where not to retire: key west

[lazygood4nothinbum]

what's 800 sq ft with 2 bedrooms, one bath, sits on a 5,000 sq ft spit of land and looks like a crack house? an $890,000 retirement home on key west. (no doubt marked down from $1.2 mm). just doesn't seem like something ya downsize to.



haven't been to key west since i moved there 25 years ago to become a partying maniac famous writer. i didn't care for the changes to key west but the drive there is still stunning. the water off the keys more blue than the sky.



i tried to plan my roadtrip to hit key west after tourist season but before summer. seems there is no longer such a thing. the place was mobbed. finally found a room right on duval at the southernmost point, across the street from a little beach.



the bike road beautifully in its new carrier, attached to the stang hitch. i love biking around key west. so many gorgeous old homes & a great harbour. here's a neat little alleyway i found which revealed the little courtyards behind the houses.



this is one of the places where i lived with an artist friend about 25 years ago. my hammock was on the middle floor in the far left apartment, overlooking the bull lounge and, of course, sloppy joe's on duval.

[mountaintosea]

Lovely photos. I'm adding Key West as one of my places to visit. I've been to Florida but only as far as St. Petersburg.

[Goonie]

I was in Key West a few years ago and thoroughly enjoyed it! I wouldn't mind living there (or most any of the lower keys) IF prices were MUCH cheaper!

I ended my visit there watching the sunset from Mallory Square....and watching all the weird interesting folks and performers...it was definitely a fun trip!

It was sooo nice and warm there....while it was in the 20's back here in northern Illinois! I called my (now former) boss that afternoon from Mallory Sq., just to let him know how "lousy" the trip & the weather was......he hung-up on me!

[SoonToRetire]

That's nuts. The water is pretty but I know at least 3-4 places with water and sky just as beautiful, with land scenery twice as pretty, and with homes under 300k. The problem is, everyone gets a spur up their butt to live in one place, and demand overruns supply until you get these crazy prices. The last one to buy is usually left holding the bag.

[Texas Proud]

Originally Posted by SoonToRetire

That's nuts. The water is pretty but I know at least 3-4 places with water and sky just as beautiful, with land scenery twice as pretty, and with homes under 300k. The problem is, everyone gets a spur up their butt to live in one place, and demand overruns supply until you get these crazy prices. The last one to buy is usually left holding the bag.

Care to tell us? And do they have some small condos cheaper??

Just curious..

[Orchidflower]

I checked into living in Key West a few years ago. Besides the fact that I am not a gay man (or gay, for that matter) and am afraid of hurricanes (one main road out of Key West, no thanks!) and the cost of housing was out of sight ($800K plus for a dumpy little old home, no thanks!), I vetoed the idea. Just my opinion.
However, it is really pretty from the ads...just not pretty enough to entice with all the negatives.

[Moemg]

Would not want to live there but a great place to visit .We stayed at the Cypress House .What a hoot!
The owner would ring a bell and start happy hour whenever the spirit hit him and instead of it being an hour it would go on for hours with tons of food and drinks .Right off Duvall St. great place to stay .

[SoonToRetire]

Originally Posted by Texas Proud

Care to tell us? And do they have some small condos cheaper??

Just curious..

I'll tell you some places but shhhhh.... mums the word :-)

One such area is the east coast of Puerto Rico around the recently closed Roosevelt Roads naval base. The base closure has depressed prices. Wife and I bought a vacation condo there. Condos with caribbean views begin around 180k, and homes around 300k. These are places with first class hurricane proof construction and reliable water and electric. If you don't need an ocean view you can get by 50k or so cheaper. And you're a little over an hour from San Juan, from a 3500 foot high rain forest, and several beautiful offshore islands with beaches named top 10 in the world by travel mags. Language primary spanish, but everyone also speaks english if you ask them. The area is just outside the tourist path, so you live there like a local, not many gringos around., which has its pluses and its minuses. Not a great place if you have kids in school or for year around, but great for a second home or vacation home. Also, home prices are inexpensive but food, gas, and everything else is at US or slightly higher prices. It helps to speak at least a little spanish. I'm fluent but wife isn't so I do a lot of translating for her.

The island of Vieques, one of the Spanish Virgin Islands, has now been discovered since the Navy left, and prices tripled, but you can still find an ocean view place for around 300k, just not right on the beach. I visited one on a hillside with a gorgeous view for around that price. vieques was recently named one of top 10 islands in the world for beauty in some mag. And even though it was used as a bombing range, that was only on the far eastern tip, not a problem for the rest of the island.

