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Old 03-12-2011, 07:02 AM   #241
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I am not a miracle worker, so, I suppose I will just listen and express my concern.
That's probably all you can do. With one member of my family, and a couple more still in the works, everyone else will eventually just throw up their hands.

That's one thing I like about this board. DW and I sometimes look at each other and wonder "Are we the only ones who can plan beyond next Tuesday?"
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Old 03-13-2011, 02:51 PM   #242
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Thanks, Walt. My friend just reiterated the same intentions she has stated many times before. There doesn't seem to be any new awareness or decision. Only thing new is that she has to take the bus and doesn't like it. It was really tiresome listening to her. I see now that this friendship will not survive.
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Old 03-13-2011, 05:39 PM   #243
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Thanks, Walt. My friend just reiterated the same intentions she has stated many times before. There doesn't seem to be any new awareness or decision. Only thing new is that she has to take the bus and doesn't like it. It was really tiresome listening to her. I see now that this friendship will not survive.
I'm sorry to hear that - I know it's tough to lose a friendship. Even if you are growing apart and it's the best decision, it's still tough.
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Old 03-13-2011, 06:54 PM   #244
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I know a number of people who have very little but they don't ask for money and it is like pulling teeth to find out if they are in a jam and need help.
I have a friend like this. As far as I know he lives on less than $800 per month and never complains or has asked for a loan. Occasionally he will offer to sell me one of his possessions. I buy them then hang on to them as I know he will come along in a month or two and ask to buy the item back. I respect him a great deal and am ready to help him any way I can.
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Old 03-14-2011, 07:39 PM   #245
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I have a friend like this. As far as I know he lives on less than $800 per month and never complains or has asked for a loan. Occasionally he will offer to sell me one of his possessions. I buy them then hang on to them as I know he will come along in a month or two and ask to buy the item back. I respect him a great deal and am ready to help him any way I can.
That's such a nice thing to do and enables your friend to maintain his dignity.
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Old 03-16-2011, 02:48 PM   #246
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We just bought some tools from a friend who lost his job and was looking for some cash and had some duplicates in his shop. Beneficial for both parties.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:02 PM   #247
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I'm sorry to hear that - I know it's tough to lose a friendship. Even if you are growing apart and it's the best decision, it's still tough.
Thanks, Simple girl. The problem is not growing apart because of differing financial status/philosophy. For me, the problem is that she keeps repeating the same thing over and over and not taking action. She complains about everything. It gets so tiresome. I am worn out from this recession. Family members unemployed and broke. Friends with longtime financial issues that have suddenly become desparate. I can't help everyone all the time!
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:34 PM   #248
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Thanks, Simple girl. The problem is not growing apart because of differing financial status/philosophy. For me, the problem is that she keeps repeating the same thing over and over and not taking action. She complains about everything. It gets so tiresome. I am worn out from this recession. !
Not to be mean but I would limit my exposure to this friend . The constant complaining would drag me down and it obviously isn't helping her deal with it . She doesn't seem to want to do anything but complain and you are her sounding board .
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Old 03-18-2011, 07:31 AM   #249
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Moemg gave good advise. I also follow that bit of advise in my own life. You need to have some control over your environment and whether you want to be happy or not. I try to limit my exposure to negative, toxic people. Kinda like radiation exposure. I also get a dose at work, at which time it is hard to control exposures. However, retirement is around the corner...

As to your good life and having money...because you saved, etc., that did not happen because of luck. It came from sacrifice and planning. We all make the boats we row. I don't feel sorry for most of those people. And I do not understand why people don't learn from their mistakes and alter their behavior.

There is a story line here...something about a tortoise and hare...or grasshopper and ant...
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Old 03-23-2011, 02:48 PM   #250
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Moemg gave good advise. I also follow that bit of advise in my own life. You need to have some control over your environment and whether you want to be happy or not. I try to limit my exposure to negative, toxic people. Kinda like radiation exposure. I also get a dose at work, at which time it is hard to control exposures. However, retirement is around the corner...

