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Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-30-2005, 12:27 PM   #1
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Family/Friend problems after ER?

Just curious, for those of you who ER'd, was there any fall-out from friends/family (aside from your spouse)? People shun you, get snitty, etc, etc?
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-30-2005, 12:42 PM   #2
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

People have shunned me forever so I haven't noticed any change.
But, I have noticed that my family thinks I retired for them. And I get a sense that my money is considered available. Sorta like, "if you have enough money not to work, why can't I borrow some?".
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-30-2005, 01:19 PM   #3
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Family thinks it's great! Hubby and I now have lots of time to help them out with home projects. (which, so far, we enjoy doing)

Friends still call to invite us to parties, go ATVing, or out for dinner.

Haven't been shunned yet.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-30-2005, 01:25 PM   #4
 
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

I told a long-time friend that I was retiring a few months ago. *His response was priceless: *he cocked his head in different directions and just looked at me like a dog watching television. *After ten or fifteen seconds, he kinda snapped out of it and said "Oh. *Hey, good luck."

Last week he confided to me that I caught him offguard. *I'm pretty much the first among peers who has been able to bail. *He hasn't said it explicitly, but I sense he might be discouraged, in that there is no clear end in sight for him. *Rhut-ro. *
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-30-2005, 01:51 PM   #5
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldAgePensioner
People have shunned me forever so I haven't noticed any change.*
But, I have noticed that my family thinks I retired for them.* And I get a sense that my money is considered available.* Sorta like, "if you have enough money not to work, why can't I borrow some?".*
I can certainly see this happening. Wouldn't the appropriate response be: "What happened to yours?"

Seriously though, perhaps the best way to answer such a question is that you wouldn't have been able to retire early if you had loaned your money out to friends and family. Family or friends that get offended (at either answer) aren't really interested in you, but rather only your money (since they obviously spent all of theirs). Accordingly, you shouldn't feel guilty about alienating them.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-30-2005, 08:36 PM   #6
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eric
...for those of you who ER'd, was there any fall-out from friends/family (aside from your spouse)?* People shun you, get snitty, etc, etc?
No, because I didn't tell anyone that I semi-retired, and when I fully retire they won't be told that either. Really, what's the point of advertising your retirement to your family and friends? Kinda vain.

If someone asks why you have so much free time, just tell them the obvious, that you cut down your work hours.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-30-2005, 11:29 PM   #7
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

My Mom tries to pay for me when we go out to lunch together since she knows I retired early without a pension

One of my brothers and I have ER in common now. I'm working on the other brother to save more and retire sooner--he's quite receptive. For the most part, my relatives are comparably well off or better, so I don't worry about being hit up for dough. But if it happens, I can honestly say that my money is tied up in investments.

My friends are happy for me, some a bit envious, and some have more $$ than I do, but don't want to retire on less than $2m or $4m. Silicon Valley left scars!
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 08:38 AM   #8
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

I posed the question because it has been my experience that people can be quite petty and small minded.

Not so much family, but so called friends.* My wife and I both lost a number of what we thought were "good" friends shortly after University.* One friend I had in particular was chummy-chummy while we were both working at Nortel and he was making more than I.

Then I quit my job, started my own company, and doubled my salary overnight.* Suddenly, emails take weeks to get answered, phone calls go unreturned.* We stopped hanging out.*

The last time I heard from him (about 2.5 years ago), I'd just gotten my Z.* I wasn't going to say anything but he happened to see me drive-by one day (one of our clients is near his place).* He sent me an email later that day to confirm that it was me, and finished it with "where the hell did I do wrong" (referring to himself).

Now, I've got a new set of friends who are of like employment and salary, but have little to no savings and basically spend-spend-spend.* When we got the cottage is made a bit of a ripple, but it didn't last.* However, I'm afraid that when we pull the trigger and ER that there will be some permanent effects.*

Its not that this changes any of my plans, I'm just wondering what to expect.

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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 09:16 AM   #9
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eric
I posed the question because it has been my experience that people can be quite petty and small minded.

Not so much family, but so called friends.* My wife and I both lost a number of what we thought were "good" friends shortly after University.* One friend I had in particular was chummy-chummy while we were both working at Nortel and he was making more than I.

Then I quit my job, started my own company, and doubled my salary overnight.* Suddenly, emails take weeks to get answered, phone calls go unreturned.* We stopped hanging out.*

The last time I heard from him (about 2.5 years ago), I'd just gotten my Z.* I wasn't going to say anything but he happened to see me drive-by one day (one of our clients is near his place).* He sent me an email later that day to confirm that it was me, and finished it with "where the hell did I do wrong" (referring to himself).