The other Spanish Virgin Island, Culebra, is a little pricier but if you are willing to take a chance there are some buys. There is one set of condos there where the developer went bankrupt for reasons that have nothing to do with their construction or their beauty, they got into an environmental contest with the locals. The locals thought the condos had tapped into the water system without all the permits, something like that. Those look out over mountains and ocean and are under 300, though you may have to wait for the environmental challenges to settle down. I recently visited another condo complex there 100 yards from the most beautiful beach n the island for under 200k but it had other issues. Wood construction, which meant no insurance, etc, but if you want to take the risk, you can't find a better location.

Here is just one example from the local online real estate list. There are better places than this one, but just to give you an idea:
http://www.clasificadosonline.com/UD....asp?ID=230404

There are other areas in and around Puerto Rico, around the Dominican Republic, and St Martin that I've also seen at reasonable prices but I'm not as familiar with them. There is long thread about inexpensive living in the DR on this forum.

The key to all these places, I think, is that they are just beyond the usual tourist path and just outside the gringo colonizations. Those tend to make the price skyrocket. The condos I mention on the east coast of PR, for example. are about 20 miles from a super exclusive area wth lots of gringos where prices begin at around 500k.

Remember, mum's the word :-)

PS Here are some of the St Martin condos I had seen a few years back, this one is listed at 87000 euros.
http://www.century21islandrealty.com/french176ha.htm

http://www.century21islandrealty.com/condos.htm

[lazygood4nothinbum]

Originally Posted by mountaintosea

Lovely photos. I'm adding Key West as one of my places to visit. I've been to Florida but only as far as St. Petersburg.

if you liked the causeways around st. pete, you'll love the bridges through the keys. it's actually quite pretty. i'd probably like florida even more if i didn't live here.

Originally Posted by Goonie

I was in Key West a few years ago and thoroughly enjoyed it...

I ended my visit there watching the sunset from Mallory Square....and watching all the weird interesting folks and performers...it was definitely a fun trip!

sunset at mallory square is nothing like my memory of it. the performing used to be spontaneous where now it is so staged. the entire waterfront used to be lined with all types of characters. some with no act at all yet thoroughly entertaining. this trip there were just three performers each with their own area evenly spaced along the waterfront. one guy even had his own sound and lighting system. there was nothing bohemian about this. i was only surprised that they did not have their city-issued permits in clear view.

also i recall more audiance participation. watching these guys now try so hard just to engage the audiance was a little sad. i don't know if the audiance has become jaded or more sophisticated, or if, 25 years ago, maybe just the drugs were better. certainly, the experience, in my mind, seemed more enhanced back then.

the little kids seemed to enjoy it. but the parents didn't even clap at the end of a performance. i was watching two kids mesmerized by a fire juggler. right in the middle of the act their parents insisted they move on. the kids obeyed but they were so disappointed. i don't imagine, that 25 years ago, people were rushing away from a good time, just to get to the next.

even the sunset itself wasn't what it used to be. it used to set over, of course, sunset key, which was a tree covered island just offshore. now it is an island covered in houses & condos & a hotel. when the sun used to set over the tree covered island, everyone applauded nature when the sun went down. but now no one showed their appreciation for what we'd all just seen.

Originally Posted by SoonToRetire

That's nuts. The water is pretty but I know at least 3-4 places with water and sky just as beautiful, with land scenery twice as pretty, and with homes under 300k. The problem is, everyone gets a spur up their butt to live in one place, and demand overruns supply until you get these crazy prices. The last one to buy is usually left holding the bag.

maybe so, but i've lived in south florida, the keys, the tampa bay area and the caribbean and i've spent a lot of time around sarasota & the bahamas. the keys are still very pretty to me. if i had an extra five million--which i don't & never will--i'd have a house there.

Originally Posted by Orchidflower

I checked into living in Key West a few years ago. Besides the fact that I am not a gay man (or gay, for that matter) and am afraid of hurricanes (one main road out of Key West, no thanks!) and the cost of housing was out of sight ($800K plus for a dumpy little old home, no thanks!), I vetoed the idea. Just my opinion.
However, it is really pretty from the ads...just not pretty enough to entice with all the negatives.

gee, thanx for listing being gay among hurricanes, high housing costs and the rest of all the negatives.

the scariest thing to me, besides the cost, the over-development, the new rude drivers, the congestion and the dissappointing sunset, was all the heterosexuals. i didn't realize there were so many of you, but you really show up on a supposedly gay island. it must be like being white in harlem. finally i can see why there is such a problem with population growth and global warming. frankly, i thought i was in disney land. because the only thing still gay about key west are the chamber of commerce ads and the flaming str8 families who come to gawk at the few remaining flaming homosexuals.

instead of being on key west, i felt like i was in the twilight zone and i cut my stay there short because of it. there are only four or five gay bars left on the entire island. i have that many within walking distance of my house. either my gaydar was down or i actually saw only about 20 gay people the entire time there. i don't know from where they import all the gay people for their fantasy fests. my guess is that key west has become nothing more than a temporary & occassional pilgrimage to a place we thought we could call our own. who knows, maybe one day we will actually have our israel where we can feel safe too. a long time ago, we thought it was key west.

