Charitable donations pre- and post-FI/RE

[Jarhead*]

JG guessed USFWS in the past, and you're guessing the EPA.   I'm glad to see you guys aren't for sure where i work yet, cause i dont want my boss getting called!   

Ha knows! (Not sure about the "Whistler")

 

[azanon]

Ha knows! (Not sure about the "Whistler")

I hope not! :

 

[Martha]

... don't try to convince me to admire your inability to take care of yourself either (exampled by the fact that you're implying you actually need help). I've saved enough to be unemployeed for a few years myself. If you choose to live a life that's not proactive, don't come whining to me.

Also, the next time you evacuate, maybe consider taking your dad with you. There's no way in the world i would have left my dad behind in there, regardless of what he said. I love him too much.

I found nothing Austin Explorer said to be in the least bit "whining".

He also didn't say that he currently lived in New Orleans.

He didn't ask for help and I found no request implied.

As you say Azanon, it is difficult to read emotions from what is written here, but you sure come across as bitter and cold hearted at times. I hesitated to say this, but I personally believe you were unfair to Austin Explorer.

 

[azanon]

I hesitated to say this, but I personally believe you were unfair to Austin Explorer.

I think he was unfair and judgemental with me, and what i said was, as a result, warranted.  I dont take being called self-righteous very kindly, expecially when i did or said nothing to deserve that.  Also, he made comments about "how do i sleep at night".  

As i have said once now, i was simply truthfully answering the original poster's pseduo survey as to how I handle charities.   I gave an honest (not self-righteous) answer.

Your viewing me of bitter and cold-hearted, at times, is only from the perspective that you maybe find youself in.  I believe in a lot of things that might be view as bitter and cold-hearted by some;  such as darwinism and natural selection.   I'm also an agnostic.

.......

I saw last night on TV the estimate of all personal (non-government) donations for hurricane relief was approximately 750million dollars.    There are aprroximately 200-300 million people in the US.   Do the math.

.......

I'm really not bitter though Martha, i'm just very systematic in the way i go about things. I'm an INTJ too, so that might explain some of it. Really, like so many of us, i never seem to have enough money to do all the things I want to do. I feel like i have many weeks in which i'm really having to skimp by to get everything paid for. I almost have to chuckle at the thought or notion that i'm actually doing so well, that i can throw down serious money towards hurricane katrinia (over and above the amount i give indirectly via federal and state governments).

 

[P.S.]

REW:

I'm sure you're very proud of your SIL. Surely a man who cares for the well-being of thousands will take good care of your daughter.


From what I read others here donate, I would say we (DH and I) are very generous. But (trying not to drag religion into this), we try not to consider our money "our own." See the example of my parents and IL's. Own parents have very good paying professional jobs, and also have been very blessed in investments. Don't consider 10% the minimum, but rather they figure we need this much to live (and they live simply)... and so are very, very generous. For them, it's been a loaves and fishes experience over and over. Give ... and receive tenfold - how do you explain it otherwise?

Mom says... you can only eat one steak at a time, you can only wear one pair of shoes at a time. How much does an individual man need? The whole huge world to my small neighborhood is better when man's heart is giving.

 

[Martha]

I think he was unfair and judgemental with me, and what i said was, as a result, warranted. I dont take being called self-righteous very kindly, expecially when i did or said nothing to deserve that. Also, he made comments about "how do i sleep at night".

If that is the case, doesn't it make more sense to respond on point, by saying that it is unfair to call someone self righteous simply because they chose not to contribute to charities because they think they are doing enough by paying taxes?

Your viewing me of bitter and cold-hearted, at times, is only from the perspective that you maybe find youself in. I believe in a lot of things that might be view as bitter and cold-hearted by some; such as darwinism and natural selection. I'm also an agnostic.

I too am agnostic. I think natural selection is supported by science. But yes, my impression clearly comes from my perspective.

 

[azanon]

But (trying not to drag religion into this), we try not to consider our money "our own."  See the example of my parents and IL's. Own parents have very good paying professional jobs, and also have been very blessed in investments.

I see you as very modest and humble, not necessarily blessed.  You give the credit of you and your spouses, as well as your parents hard work that paid off, to God when, in fact, it was actually you guys that earned it.

If God was, indeed, the reason why you succeeded and continue to succeed, then how in the world do you explain people like me?

 

[azanon]

If that is the case, doesn't it make more sense to respond on point, by saying that it is unfair to call someone self righteous simply because they chose not to contribute to charities because they think they are doing enough by paying taxes?

I was on point, but that response wouldn't have been near as harsh and rude as his original comment. Since i was defending myself, I thought my response, as a baseline, should have been at least as harsh as his.

 

[Martha]

I was on point, but that response wouldn't have been near as harsh and rude as his original comment. Since i was defending myself, I thought my response, as a baseline, should have been at least as harsh as his.

This is where we disagree.

 

[azanon]

This is where we disagree.

If someone insisted that i pick the one thing that has made me successful in life, i'd choose my willingness and courage to stand up for myself; alone if necessary.

