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Old 12-22-2008, 07:05 PM   #81
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However in those societies Dad gets to pick the groom or at least has veto power.
Exactly my point. We have evolved into such kid centric society, that parents are expected to make huge sacrifices for the kids but it wrong for the parents to exert any control over their choices. If DD or DS wants to go to grad school to study African Art at an Ivy League, parents aren't allow to complain that this may not be the most marketable degree. If Susie at age 30 decide that she wants to be a single mom, like the Hollywood stars, parents are expected to provide on demand baby sitting and financial support. They aren't suppose to argue that deliberately having a baby without a second parent is a bad idea. Same thing with wedding, don't like your kids choice, open your pocketbook but keep your mouth shut.

It is probably good I am not a parent, because I think what is increasingly becoming conventional wisdom about respecting our childrens life choice is often bunk.
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Old 12-22-2008, 07:22 PM   #82
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My wife reminded me today that we once went about a year without any contact from my daughter. Typically, I can go for weeks leaving voice mails with no reply. I asked her what was the reason that time, we both couldn't remember.
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I'm not close to my niece but I haven't forgotten why. Frankly, I would wait for an invitation before deciding on a gift.
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Old 12-23-2008, 01:32 PM   #83
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If my Daughter hung up on me because my gift was not large enough the amount would then go to zero. You do not owe your Daughter a wedding. I especially would not pay for a wedding with a Groom I did not approve of.

My parents and my wifeís parents each made some small contributions to our wedding. My wifeís parents paid for the Hotel room we were married in. My parents paid for the wedding invitations. My wife and I paid for the rest. I think the total cost was no more that $3,000 for everything. Twenty five years later and two kids we are still married just the same.

My Daughter was thinking of marrying her boy friend she was living with. She asked through my wife what I would be willing to pay for a wedding. I said nothing. I donít approve of him. (Just for background info he helped her run away from my house when she was 17.) Later she broke up with him. I asked my wife if I had been expected to pay for the wedding would I now be expected to pay for the divorce?

Later my Daughter thanked me for not paying for it because my refusal kept her from doing it. She finally realized I was right. Took six years though.
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Old 12-23-2008, 07:00 PM   #84
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Flip side of the approving the Groom/Bride to be: if down the line the marriage is a disaster then you will get the blame for not foreseeing the problem.

I recall telling my Mother of my engagement and being asked "Why?" She asked interesting questions.
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Old 12-23-2008, 07:22 PM   #85
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I thought the "bride's parents pay" tradition was an echo of the former dowry tradition, where the groom effectively agreed to provide life-long support for the bride (and raise children) but was partly induced to do so by the capital she relinquished to him, in the form of a dowry. Sounds kind of mercenary that way.
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Old 12-23-2008, 08:07 PM   #86
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Well we have a big family get together on the 26th my daughter and her fiancee will be there. I have decided that I will act like nothing is wrong. If my daughter brings up the money, I will tell here that this is not the time or the place to discuss this. If you want to talk about this in a more private setting that would be fine.
What I don't want is a big fight in front of the whole family.
I really appreciate all of your reply's.
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Old 12-23-2008, 08:14 PM   #87
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Well we have a big family get together on the 26th my daughter and her fiancee will be there. I have decided that I will act like nothing is wrong. If my daughter brings up the money, I will tell here that this is not the time or the place to discuss this. If you want to talk about this in a more private setting that would be fine.
What I don't want is a big fight in front of the whole family.
I really appreciate all of your reply's.
Now that will be a class act that nobody can argue with. Good luck!
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Old 12-23-2008, 10:04 PM   #88
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I recall telling my Mother of my engagement and being asked "Why?" She asked interesting questions.
The suspense is killin' us here-- what happened next?

When my mother died, Dad offered Mom's jewelry box to my spouse and told her to take her pick. As we went through the inventory we found not one but three separate engagement rings, only one of which had been given to Mom by Dad.

