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Old 08-11-2016, 09:04 AM   #21
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A few years back, I replaced my timing belt myself. The cost for the kit was around $125 as I recall. The kit included the water pump and the idler pulley. Something you don't want to replace 6 months later. It took 2 days to install in my driveway and another day to fix the 1-tooth-off problem the original installer (me) screwed up. In the mean time I found the bad radiator and a few other things that needed to be addressed.

I made sure that my next car had a timing chain.
Yeah, Now even DW says she'll ask before buying her next car!

That one-tooth problem would have wrecked an interference engine? Kind of scary to DIY if that's the case.

I watched a 3-part youtube series on replacing the belt and pump on the car in question. The guy had a QC check where he rotated by hand through a couple of turns to make sure the marks kept in alignment.

I'm not sure the car in the video had A/C and power steering, but if not, that would require equipment I don't have. Getting the water pump off in this car, according to the video, does not require removal of the drive wheel at the end of the front cam, but he said he did the removal for clarity of video purposes. And that required a special tool and a lot of muscle since it's torqued on there really tight. If I were going to do this, I'd need another video showing that it really doesn't need removal and still be able to get the water pump off. And there was a special tool to back-out some posts, but he said you could do that with vice grips. You also need a torque wrench (which I have) to torque things back properly (although I might not have each socket extension length required). I'm sure I could do it, but not sure I want to. I changed a clutch in my 1980 Celica, which of course requires dropping the transmission. Of course that was in my younger years, when I could get up off the concrete after 20 minutes and not groan too much.
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Old 08-13-2016, 07:05 PM   #22
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I don't know if my Olds Omega had a non-interference engine or not. I had driven it to 1K past it's 60K replacement time. Exiting the freeway after an hour trip, the engine died and would not restart. Towed it to my mechanic and it was the timing belt. No problem other than the $600 replacement (included plugs, wires, some other stuff as well IIRC).

I replaced the timing belt on my Mazda 5K after due (60K mileage due). 75K later, I sold the car to a friend for $100 (that's less than I could have gotten scrap.) He drove it for a year until the tranny gave out. "Expired" timing belt was still intact. You pays yer money... YMMV
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Old 08-13-2016, 07:50 PM   #23
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Despite having a reduced chance of catastrophic engine damage, a few things have me squarely in the replacement category now.
That's what I'd probably do, too. You might get many more years out of the car by replacing the belt now, and if you like the car that's worth something. (That money you'd be spending at Carmax is instead still in your account working for you, too). You also won't have that concern in the back of your mind about the vehicle leaving you stranded somewhere, so you'll get more utility (long trips okay) and pleasure from owning the vehicle for those years. IMO, the KBB value of the vehicle wouldn't mean much to me, since I know I couldn't get a replacement vehicle I'd trust as much for that price (reasons given by ERD50) and I'd intend to keep driving it, so its value today to others isn't very important.
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Old 08-14-2016, 10:31 AM   #24
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I have done my share of car repairs and maintenance over the years, but I am getting old.

Reading about car troubles now makes me want to get an EV, so there's nothing for me to do. When the battery in these babies dies, one just tows it to the dealer, writes a check for $20K (or is it $40K), and has it done quickly and cleanly.
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Old 08-14-2016, 11:14 AM   #25
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I have done my share of car repairs and maintenance over the years, but I am getting old.

Reading about car troubles now makes me want to get an EV, so there's nothing for me to do. When the battery in these babies dies, one just tows it to the dealer, writes a check for $20K (or is it $40K), and has it done quickly and cleanly.
I've had a hybrid for ten years and 99% of my repairs have be on the suspension.
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Old 08-14-2016, 11:18 AM   #26
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I have done my share of car repairs and maintenance over the years, but I am getting old.

Reading about car troubles now makes me want to get an EV, so there's nothing for me to do. When the battery in these babies dies, one just tows it to the dealer, writes a check for $20K (or is it $40K), and has it done quickly and cleanly.
Car troubles? Cars have never been more dependable.

Sent via mobile device. Please excuse any grammatical errors.
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Old 08-14-2016, 12:51 PM   #27
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One unknown variable in timing belt replacement calculus is belt quality. And yes, a belt failure can be dangerous.
In our case, the engine died just as my wife was pulling into traffic - premature @ about 45k miles. luckily the mishap was on a hill, so she was able to step on the clutch and roll back out of harm's way.
Reconstructing the failure, I see that the belt did not break - rather the teeth sheared off at the crankshaft 'gear' upon acceleration. It was a non-interference engine, so $27 for a new quality belt, problem solved. No more problems for the life of the car with future replacements at the recommended 60k interval.
Note - after inspection, I chose not replace the water pump. When it finally did fail at 120k miles, there was leakage but no other problem, i.e. - it did not seize or slip and cause a second belt failure. Data point of one.
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Old 08-15-2016, 07:57 PM   #28
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Don't think Timing CHAINS can't fail. Two weeks ago the tensioner on my timing chain broke and cause mistiming on my 2004 Honda Accord engine (an interference engine) which destroyed the engine. Mechanic wanted $3400 to put a new engine in the car. I said no, sold car for just above scrap. OK the tensioner broke not the chain, but all the timing chain and all related parts should have been changed. I'm not sure what the interval for this should be. Only got 12 years and 265000 miles out of that car. I was hoping for better.