 

[Mr._johngalt]

If someone insisted that i pick the one thing that has made me successful in life, i'd choose my willingness and courage to stand up for myself;  alone if necessary.

Ditto, in fact I prefer to go it alone.

JG

 

[Mr._johngalt]

I see you as very modest and humble, not necessarily blessed.  You give the credit of you and your spouses, as well as your parents hard work that paid off, to God when, in fact, it was actually you guys that earned it.

If God was, indeed, the reason why you succeeded and continue to succeed, then how in the world do you explain people like me?

"Modest and humble".................2 words that have never ever been used to
describe me.

JG

 

[Mr._johngalt]

I think he was unfair and judgemental with me, and what i said was, as a result, warranted.  I dont take being called self-righteous very kindly, expecially when i did or said nothing to deserve that.  Also, he made comments about "how do i sleep at night".  

As i have said once now, i was simply truthfully answering the original poster's pseduo survey as to how I handle charities.   I gave an honest (not self-righteous) answer.

Your viewing me of bitter and cold-hearted, at times, is only from the perspective that you maybe find youself in.  I believe in a lot of things that might be view as bitter and cold-hearted by some;  such as darwinism and natural selection.   I'm also an agnostic.

.......

I saw last night on TV the estimate of all personal (non-government) donations for hurricane relief was approximately 750million dollars.    There are aprroximately 200-300 million people in the US.   Do the math.

.......

I'm really not bitter though Martha, i'm just very systematic in the way i go about things.   I'm an INTJ too, so that might explain some of it.   Really, like so many of us, i never seem to have enough money to do all the things I want to do.  I feel like i have many weeks in which i'm really having to skimp by to get everything paid for.   I almost have to chuckle at the thought or notion that i'm actually doing so well, that i can throw down serious money towards hurricane katrinia (over and above the amount i give indirectly via federal and state governments).

An "INTJ agnostic"? That's great! ..................if you were a bit more thickskinned you could
apply for membership in the John Galt Rangers. You get a neato badge
and a giant rubber finger which can be used to "give the bird" to libs
and such.

JG

 

[Austin_Explorer]

... don't try to convince me to admire your inability to take care of yourself either (exampled by the fact that you're implying you actually need help).  I've saved enough to be unemployeed for a few years myself.   If you choose to live a life that's not proactive, don't come whining to me.

No one in my family is asking for a dime from you, nor from anyone else.  Unlike many in the area, our family has the means to get their lives back in order.  I don't know of a single one in a public shelter or having received any of the FEMA checks and cards being handed out.

I've not lived a single day on unemployment, even when between jobs and haven't mooched off my parents since I moved out years ago.  I've never received government aid or charitable relief of any kind.  I think by most calculations that constitutes "taking care of myself".

My rant, and I'll admit that it was that, was not to get money for my family (we don't need it), but to call to attention that there are many who have lost everything and now have nothing but the clothes on their back.  Even the FEMA money will do little in and of itself to get them even remotely back to where they were.  It's pretty easy to be smug when your house is dry and in one piece and you've neither lost many members of your family or have been separated from them and have no idea if they are still living.

Current tax money is already spent on more programs than the taxes cover, so I think it is naive to think that the government can just do all of the work and that current taxes are more than enough to do the job.  Private citizens stepping in and filling in the gaps was critical, and donations (time and money) are the way to get that done.

Also, the next time you evacuate, maybe consider taking your dad with you.   There's no way in the world i would have left my dad behind in there, regardless of what he said.   I love him too much.

This is great.  You accuse me of abandoning my father.  That's rich.  I live in AUSTIN, TX.  And when the storm was getting ready to make landfall I was even farther away in Pennsylvania for training.  When I called and tried to convince him to leave he refused saying he didn't think it would be that bad.  I've already told him that if he doesn't get his arse out in the future I will come down there and drag him out myself.  I think he learned his lesson, but then he's old and set in his ways.  So the jury's still out on that one.

All of my other relatives had the sense to get out before the storm hit and no they didn't abandon him since they're on a different side of the family tree and have no contact with him so they were in no position to help.

So in summary, no I am not unable to care for myself nor are any members of my family (with the exception of the DUMB decision my dad made to try and stick it out, but then some might consider that an example of courage to stand on his own) and no, I did not abandon my family.

 

[Nords]

I'm now the person on the block who collects from the neighbors, instead of contributing money to fund a senior citizens monthly luncheon at our church, I work at the luncheon cooking, serving cleaning up - also Habitat for Humunity once or twice a week plus many volunteer opportunties throughout the church.

Welcome to the board, Becca!

Can you tell me more about what you do at your local chapter of Habitat for Humanity?  How did you get involved and what did you do on your first day?

 

[moghopper]

This is where we disagree. 

I think AzAnon has accurately described who he is, whether intentional or not.

Many guesses about which government agency he works for. I'd have to lean toward high up in FEMA at this point.

 

[laurence]

If someone insisted that i pick the one thing that has made me successful in life, i'd choose my willingness and courage to stand up for myself; alone if necessary.