Now, I've got a new set of friends who are of like employment and salary, but have little to no savings and basically spend-spend-spend.* When we got the cottage is made a bit of a ripple, but it didn't last.* However, I'm afraid that when we pull the trigger and ER that there will be some permanent effects.*

Its not that this changes any of my plans, I'm just wondering what to expect.

Eric,

Jealousy has a nasty way of ending friendships. I have quite a few friends who are far more successful attorneys than me. Am I jealous of their success? Yes. Will I drop them as friends? No. However, I have found that as people become more successful than their friends, they have a tendency to drop such friendships in exchange for ones with similarly successful people. It sounds like the latter has occurred in your case, albeit not by your design or intentions. If you want to maintain friendships with people you knew "back in the day" or before you "made it", it's up to you to do so. Their jealously may throw up roadblocks, but you need to reassure them that you're not going to let success go to your head.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 09:18 AM   #10
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

I think we just discussed this in a couple different threads. I think the consensus was to get a cane and pretend you are on disability (reason why you are FIRE) and periodically whack people with it.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 12:18 PM   #11
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

What kind of ER do you guys think would be better received? The one retiring with at least 2 mil liquid (or more) living at the very minimum middle-class lifestyle including vacations and other costly ventures or someone who's more of a YMOYL minimalist who did so/is doing so primarily by playing great "defense" (minimized expenses)?

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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 01:06 PM   #12
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by azanon
What kind of ER do you guys think would be better received?* The one retiring with at least 2 mil liquid (or more) living at the very minimum middle-class lifestyle including vacations and other costly ventures or someone who's more of a YMOYL minimalist who did so/is doing so primarily by playing great "defense" (minimized expenses)?
Just like I would hate to work until age 65, I would also hate to live my life as if I had to worry about every penny spent.

I would think most people would need (want) certain things in retirement. Most people would want a decent home (not a mansion), good home-cooked food (not dinner at expensive restaurants), simple clothes (not silk suits or designer clothes), a car (not luxury), and some form of entertainment (not extravagant exotic trips).

As frugal as I am, I like to splurge occasionally, but I consider it a controlled splurge. I plan for the splurge and I make sure it doesn't throw me off my financial path. For example, I spend thousands of dollars on travel, not because I need to, but because I want to. It's in my budget and part of my FIRE plan. At some point, I may not want to travel as much, but for now I have it in my head that I want to see as much of the world as I can.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 01:23 PM   #13
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by azanon
What kind of ER do you guys think would be better received? The one retiring with at least 2 mil liquid (or more) living at the very minimum middle-class lifestyle including vacations and other costly ventures or someone who's more of a YMOYL minimalist who did so/is doing so primarily by playing great "defense" (minimized expenses)?
By "better received", I assume you mean "less likely to arouse unpleasant reactions from friends and family", per the thread header. In that case, it seems to me that the second alternative is going to be preferable. Conspicuous leisure bugs others a little; conspicuous consumption usually pisses them off.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 01:34 PM   #14
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Quote:
By "better received", I assume you mean "less likely to arouse unpleasant reactions from friends and family", per the thread header. In that case, it seems to me that the second alternative is going to be preferable. Conspicuous leisure bugs others a little; conspicuous consumption usually pisses them off.
Yes, this is what i was asking. I couldn't decide myself which might result in more scorn from peers.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 01:37 PM   #15
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Rule #1......worry about YOU first. *What others think about how you retire is their problem.

Rule #2.....spend what you want within your budget. *That means not too much or too little. *

Rule #3....retirement is for enjoyment without work. *If you are struggling to be frugal so you can afford to eat and have the basics in life; that seems like work to me. *If you struggle to keep up your lifestyle with your nest egg and you fear not having enough 20 years from now; then that seems like work too. *

Rule #4....live life to reduce your stress...see rule #3.

Rule #5....don't sweat the small stuff......everything besides family and friends is small stuff.
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?
Old 08-31-2005, 01:41 PM   #16
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Re: Family/Friend problems after ER?

Quote:
Originally Posted by astromeria
For the most part, my relatives are comparably well off or better, so I don't worry about being hit up for dough. But if it happens, I can honestly say that my money is tied up in investments.
This is the line I have given my wife for her to use on her family. It is true though. We have our cash reserves with x thousand dollars in it easily accessible. Everything else has already been invested/earmarked for investments. Loaning (giving) out money would mess up the "plan".

I'm thinking about making some future family loans with strings attached. Say, if they borrow $2000, then when they pay me back, they have to give me $1000 extra to hold for them until the next time they need to borrow money. It serves two purposes - to provide cash for me to lend to other broke family members and it acts a deterrent to borrowing, since the perceived cost to the borrower is an extra 50% of the amount borrowed. I feel a little like the Godfather though...

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