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Old 11-12-2010, 11:20 AM   #21
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I don't really want to drive a "beater" but I don't feel a need to repair every dent, ding and scratch on a depreciating asset. I'd sooner spend that money on proper maintenance so it may look ugly but is not likely to break down.
Fair point. Once a car reaches the 5-year mark, it's expected to have dings and nicks. However, significant dents that are flaking paint and/or rusting don't convey a good impression. An older car doesn't need to be in mint condition, but it does need to look well maintained.
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Old 11-12-2010, 11:20 AM   #22
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What does she mean by "big shiny assets?"

If it is a true asset -- even diamond rings -- should be easy enough to turn into retirement funds once that conscious choice is made

Large salaries can only create freedom, not slavery. If someone earns and spends $25 000 per year, that means someone else who takes home $250 000 can work one year and take the next nine off

The stuff is never what forces us to continue working and spending. A person can always walk away. It is the mindset that forces someone to do that. And that, too, can always be changed at any time. If it can be dropped at anytime, that isn't slavery

If a person is working 80 hours per week to afford their expensive cars, houses and vacations all that means is they value those things more than they value relaxing at home with coffee and a newspaper. Just as we are free to work however much we want, we're also free to not judge people based on those sorts of values
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Old 11-12-2010, 11:21 AM   #23
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Fair point. Once a car reaches the 5-year mark, it's expected to have dings and nicks. However, significant dents that are flaking paint and/or rusting don't convey a good impression. An older car doesn't need to be in mint condition, but it does need to look well maintained.
Agreed, but by the time a car is 5+ years old, how much will cosmetic repairs cost compared to how much it will increase resale value?

By the way, I consider rust removal and rustproofing damage which exposes bare metal as part of proper maintenace.
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Old 11-12-2010, 11:41 AM   #24
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The stuff is never what forces us to continue working and spending. A person can always walk away.
That is far too rosy a picture IMO. Most working Americans are trapped in a web of debts and other obligations. They can't walk away. They are not free. Only the very smart or lucky ones find a way out.
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Old 11-12-2010, 11:49 AM   #25
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That is far too rosy a picture IMO. Most working Americans are trapped in a web of debts and other obligations. They can't walk away. They are not free. Only the very smart or lucky ones find a way out.
So what you're saying is that it is the liabilities, not the assets. Or the exact opposite of what was claimed in the original quote

Further, you can't always walk away from the stuff you bought last year. But you can always walk away from buying more stuff
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Old 11-12-2010, 11:52 AM   #26
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Further, you can't always walk away from the stuff you bought last year. But you can always walk away from buying more stuff
Another way I look at it is this -- if it *really* will enhance my enjoyment of life, I'll buy it; we're fortunate enough to not need overly scrutinizing every dollar of discretionary spending. If not, well... in that case, choosing not to buy something that costs $X would feel almost the same as earning an additional $X (tax-free).
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"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

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Old 11-12-2010, 11:54 AM   #27
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Don't mess with the power of the Dave Ramsey sticker.
I love it!
I must report a downside to the sticker, though, as a friend once suggested I pick up the tab for our happy hour drinks, you know, 'cause I got that sticker and all. I was like--how the heck do you think I got that sticker? It wasn't by picking up bar tabs!
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Old 11-12-2010, 12:15 PM   #28
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So what you're saying is that it is the liabilities, not the assets. Or the exact opposite of what was claimed in the original quote
Tom, for most Americans, the assets and their associated liabilities are inseparable. There are very few big houses without big house payments.
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Old 11-12-2010, 12:28 PM   #29
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Tom, for most Americans, the assets and their associated liabilities are inseparable. There are very few big houses without big house payments.
Which is what makes housing a liability. . .
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Old 11-12-2010, 01:03 PM   #30
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Large salaries can only create freedom, not slavery. If someone earns and spends $25 000 per year, that means someone else who takes home $250 000 can work one year and take the next nine off
There's a lot of truth to that. I certainly know more folks who are happily FIRE'd who earned a fairly hefty compensation package and LBYM'd than folks who earned a very modest compensation and LBYM'd. If you don't make it, ya can't save it!

I think the author draws too much of a correlation between high earners and high spenders. Sure, that happens. But my obervation in life is that plenty of high earners save more bux per year than low earners.