All right, now I'm confused, weren't you lamenting having to live a lie just to get along with everyone else and go with the crowd where you live re: religion? Earlier you attributed your success in large part to your ability to tell people what they want to hear and blend in. You said this was a needed evil. Have you since come out of the closet? I would think your freedom of (non)religion being trampled by your coworkers/associates would be a fine opportunity to stand up for yourself, and a critical time to do it.

 

[Caroline]

Hey Austin:

I'm so sorry to hear that your family live(d) in New Orleans and has endured so much.  It's wonderful that they are safe and can care for themselves but, based upon my experience with the Oakland Hills fire, I know that this type of devastation destroys your ability to see the world as ordered, managable, and above all, FAIR.  It takes a LONG time to get over that feeling.

What is worse, this feeling that the world has been tilted on its axis can be impossible to explain to those who haven't shared it -- similar (though not the same as) a soldier's experience of combat  Those, like myself, who've never been in combat just cannot KNOW -- and the same is probably true for those outside the disaster zone.  Their "just world" belief has not been challenged and in all charity, I hope it never will be.

The bad news is that some people are going to appear callous and uncaring as a result.  (They may well BE callous and uncaring people.) They may suggest that the government can do everything despite incontrovertible evidence that government on all levels failed badly in this instance.

You have enough on your mind -- don't let it get to you.

The GOOD news is that there are literally millions of people across the country who have donated money, donated supplies and clothing, donated their time, and added their prayers and good wishes to the mix.  In New Orleans and across the state, individual acts of heroism were performed. The government came out pretty badly here, but MOST of the American people look pretty good right now.  There are small success stories and kindnesses everywhere.

Focusing on them may be of some help as we recover, examine what went wrong, and work to make it right.

Best of luck to you and all of those you care about,
Caroline  







 

 

[becca]

Welcome to the board, Becca!

Can you tell me more about what you do at your local chapter of Habitat for Humanity?  How did you get involved and what did you do on your first day?

 

[becca]

Sorry Nords, I don't know how to do this quote thing - but to answer your question about Habitat --

We orginally got involved through our church which had banded together with other local churches to build a house. You should be able to contact your local Habitat chapter if you would like to volunteer. You should be able to locate a local chapter by doing a search on the internet. They usually have opportunities to work both during the week or weekend - whatever suits your schedule and you can work one day a week, month or whatever. Our son has also gotten involved through his college chapter which is planning a spring break trip to LA/MISS to rebuild from Katrina - and his college is giving participants elective credits for this!

 

[Austin_Explorer]

Best of luck to you and all of those you care about,
Caroline

Thanks for the kind words Caroline!

 

[Nords]

Sorry Nords, I don't know how to do this quote thing - but to answer your question about Habitat --

We orginally got involved through our church which had banded together with other local churches to build a house.  You should be able to contact your local Habitat chapter if you would like to volunteer.  You should be able to locate a local chapter by doing a search on the internet.  They usually have opportunities to work both during the week or weekend - whatever suits your schedule and you can work one day a week, month or whatever.  Our son has also gotten involved through his college chapter which is planning a spring break trip to LA/MISS to rebuild from Katrina - and his college is giving participants elective credits for this!

I have the schedule of the local chapter, but I'm wondering what a new volunteer is assigned to do.

What exactly did you do on your first day? Haul trash, fill water cups, fetch tools? Or did you tape drywall? Were you assigned to follow around a more experienced volunteer or Habitat staff member? Or were you working independently?

 

[sailor]

What exactly did you do on your first day? Haul trash, fill water cups, fetch tools? Or did you tape drywall? Were you assigned to follow around a more experienced volunteer or Habitat staff member? Or were you working independently?

Nords, I'm not Becca but on our first day we did framing. The more experienced people were marking 2x6 and we were putting it together. Second day cutting ceiling joists. Third day - roofing - the crew leaders were doing the first row of shingles (scary part near the edge) and we did the rest.
Few other times we did carpentry (I built few porches, stairs and decks). Drywall once (walls not ceiling) and siding once.
High school kids are typically doing outside work like landscaping, hauling trash etc.

sailor

 

[becca]

Nords,

I started out making lunches for the workers. My husband started out doing framing (he had building experience). I believe my son did painting his first day. You can do whatever is your level of expertise, there is a leader of the project that will direct you along the way. Don't hesitate to participate in Habitat if you have no construction experience - you will be put to work in some capacity and will also learn how to do some things.

 

[REWahoo]

I posted earlier in this thread that my son-in-law had organized volunteers for a barbeque cookout for 1,000 evacuees at a shelter this weekend. He got a call from the Red Cross today telling him they were cancelling all such events. To quote the Red Cross spokesman: "The only donation we're accepting is money and suitcases to get these people out of here."

My first thought was they needed to move them to make room in the shelter for Hurricane Rita evacuees. But my SIL got the distinct impression the Red Cross was simply ready for the remaining shelter residents to get out and get on with their lives.

Guess a well seasoned hot plate of BBQ might encourage them to hang around longer?