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Old 02-27-2015, 01:26 PM   #21
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My point, though I acknowledge it was omitted, was predicated upon equal performance between the two types of employees.
If that was truly the case (it never is), in the interest of fairness I'd flip a coin and find some way to try to make it up to the other one. Face time still wouldn't (or shouldn't) be a consideration. IMO.
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Old 02-27-2015, 03:09 PM   #22
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WFH is becoming an encouraged norm at a lot of big companies these days.

I would guess that about a fourth of my company is WFH at any one time. All of our meetings are on webex and we are expected to be reachable via IM. The company has started moving towards more of a hotel model for cubes. I imagine that the real estate cost savings are large.

A lot of our call center folks are completely WFH. Since all of their performance metrics are measured via the call systems, their performance is just as easy to monitor at home as in the office.

I think the people who think it is just an opportunity to slack off are underestimating the ability to slack off in the office. I can post to this forum from the office just as easily at the office as I can at home.
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Old 02-27-2015, 10:39 PM   #23
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I think the people who think it is just an opportunity to slack off are underestimating the ability to slack off in the office.
While looking busy. There's a reason a lot of early computer games had a boss key. I don't know if the newer ones do, but I wouldn't be surprised.
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Old 03-02-2015, 09:11 AM   #24
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Very very good comments and points made by everyone who participated in the discussion.

I HOed the last ten years of my career. Really worked well for me and the type of job I had at the time. I am sensitive to the non face to face subject that was mentioned if you are in outside sales like I was. Video conferencing was gaining traction the last few years and I only used it because of extreme need to. Customer either insisted on it, time limited or the savings on the expense versus a face to face was clearly realized by both parties.


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Old 03-02-2015, 10:30 AM   #25
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My mega corp is definitely moving to a model of having a large number of staff work from home offices. It saves a huge amount of $s for the company.

I have been working from home FT for about 4 years. In my next job, assuming the commute is 1/2 hour or less, I want to work back in an office. I am hugely productive at home, but I find that the boundaries between work/home life become much more blurred - for myself and for my colleagues. I am essentially "on-call" from 7:30 am (my normal time for firing up the laptop in my home office) to late at night. Emails are always coming in, calls from west coast staff can come in as late as 9:30pm. For some reason, I feel much more tied to the job and have a much harder time disengaging. I am not distracted by needing to do housework or run errands. (I find I still need to do all that on the weekends, because I didn't do it while working at home). I pretty much get on the computer and phone and work more than a full day.

I think if I went back to working in the office, I would gain more control of my off hours. You fire up the computer when you get to work and close up shop when you leave. It seems counter intuitive, but well, that's how it is for me. I guess I'm not good at setting up the time boundaries when I'm working from home. When I have face-to-face client meetings (at least once a week), my work days seem much shorter...

To the OP, yes, take all vacation time! Life can be, unfortunately, short.
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Old 03-02-2015, 01:13 PM   #26
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Very very good comments and points made by everyone who participated in the discussion.

I HOed the last ten years of my career. Really worked well for me and the type of job I had at the time. I am sensitive to the non face to face subject that was mentioned if you are in outside sales like I was. Video conferencing was gaining traction the last few years and I only used it because of extreme need to. Customer either insisted on it, time limited or the savings on the expense versus a face to face was clearly realized by both parties.
.
Good for you. I gave serious consideration to being a ho after I retired, but figured I'd starve to death due to lack of paying customers. So I just ER'ed.
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Old 03-02-2015, 01:27 PM   #27
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A good supervisor will know if WFH-er is actually getting work done or just goofing off.

My experience with people is that those who W'dFH got a whole lot more done than those in the office...no interruptions!