It was the first time in nearly 30 years that he'd learned of their existence, and we may never know the stories behind them...
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Old 12-23-2008, 10:38 PM   #89
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To the fiance financial bashers: wait a minute! Maybe Miss 25 yr old is bossy at home too (not just with Dad) and the thought of asking fiance to take $$$ from "her" lifestyle now is apalling! (so sad!) Mr. 40 yr old could just be trying to keep the peace at home - and not getting in the middle of the wedding funding drama.This girl is doing her best to call all the wedding hoopla shots. Since he has probably been through this before, odds are good that whatever she has in mind will come to fruition. All he has to do is show up. (disclaimer - I have heard this repeatedly - and do not necessarily agree)
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Old 12-24-2008, 03:38 PM   #90
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Well we have a big family get together on the 26th my daughter and her fiancee will be there. I have decided that I will act like nothing is wrong. If my daughter brings up the money, I will tell here that this is not the time or the place to discuss this. If you want to talk about this in a more private setting that would be fine.
What I don't want is a big fight in front of the whole family.
I really appreciate all of your reply's.
Good luck with this. Can you set up a webcam, in case it doesn't go as planned?
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Old 12-24-2008, 04:40 PM   #91
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I recall telling my Mother of my engagement and being asked "Why?" She asked interesting questions.
Back when I told my Mother that I'd proposed to my DW of 13 years, her response was "Wonderful! Is she pregnant"? In hindsight, 2 of Mom's 3 marriages were pregnancy-first situations, so maybe that seemed normal to her.

Back on topic, neither of our parents contributed financially to our wedding, and we never would have asked or expected them to. The total cost of the wedding was around $15k, from what I remember.
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Old 12-24-2008, 08:33 PM   #92
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I don't think it matters how much they make, if it's a second marriage for him, or if they already own a home.

This is your daughter's first marriage, and hopefully her last. Do you want to be part of making it memorable for her, or not?

Give what you feel comfortable giving, and don't be pressured into more than you can afford. But what you give, give freely.

As for the previous posters who say "nothing for the spoiled brat," yes, it appears that your daughter needs more work on her manners and appreciation. But holding a gift to her wedding hostage probably isn't the most productive way of going about it. Say something along the lines of "We love you very much and are sorry you feel slighted by our gift. Know that we give it in love. In time, we hope you understand."

Then go the wedding, smile, and ignore the barbs that might come your way. It is a big deal -- it's a public pledging of a now-private bond. I'd try to be as graceful as you can.

Good luck!
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Old 12-25-2008, 10:24 PM   #93
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I'm not sure why the occasion can only be memorable if it involves spending lots of money. I am sure that the world over there are stories of wonderful weddings done on a shoe string.

When DH and I married we eloped so that took care of any financial obligations from either family. However, even if we had of chosen the traditional route, I would not have expected my parents or in-laws to contribute anything, knowing their financial situations.

I'm a big advocate if you want to be a princess for a day you should put your money where your mouth is and pony up the bucks yourself. Oprah did a show on this some years ago, and it was amazing the amount of money some women spent on weddings, and in most circumstances it was money they did not have. What did seem to be a common theme, that in each of these events the female involved had a strong desire to be the centre of attention and the poor sap she was marrying was going along for the ride to keep her happy. I would love to see the stats on how many of these marriages make it past the 5 year mark.
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Old 12-25-2008, 10:35 PM   #94
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I'm not sure why the occasion can only be memorable if it involves spending lots of money. I am sure that the world over there are stories of wonderful weddings done on a shoe string.

When DH and I married we eloped so that took care of any financial obligations from either family. However, even if we had of chosen the traditional route, I would not have expected my parents or in-laws to contribute anything, knowing their financial situations.

I'm a big advocate if you want to be a princess for a day you should put your money where your mouth is and pony up the bucks yourself. Oprah did a show on this some years ago, and it was amazing the amount of money some women spent on weddings, and in most circumstances it was money they did not have. What did seem to be a common theme, that in each of these events the female involved had a strong desire to be the centre of attention and the poor sap she was marrying was going along for the ride to keep her happy. I would love to see the stats on how many of these marriages make it past the 5 year mark.
It seems to be some sort of cross-cultural thing, where some women want to be 'modern' (go to school and earn money) AND want to be 'traditional' (have parents and husbands pay for everything).

Chose either or neither, don't expect both.