Solved my problem, bought a 2017 Camry with a non-interference engine and timing chain.

Now that I think about it, why would anybody make an interference engine when you can just make a non-interference engine?
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Old 08-15-2016, 08:38 PM   #29
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Now that I think about it, why would anybody make an interference engine when you can just make a non-interference engine?
Just be glad you weren't driving a Cadillac (Northstar engine) or Mercedes Benz with both have timing chains that are known to fail prematurely. The repair would be much costlier than junking a Honda.

Some reasons for interference engines:

High compression is sought along with better combustion of fuel (emission control and performance).

It's an engineering thing.

Some cars also have "variable valve timing" which can bring in interference timing. Most diesels engines are interference.
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Old 08-15-2016, 09:08 PM   #30
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Timing belts suck. This is the only item besides oil changes I do for maintenance until something fails.
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Old 08-15-2016, 10:17 PM   #31
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Wait a couple more years when the EPA mandated particulate filters and associated emissions hardware shows up on the new gasoline engine cars. That stuff is on the diesels now and repairs for a timing belt are a pittance in comparison to a failed particulate filter system. Believe me, you will not be worried about timing belts after that gear is mandated. And a good bit of the equipment probably won't be covered under the federal 80,000 mile emissions warranty.
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Old 08-16-2016, 07:34 AM   #32
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Wait a couple more years when the EPA mandated particulate filters and associated emissions hardware shows up on the new gasoline engine cars. That stuff is on the diesels now and repairs for a timing belt are a pittance in comparison to a failed particulate filter system. Believe me, you will not be worried about timing belts after that gear is mandated. And a good bit of the equipment probably won't be covered under the federal 80,000 mile emissions warranty.
When I hired into MegaMotors (1981), one of the engineers told me he was buying a new car immediately because from then on, all the cars had an electronic ignition system - the beginning of the end!! I wonder if he still has that POS....
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Old 08-16-2016, 09:29 AM   #33
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In the mean time, I keep driving my 1988 F-150 buggy whip with gear-gear cam drive, manual transmission, hand crank windows and 0 cup holders.
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Old 08-16-2016, 09:40 AM   #34
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Wait a couple more years when the EPA mandated particulate filters and associated emissions hardware shows up on the new gasoline engine cars. That stuff is on the diesels now and repairs for a timing belt are a pittance in comparison to a failed particulate filter system. Believe me, you will not be worried about timing belts after that gear is mandated. And a good bit of the equipment probably won't be covered under the federal 80,000 mile emissions warranty.
There will be a big demand for workarounds to these things. Revising the OBD/computer to have it ignore the particulate filter sensor, or a dongle that replaces the sensor and always sends a happy reply, etc.
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Old 08-16-2016, 10:34 AM   #35
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There will be a big demand for workarounds to these things. Revising the OBD/computer to have it ignore the particulate filter sensor, or a dongle that replaces the sensor and always sends a happy reply, etc.
In California the biennial smog check would catch any tampering - data is sent directly from the vehicle to the DMV*. Very hard to bypass.

*Or, Air Resources Board, whatever the proper jurisdiction.
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Old 08-16-2016, 10:57 AM   #36
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There will be a big demand for workarounds to these things. Revising the OBD/computer to have it ignore the particulate filter sensor, or a dongle that replaces the sensor and always sends a happy reply, etc.
You can buy a DPF Delete tune for a diesel for ~$350. Not that it is legal, but tuners are selling them. You can also buy the piece of defeat hardware that fits where the DPF was installed. The DPF ECU sensor is eliminated also.
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Old 08-16-2016, 11:06 AM   #37
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In California the biennial smog check would catch any tampering - data is sent directly from the vehicle to the DMV*. Very hard to bypass.

*Or, Air Resources Board, whatever the proper jurisdiction.
If you have your own tune loader like I have, and the original bin file, it's easy, to upload the file and be OEM, then later reload the tune file.

Being in Texas like we are, and driving a diesel, there is no emissions check during inspection.

In California, the legal state (not local) environmental watchdog is CARB, the California Air Resources Board.
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Old 08-16-2016, 11:17 AM   #38
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2006 Toyota Tacoma was very easy and less than $100. Watch a couple of videos on the web and see if you can do it yourself and have the enjoyment of another step towards independence.
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Old 08-16-2016, 11:38 AM   #39
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the best thing to do is have 3 or 4 vehicles (and a short commute) so you never hit the 90K mark before selling or trading them in - works for me

I've only done one timing belt and that was because they had the engine apart redoing the valve train
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Old 08-18-2016, 07:26 AM   #40
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Slowly closing in on the 100K replace-timing-belt on my "new" car (2000). I'll have to check if it's interference or not (where would one find this info??) If not, I'll probably wait for it to break and then replace or scrap. It could come down to the "devil I know" when deciding whether to invest in the car. YMMV
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