Wish I'd been a high earner!
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Old 11-12-2010, 01:50 PM   #31
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There's a lot of truth to that. I certainly know more folks who are happily FIRE'd who earned a fairly hefty compensation package and LBYM'd than folks who earned a very modest compensation and LBYM'd. If you don't make it, ya can't save it!

I think the author draws too much of a correlation between high earners and high spenders. Sure, that happens. But my obervation in life is that plenty of high earners save more bux per year than low earners.

Wish I'd been a high earner!
For a really high earner, it is easy to spend enormous amounts and still save enormous amounts. I also do accept that in many careers one who aspires to hit it really big does have to spend more than people who have found their level and are just trying to grind it out. It is very hard to just save $10-$30mm. It comes in big hunks, big bonuses, successful businesses sold, big commossions and big rain making which overall are less likely to be events in the life of someone driving an old Accord. Not impossible, but less likely in an urban environment anyhow.

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Old 11-12-2010, 05:29 PM   #32
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significant dents that are flaking paint and/or rusting don't convey a good impression
They convey the right impression for me when I'm driving my beater: back the eff off, because you can see I obviously don't give a damn.

Then again, I'm in the city and don't drive to work, so I don't worry about impressions.
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Old 11-12-2010, 06:31 PM   #33
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They convey the right impression for me when I'm driving my beater: back the eff off, because you can see I obviously don't give a damn.

Then again, I'm in the city and don't drive to work, so I don't worry about impressions.
A useful strategy when driving in Boston. I found while living there the traffic laws were more like "guidelines".

My wife says it also helps to have a beater appearing car in parking lots - everyone parks well away from her so no trouble getting back into the car.

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Old 11-12-2010, 06:59 PM   #34
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Back when I was an auditor working the tuff neighborhoods of Washington DC, I intentionally drove an old beat up, stick shift car. After someone plowed into me in traffic, I didn't get the damage repaired. Just let the dented parts rust in peace. No worries about parking it on the streets. It was always there waiting for me after my work to take me home again.
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Old 11-12-2010, 10:17 PM   #35
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I find it ironic that conservative top executives, who probably loathe the idea of any sort of national health plan, are happy to offer a high-end corporate health plan, free flu shots, health screenings, corporate "wellness officer," wellness site on the intranet, etc, etc. In other words, no problem with big brother being involved with your personal health matters, as long as it serves the purpose of binding employees to the job.
Don't forget that the govt had a hand in promoting this, it isn't strictly the 'conservative top executives' idea.

The govt provides tax write offs for many of those benefits. So it is cheaper to offer a benefit as part of total compensation to attract talent than it is to offer salary (and pay SS on that salary, etc). So they do it, 'cause they're smart and that's the rules that Congress set up. So blame Congress.

And it really snowballs in good times. Once company offers this benefit, another counters with that, rinse/repeat...

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Old 11-13-2010, 05:41 PM   #36
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I wonder if mega corp's like to hire employees with large student loan debt as well? It seems like a fair amount of hires within my work area have six figures + in loans. I don't think anything could be more binding than $120,000 in student loan debt, a recently purchased townhome for $220,000 and plans to have a couple kids (or already have one or two) over the next couple of years. This type of scenario seems very common.

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Old 11-13-2010, 05:58 PM   #37
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Naw, if colleges were really building slaves they'd let you graduate without a single course in finance, negotiation, or investing.
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Old 11-13-2010, 10:39 PM   #38
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I wonder if mega corp's like to hire employees with large student loan debt as well? It seems like a fair amount of hires within my work area have six figures + in loans. I don't think anything could be more binding than $120,000 in student loan debt, a recently purchased townhome for $220,000 and plans to have a couple kids (or already have one or two) over the next couple of years. This type of scenario seems very common.
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Naw, if colleges were really building slaves they'd let you graduate without a single course in finance, negotiation, or investing.
"Just sign here for the five-year commitment and we'll pay for your MBA!!"
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Old 11-13-2010, 10:56 PM   #39
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Don't mess with the power of the Dave Ramsey sticker.
I love it!
Gotta be honest, I think SC is the home and breeding ground for POS cars, I saw MANY last time I was there........
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Old 11-15-2010, 08:30 AM   #40
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Nah, FinDude, you you were just hanging around with the wrong crowd. We got plenty of fancy Escalades and pimped out cruising cars if you travel in the right circles.
I am actually looking for a new POS now, and bummed that prices for used cars are much higher than at any point in the recent past.

Tight supply of used cars ups value of trade-ins | The Columbus Dispatch
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