We also had one guy who NEVER took a day off or vacation...turns out he was embezzling and had to be there in order to keep all the balls in the air!
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Old 03-02-2015, 01:57 PM   #28
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We also had one guy who NEVER took a day off or vacation...turns out he was embezzling and had to be there in order to keep all the balls in the air!
I've heard it said that this is a common warning sign for somebody cooking the books.
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Old 03-02-2015, 03:52 PM   #29
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We also had one guy who NEVER took a day off or vacation...turns out he was embezzling and had to be there in order to keep all the balls in the air!
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I've heard it said that this is a common warning sign for somebody cooking the books.
That's often how they get caught too - they get too sick or injured to come in, someone else starts poking around the books and mail... and the light bulb goes on.
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Old 03-02-2015, 03:57 PM   #30
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I've heard it said that this is a common warning sign for somebody cooking the books.
I recall when it was common practice in banking and other financial jobs to force employees to take off two consecutive weeks vacation. I guess the thought was you might be able to cover up for a week but two you would be discovered.
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Old 03-02-2015, 04:03 PM   #31
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I recall when it was common practice in banking and other financial jobs to force employees to take off two consecutive weeks vacation. I guess the thought was you might be able to cover up for a week but two you would be discovered.

Yes - this is common practice. I used to work at a large bank, and we were required once a year to take two weeks off in a row. They allowed you to structure it around holidays if you wanted so you could use less vacation time, but at least once every calendar year you had to take off two weeks in a row. Some didn't like it, others did.
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Old 03-02-2015, 04:14 PM   #32
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That's often how they get caught too - they get too sick or injured to come in, someone else starts poking around the books and mail... and the light bulb goes on.
I am taking 3 days off next week. I hope the megacorp's IT does not find the records of my posting to ER.org while I am gone.
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Old 03-04-2015, 06:24 PM   #33
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Yes - this is common practice. I used to work at a large bank, and we were required once a year to take two weeks off in a row. They allowed you to structure it around holidays if you wanted so you could use less vacation time, but at least once every calendar year you had to take off two weeks in a row. Some didn't like it, others did.
Wow, that would be nice. Every company I've been at has frowned on 2 week vacations, and my last one would actually deny most requests for it.

The only people who usually got the OK to take vacations longer than a week were Indians who are going back to visit family. A couple times US natives were allowed to take more than 1 week at a time, but generally management said they wanted you to split it up into no more than a week per quarter.
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Old 03-13-2015, 09:19 AM   #34
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At age 49, I'm 18 months into my first ever WFH job managing a team of 13 across the country, most of whom also WFH. It is different, and mostly positive. Each month, I spend 4 days in headquarters. I find I still have to make appointments to talk with people who are right across the room, just as if I were at home. There are lots of distractions, such as impromptu meetings with people I only see there once/month (happily, in one case). Some people at HQs never seem to leave their cubes, often with earbuds in, don't socialize much and might as well be at home. I haven't developed a firm opinion but, for a slight introvert like me, WFH works pretty well on balance. I don't commute, don't shave every day or put on a tie. I don't have to go buy lunch out. I also like the geographic distance from my boss. Sometimes it gets lonely. On the other hand, it is certainly still w*rk and not retirement so my time is not yet fully my own. All I can say so far is, I like diverse experiences and WFH is certainly a different one for me.


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Old 03-13-2015, 09:27 AM   #35
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I did WFH for a good portion of the last 13 years that I worked (along with a fair amount of traveling). I dreaded the day that we did teleconferencing (like Skype) instead of telephone conference calls since that would mean that i would have to shave and get out of my pajamas.
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Old 03-13-2015, 12:33 PM   #36
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My apologies to those of you still w*rking but I had to peruse this thread to see what I am NOT missing from the w*ork world. I gotta tell you...being retired is absolutely fabulous!!!
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Old 03-13-2015, 01:49 PM   #37
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When I first began working PT in 2001 after working 16 years FT, I also worked out a mostly telecommuting deal. I came to the office one day a week for 6.5-7 hours then worked the rest of my 20 hours per week at home. Some of those telecommuting hours included time on weekdays during the day so those at the office would know I was available. The rest of those telecommuting hours I could use any time I wanted, at night or on weekends or extra hours during the day on weekdays. Because most of my tasks involved running and testing and maintaining my own programs for the division, it was far better to take those programs down for testing and maintenance during the off-hours so it would not interfere with coworkers trying to run them. Also, running lengthy programs took less time (and resulted in lower system charges to my division) when run at night or on weekends.


I went out of my to not take advantage of this good arrangement. If things were slow, I'd take some vacation hours to get to 20 hours a week.