"will the last fags leaving key west please bring the rainbow flag with them."~~a gay saying

[SoonToRetire]

Originally Posted by lazygood4nothinbum

i don't know from where they import all the gay people for their fantasy fests.

Gays? It's a fantasy fest. During the week they're all working in antigay lobby groups or preaching against gays from the pulpit :-)

[lazygood4nothinbum]

Originally Posted by SoonToRetire

Gays? It's a fantasy fest. During the week they're all working in antigay lobby groups or preaching against gays from the pulpit :-)

so funny, so sad and so true. ain't that something that the very party keeping gays from being treated as full human beings has brought to power the likes of president reagan with a gay son and vice president cheney with a gay daughter. what's up with that?

ps. i agree with your take on the beauty caribbean land/seascapes. there is something about a green mountain or dark cliff diving down from the sky into azure seas. makes me wonder: what am i doing in fort lauderdale? as to investing there, i'm not sure i've the stomach for putting so much money on the fringe of so much poverty. sure looks like a great place to rent though.

[Nords]

Originally Posted by lazygood4nothinbum

what's 800 sq ft with 2 bedrooms, one bath, sits on a 5,000 sq ft spit of land and looks like a crack house? an $890,000 retirement home on key west. (no doubt marked down from $1.2 mm). just doesn't seem like something ya downsize to.

I was going to answer "North Shore surfer house" or "Kahala teardown", but then I realized that the lot is way too big... although with 800 sq ft and two bedrooms you could probably fit three generations and a couple dogs.

[SoonToRetire]

Originally Posted by lazygood4nothinbum

makes me wonder: what am i doing in fort lauderdale? as to investing there, i'm not sure i've the stomach for putting so much money on the fringe of so much poverty. sure looks like a great place to rent though.

I believe most places offer their own beauty, except for parts of Kansas :-) Even though the Ft Lauderdale area lacks the mountains you see in the caribbean, it has great beaches and lovely mangrove lagoons where I love to go kayaking. I remember once before I put my kayak in, I asked the guide if there were alligators there. He said no, so I put my kayak in, then he said "but there might be crocodiles." Fortunately I've seen neither in all my kayak trips down there.

About poverty, now I'm going to sound like the elitist snob that I sometimes am. You're right about being on the finges of poverty, but OTOH, that's what keeps the prices down. The problem is not the poverty, but crime associated with poverty. In the immediate area where we own there's not much poverty, but there are areas maybe 5-10 miles away where I would not go because they are not only poor but have a lot of crime. In that way it's not much different from our nation's capital area where we have our primary home. There are places in DC I would not get within a mile of, and that are embarassments to our claim to live in a prosperous and progressive society.

Anyway, our place and the ones we prefer are all gated communities with security, so crime is not an issue. You're right, though, about investment concerns, not from poverty or crime but appreciation is not very good. So they may not be good investments, but pretty good rentals, or 2nd/ vacation homes. That's why I said I would not recommend them for year round living or for families with kids. Unfortunately, as soon as a place becomes a good investment it shoots beyond my pocketbook, as most of the good parts of Florida are nowadays.

[Goonie]

Originally Posted by SoonToRetire

I believe most places offer their own beauty, except for parts of Kansas :-)

My sister's blind cousin said he really loved all of the spectacular scenery he saw in Kansas!

[chinaco]

DW and I flew into Miami and drove down the keys. Nice drive! I would recommend it for a week trip.

[donheff]

I spent a week in Key West a few years back and loved it. I think it is crowded because there is a substantial set of tourist types (like me) who like lots of good restaurants, shops, beaches, quaint houses, bike friendly, etc. Key West has all of that. DW and I want to spend next February or March in someplace like that - but it needs to be drive too-able since we want to take the dogs. Key West is a possibility. Any other suggestions where we could walk or bike to restaurants, beaches, quaint s***, etc? Oh, and gays are fine too. In fact, the presence of a substantial gay population is almost a guarantee on the restaurant scene.

[JPatrick]

Originally Posted by Goonie

My sister's blind cousin said he really loved all of the spectacular scenery he saw in Kansas!

Real nice post goonie, my sister actually DOES have a blind cousin.

Oh, in case you were about to ask, no they are not married and not even from West Virginia.