldn't want to be a Muslim in the U.K. right now. (emphasis added)
I read three of them attended the same mosque, and it was known for a pretty rabid anti-western message.* Freedom of speech is one thing, advocating violence is antother.*
I disagree. The UK is (and Europe generaly) is far more prepared to live and deal with a level of war and terrorism. Remember, the "War on Terror" is a misnomer. It should be the "War on Terror of the type and by people that the US Government has suddenly decided it now doesn't like, after standing idly by for decades whilst it sponsored the terrorists it did like, and turned a blind eye to the fund raising and support of terrorists by it's own government members for the commission of bombings and atrocities abroad"

The notable difference in the UK, from my experience, is that the population is generally more level headed and pragmatic. As a group, they do not react in a knee jerk fashion. There will be no "Patriot Act" or the like. There will be no large scale rounding up of "Suspects" for shipment to the Isle of Wight for 3 years. The British, as a people would not stand for it. It goes against their basic views of individualism, freedom and tolerance and generosity.

You may note, that whilst the individual bombers will be vilified (and rightly so) the larger ethnic group to which they belong will not be. CAVAET: I do not deny that small fringe groups will no doubt target a few Muslim owned businesses, shops or Mosques, but these people wll always do it and the bombing is an excuse rather than the prime reason for their actions.

What I am talking about is the ovewhelming majority of the population are not blaming or targetting Muslims per se. Indeed, I think you will find if you read the British or international media, that more of the resentment, blame and vitriol is being targetted at Blair and particularly the US Administration and Bush. They are felt to be to blame for bringing these unnecessary events back to the streets of the UK and I think you will notice a strong groundswell of unity in the people against these politicians and any and all legislation they try to introduce that curtials, impinges or affects induvidual freedoms etc.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 09:13 PM   #75
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Re: Been thinking lately

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I disagree. The UK is (and Europe generaly) is far more prepared to live and deal with a level of war and terrorism. .
Oh, absolutely. Especially in regard to "Europe in general". That is why the Holocaust happened in Massachusetts, and not Germany. And why soccer fans in England are so gentlemanly toward foreign teams.

If, as you assert, the English are stupid enough to think that Bush caused these bombings, there has been a terrible devolution since WW2.

Ha
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 09:26 PM   #76
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Re: Been thinking lately

Haha,

Please re-read the post and try to understand the underlying principles I was trying (briefly) to convey. One of the differences I was trying to highlight was precisely that superficial way in which you have reacted by not considering or commenting on the points raised but throwing in a red-herring that diverts the issue.

No one believes that Bush "caused" the bombings - what I said was that the behaviour of Blair, Bush and friends has heightened the likelihood that events like this will continue to occur. They are not directly to blame, but they haven't helped.

The main issue is not was has happened but what happens now. The UK reaction domestically will be very different from the US, for the reasons I briefly outlined.
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-14-2005, 10:49 PM   #77
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Re: Been thinking lately

Quote:
Originally Posted by Honkie
I disagree. The UK is (and Europe generaly) is far more prepared to live and deal with a level of war and terrorism. Remember, the "War on Terror" is a misnomer. It should be the "War on Terror of the type and by people that the US Government has suddenly decided it now doesn't like, after standing idly by for decades whilst it sponsored the terrorists it did like, and turned a blind eye to the fund raising and support of terrorists by it's own government members for the commission of bombings and atrocities abroad"
Yeah, but that doesn't fit on a bumper stick nearly so well!

Quote:
The notable difference in the UK, from my experience, is that the population is generally more level headed and pragmatic. As a group, they do not react in a knee jerk fashion. There will be no "Patriot Act" or the like. There will be no large scale rounding up of "Suspects" for shipment to the Isle of Wight for 3 years. The British, as a people would not stand for it. It goes against their basic views of individualism, freedom and tolerance and generosity.
It's my understanding that there are some areas of British law that reach farther than the Patriot Act, especially in the areas of surveliance, and I also understand that there are cameras just about everywhere in London. There won't be a knee jerk reaction because England already went "Patriot Act" back in the bad old days of the IRA.

Quote:
You may note, that whilst the individual bombers will be vilified (and rightly so) the larger ethnic group to which they belong will not be. CAVAET: I do not deny that small fringe groups will no doubt target a few Muslim owned businesses, shops or Mosques, but these people wll always do it and the bombing is an excuse rather than the prime reason for their actions.

What I am talking about is the ovewhelming majority of the population are not blaming or targetting Muslims per se. Indeed, I think you will find if you read the British or international media, that more of the resentment, blame and vitriol is being targetted at Blair and particularly the US Administration and Bush. They are felt to be to blame for bringing these unnecessary events back to the streets of the UK and I think you will notice a strong groundswell of unity in the people against these politicians and any and all legislation they try to introduce that curtials, impinges or affects induvidual freedoms etc.
Hmmm, I think it's just small fringe groups in the good 'ol U.S.A. that have targeted Muslims as well, but maybe our fringe groups are worse than England's. As far as Blair being blamed, it seemed everyone rallied around him afterwards, and he did just win another term, in an election that was supposed to be a judgement on his decision to go into Iraq.

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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-15-2005, 10:40 AM   #78
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Re: Been thinking lately

Quote:
Originally Posted by Honkie
The UK is (and Europe generaly) is far more prepared to live and deal with a level of war and terrorism.
Let's see, the Franco-Prussian war, WWI, WWII, the Berlin Airlift, the Cold War... yeah, I can see why UK/Europe is more prepared to deal with war & terrorism. It's a bit different when your property insurance doesn't cover artillery barrages & firebombing.

Are more of them trying to emigrate to the U.S., or are more Americans trying to emigrate to the UK/Europe?
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-15-2005, 01:28 PM   #79
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Re: Been thinking lately

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Let's see, the Franco-Prussian war, WWI, WWII, the Berlin Airlift, the Cold War... yeah, I can see why UK/Europe is more prepared to deal with war & terrorism.
Well, more recently they lived through decades of IRA bombings. I don't want to downplay the deaths, but I think it's true that people do get habituated to this stuff. Think of Israel. And compare the number of people who died from terrorists to deaths from car accidents, yet we still readily hop into our cars each day (still waiting for the Bush administration to tell me it's Code Orange on the 405 today).
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Re: Been thinking lately
Old 07-18-2005, 01:38 PM   #80
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Re: Been thinking lately

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Originally Posted by Honkie
Haha,

Please re-read the post and try to understand the underlying principles I was trying (briefly) to convey.
Oh Dear, Honkie, it appears that the British government disagrees with your thesis!

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...1,409269.story
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