But in late 2003, after 27 months of this arrangement, the company ended all open-ended telecommuting deals. I could still work my 20 hours per week but I now had to fulfill them at the office. I was devastated and knew this would lead to my eventual undoing (i.e. ER), mainly due to the return of horrible commute even 3 days a week. I began ramping up my ER plan and in 2007 I reduced my weekly hours worked to 12 (2 days a week), then down to the coveted ZERO in late 2008 (ER).


I made sure to stress in my exit interview that it was end of the telecommuting deal in 2003 which greatly pushed me to leaving the company after 23 years. Although in all fairness I told them I had become so burnt out from the commute that even if they offered me my old telecommuting deal from 201-2003 I would reject it flat out.
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Old 04-01-2015, 02:55 PM   #38
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Ask Neil Neal Patterson how he feels about the company gym. Tick Tock.
Worst management communication ever?

----------

I have gone over the top. I have been making this point for over one year.

We are getting less than 40 hours of work from a large number of our KC-based EMPLOYEES. The parking lot is sparsely used at 8AM; likewise at 5PM. As managers -- you either do not know what your EMPLOYEES are doing; or YOU do not CARE. You have created expectations on the work effort which allowed this to happen inside Cerner, creating a very unhealthy environment. In either case, you have a problem and you will fix it or I will replace you.

NEVER in my career have I allowed a team which worked for me to think they had a 40 hour job. I have allowed YOU to create a culture which is permitting this. NO LONGER.

At the end of next week, I am plan to implement the following:
1. Closing of Associate Center to EMPLOYEES from 7:30AM to 6:30PM.
2. Implementing a hiring freeze for all KC based positions. It will require Cabinet approval to hire someone into a KC based team. I chair our Cabinet.
3. Implementing a time clock system, requiring EMPLOYEES to 'punch in' and 'punch out' to work. Any unapproved absences will be charged to the EMPLOYEES vacation.
4. We passed a Stock Purchase Program, allowing for the EMPLOYEE to purchase Cerner stock at a 15% discount, at Friday's BOD meeting. Hell will freeze over before this CEO implements ANOTHER EMPLOYEE benefit in this Culture.
5. Implement a 5% reduction of staff in KC.
6. I am tabling the promotions until I am convinced that the ones being promoted are the solution, not the problem. If you are the problem, pack you bags.

I think this parental type action SUCKS. However, what you are doing, as managers, with this company makes me SICK. It makes sick to have to write this directive.

I know I am painting with a broad brush and the majority of the KC based associates are hard working, committed to Cerner success and committed to transforming health care. I know the parking lot is not a great measurement for 'effort'. I know that 'results' is what counts, not 'effort'. But I am through with the debate.

We have a big vision. It will require a big effort. Too many in KC are not making the effort.

I want to hear from you. If you think I am wrong with any of this, please state your case. If you have some ideas on how to fix this problem, let me hear those. I am very curious how you think we got here. If you know team members who are the problem, let me know. Please include (copy) Kynda in all of your replies.

I STRONGLY suggest that you call some 7AM, 6PM and Saturday AM team meetings with the EMPLOYEES who work directly for you. Discuss this serious issue with your team. I suggest that you call your first meeting -- tonight. Something is going to change.

I am giving you two weeks to fix this. My measurement will be the parking lot: it should be substantially full at 7:30 AM and 6:30 PM. The pizza man should show up at 7:30 PM to feed the starving teams working late. The lot should be half full on Saturday mornings. We have a lot of work to do. If you do not have enough to keep your teams busy, let me know immediately.

Folks this is a management problem, not an EMPLOYEE problem. Congratulations, you are management. You have the responsibility for our EMPLOYEES. I will hold you accountable. You have allowed this to get to this state. You have two weeks. Tick, tock
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Old 04-01-2015, 03:02 PM   #39
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Caused CERN to drop 22%. I've read several articles that suggest this was the worst management communication ever. Think Harvard Business Journal suggested that!
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Old 04-01-2015, 04:20 PM   #40
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Caused CERN to drop 22%
Correct.
"In three days, the stock price fell to $34 from almost $44."

However today it's at $73.
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