As to your good life and having money...because you saved, etc., that did not happen because of luck. It came from sacrifice and planning. We all make the boats we row. I don't feel sorry for most of those people. And I do not understand why people don't learn from their mistakes and alter their behavior.

There is a story line here...something about a tortoise and hare...or grasshopper and ant...
Agreed, the "friend" needs to learn from her financial mistakes. Even listening and tacitly agreeing (by staying relatively silent or not forcefully condemning her behavior) simply reinforces the behavior.

What kind of a "friend" is someone who makes mistakes and then complains about such mistakes as if they weren't her fault?
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Old 03-23-2011, 03:35 PM   #251
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What kind of a "friend" is someone who makes mistakes and then complains about such mistakes as if they weren't her fault?
I really don't see that as an issue of "a kind of friend", but more one of differing world views. There are many who hold her world view, including some on this board (usually for others, as best I can see). It may be correct or incorrect in various circumstances; I can't really judge. If it is annoying enough, it is one's right to remove oneself from the annoyance. It is simply bad manners to start trying to correct friend's attitude, which for all I know may actually be a reasonable appraisal of her life experience.

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Old 03-24-2011, 01:25 PM   #252
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I really don't see that as an issue of "a kind of friend", but more one of differing world views. There are many who hold her world view, including some on this board (usually for others, as best I can see). It may be correct or incorrect in various circumstances; I can't really judge. If it is annoying enough, it is one's right to remove oneself from the annoyance. It is simply bad manners to start trying to correct friend's attitude, which for all I know may actually be a reasonable appraisal of her life experience.

Ha
True. Such a friend may have other redeeming qualities and you simply tolerate those that aren't so redeeming. The problem arises where such a friend continues to complain about problems of her own making. However, this can probably be addressed with a polite request not to hear any more complaints about financial problems.
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Old 03-24-2011, 01:40 PM   #253
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Not to be mean but I would limit my exposure to this friend . The constant complaining would drag me down and it obviously isn't helping her deal with it . She doesn't seem to want to do anything but complain and you are her sounding board .
Good advice. There are people who constantly complain about their jobs, their spouses, their children, their inlaws, their finances (usually just one area but sometimes multiple whines). Finally you get to the point of telling them, either do something about it or quit whining! Usually they just keep whining and that is what makes it the toxic relationship, as Moe said, constant complaining that drags you down and isn't healthy.

DH's sister has complained about her DH's job for years and years. We're so sick of hearing about it that we avoid them now.
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Old 03-27-2011, 09:34 PM   #254
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Good advice. There are people who constantly complain about their jobs, their spouses, their children, their inlaws, their finances (usually just one area but sometimes multiple whines). Finally you get to the point of telling them, either do something about it or quit whining! Usually they just keep whining and that is what makes it the toxic relationship, as Moe said, constant complaining that drags you down and isn't healthy.

DH's sister has complained about her DH's job for years and years. We're so sick of hearing about it that we avoid them now.
My method is the same-I just avoid the negative folks. However I know a few people that are more proactive and they deal with complainers by telling them "Stop! Please tell me something positive!" According to one person, that redirects the conversation and usually ends on a high note.

I think I'll stay with avoidance
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Old 04-05-2011, 07:58 AM   #255
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Would you pay for the home improvements of the second friend? If not then I'm not sure what their friendship has to offer.
Perhaps I've misunderstood the above. It seems to suggest that unless I would cheerfully pay for a friend's home improvements (a discretionary, big-ticket item, providing no benefit to me), that person is somehow unworthy of my friendship. I can't agree with that.

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My brother and his wife have no savings and they are in their fifties, and my sister in law has never worked, so no social security for her. They were never big spenders. Actually quite frugal. My brother just never made a lot of money, so not much left to save. How scary is that?
Not that scary. Apparently (?) they believed that despite brother's limited income, it was unnecessary for him to upgrade his skills and pursue better paying work, or for sister-in-law to work. Absent medical problems or similar issues beyond their control, those decisions were silly but they do represent choices, not fate.

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Too proud to take government assistance. I think she is foolish to not avail herself of services she qualifies for. She would much rather depend on friends and family.
If she is okay with 'borrowing' from friends and family, I suspect that pride is not an obstacle. More likely she is simply too lazy to bother going through the application process.