Sorry, feeling kind of crabby; mostly supported myself.
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Old 12-26-2008, 01:41 AM   #95
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What did seem to be a common theme, that in each of these events the female involved had a strong desire to be the centre of attention and the poor sap she was marrying was going along for the ride to keep her happy.
Let's hear it for the poor saps of the world, otherwise known as men.

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Old 12-26-2008, 10:17 AM   #96
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I'm not sure why the occasion can only be memorable if it involves spending lots of money. I am sure that the world over there are stories of wonderful weddings done on a shoe string.
I strongly agree with this statement by Danger Mouse. My ceremony was the shoestring type as we are both frugal, and we had a ball. No regrets. We try not to buy into the constant stream of TV, radio and print that shows us what we must spend in order to be "normal".

By the way tonight is the big family party, hopefully there will not be any fireworks. I talked to my son yesterday and he asked me why my daughter was angry with me. He is very tight lipped, but obviously totally knew what was going on. He said my daughter wanted me to pay for her wedding, I replied that depends on how much she wants to spend.
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Old 12-26-2008, 11:31 AM   #97
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I strongly agree with this statement by Danger Mouse. My ceremony was the shoestring type as we are both frugal, and we had a ball. No regrets. We try not to buy into the constant stream of TV, radio and print that shows us what we must spend in order to be "normal".

By the way tonight is the big family party, hopefully there will not be any fireworks. I talked to my son yesterday and he asked me why my daughter was angry with me. He is very tight lipped, but obviously totally knew what was going on. He said my daughter wanted me to pay for her wedding, I replied that depends on how much she wants to spend.
Good for you! In my experience, it really isn't about the wedding or the money, it is looking for a pound of flesh for some perceived slight in the past like a divorce or other unpleasantness growing up.

My brother's daughter is playing this passive aggressive game with him. Although he gave her a 'free" college education, she chose to be a history major and of course was unemployable after graduation. She went back for a law degree using student loans, but could never pass the bar exam. She has demanded that he fork over $60K for her student loans for law school. But, I don't think the issue here is money, either. I'm sure that if he gave her the cash, there would be another demand.
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Old 12-26-2008, 11:34 AM   #98
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Good for you! In my experience, it really isn't about the wedding or the money, it is looking for a pound of flesh for some perceived slight in the past like a divorce or other unpleasantness growing up.

My brother's daughter is playing this passive aggressive game with him. Although he gave her a 'free" college education, she chose to be a history major and of course was unemployable after graduation. She went back for a law degree using student loans, but could never pass the bar exam. She has demanded that he fork over $60K for her student loans for law school. But, I don't think the issue here is money, either. I'm sure that if he gave her the cash, there would be another demand.
Has anyone ever heard stories like this about a son? I haven't, but I have heard plenty about daughters. Is this just sampling error?

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Old 12-26-2008, 11:41 AM   #99
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Ha: your have reinvigorated this discussion I am sure. I have also have not seen many, if any, involving Sons either.
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Old 12-26-2008, 12:03 PM   #100
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My niece recently got married. She comes from a very broken home, her parents were a pothead married to an alcoholic. She was raised by her elderly grandparents. She escaped from all the bad stuff by isolating herself in studies, was valedictorian in high school and had a full scholarship to a private college where she met her husband. Her mother and grandparents could not provide any kind of wedding but her husband is an only child and his parents offered to give them a big wedding, which they could afford. They gave her the budget and let her plan whatever she wanted.

She planned a lovely reception, including a cocktail hour with fruit, cheeses, SHRIMP, etc. Then on to a beautiful dinner with a DJ and dancing and open bar. There were lots of personal touches including childhood pictures of the bride and groom at each table.

They were thrilled to be able to have a big wedding with all their friends and family. Knowing her, if there had been no budget she would have been just as happy to have a simple wedding at a bargain price.

She's in graduate school, her new husband is an accountant and they already have a condominium.

And then my sister has a friend who took out a 2nd mortgage to pay for a wedding for their son. His fiancee was raised as a foster child and had no close family and no money. They loved the DIL2B and wanted to give them a big wedding. 5 months later the couple split. But the 2nd mortgage is still with them.
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