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I figure that if you haven't been able to get your act together then when the time comes and you can no longer work and only have SS then you won't be living in a house unless you have boarders like the golden girls. You won't go out to eat, you won't drive a fancy car, but an old clunker.
The above pretty much describes the modest lifestyle that many of us have voluntarily subjected ourselves to for some of our LBYM years ... been there, done that, don't feel terribly concerned for others who must now do it involuntarily.

We're not talking destitution here, folks.
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Old 04-10-2011, 03:08 PM   #256
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We went out to dinner last night with my sister and BIL and another couple who are their friends. It was an upscale place for us but we've been there before and enjoyed it very much so it was nice to go again.

My sister's friends were talking about how hard they work, how she never has time to cook and she uses a lot of convenience foods. She had just been to her favorite yarn store and bought some beautiful yarn but more than she'll use in a year, doesn't know when she'll have time to make anything. Then her husband pulls out his phone to show us pictures of his new present to himself, a 2006 Corvette convertible. GORGEOUS CAR! We all went to see it after dinner and I got to sit in it. It's a beautiful deep blue with leather interior and all the bells and whistles. He hadn't really been shopping for a car but he was browsing online and saw an ad and had to have it. This is their 4th vehicle and they are trying to figure out a way to add on to their 2 car garage. He mentioned a 5 year car loan. They also are still paying on their 2nd home in Florida.

After the tour of the Corvette we said our goodbyes and walked to our car, a 2001 Corolla. DH says to me, "I love my car, it's PAID FOR!" I'm so proud of him, things like that didn't used to mean much to him but now that he's retired he sees how LBYM makes a difference in your perspective.
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Old 04-10-2011, 04:21 PM   #257
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I have to praise a few people who shared knowledge with me when I was sorely in need. Other than being raised with a work ethic and a sense of fairness I had no one who ever showed me prudence in moderation of spending or in other indulgences at home. Working hard and not needing or taking assistance was the goal.

Lately I have been paying society back for this by sharing what so many of you know with my family and acquaintances. Like some of you said it can be hard to approach with out getting preachy or self righteous.

The last occurrence of this happened when I was out to breakfast with a friend. I had bought some stock a few months ago and made a few hundred dollars on it already. After he hi fived me, I told him I bought a dividend paying stock stock with the profit that pays me $5 a coule times a year for the rest of my life. So when you have to pay for your breakfast next year, my stock will pick it up for me. (not Tiffanies where we were eating)

Then I tell him an old guy had told me when I was young that he had enough electric company stock to pay for his electric bill, and enough water company stock to pay his water bill.

I could see the wheels start to turn in his eyes then.
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Old 04-11-2011, 07:08 AM   #258
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After he hi fived me, I told him I bought a dividend paying stock stock with the profit that pays me $5 a coule times a year for the rest of my life. So when you have to pay for your breakfast next year, my stock will pick it up for me. (not Tiffanies where we were eating)

Then I tell him an old guy had told me when I was young that he had enough electric company stock to pay for his electric bill, and enough water company stock to pay his water bill.

I could see the wheels start to turn in his eyes then.
Interesting story, that's kinda how I first started with investing in real estate. I first moved to downtown Chicago after completing undergraduate. Unfortunately I just bought a new car, so I needed parking, back in 1990, it costed $249 a month. I bought a foreclosure that cashflowed to help cover my parking, next one was to cover my small mortgage, etc. It has helped me a great deal. I tell people I stumbled into real estate but it's really my part time job for many years. Sometimes, I share this with family members when they consider their tight budget, a part time job/approach to extra $ .... the extras do help.
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Old 04-11-2011, 02:53 PM   #259
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I have two friends who have nothing. They bet their life savings on ventures that ultimately went south. So they are destined to work for the rest of their lives. But they are OK with that because, had those ventures taken off/worked out, they would be on easy street.

Even now, their life style is not too shaby even though they are living hand to mouth. It is not for me but I can see the rationale that they use.
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