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Old 05-24-2013, 03:04 PM   #21
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It is hard to think rationally about choosing a mate. Just remember it is a downspout not a compass.
We have some brilliantly creative people on this board. Thanks for the laugh!
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:05 PM   #22
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The virtues of childfree lifestyle. I'm not sure childfree couples truly appreciate their blissful circumstance. Like drinking a glass of refreshing water in an oasis without first having crawled across a blistering desert.
I think you are right. I did recently spend a lot of time with grand nieces and nephews. Frankly, I don't know how people who have kids in their mid or late 40's survive without dropping dead.
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:32 PM   #23
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I wish it were only so easy to find someone that matches exactly what you are looking for.

I do value marriage and kids so I would like to finally settle down soon. It is difficult/impossible to find someone that is perfect.

I have found in life that rich girls are generally better educated, more interesting, and driven - but they are also much less likely to value frugality. On the other end of the spectrum are hippy type girls that are happy making their own clothing (or going nude...), but I find they are generally denser. (No offense to people from either category on the thread...)

Then there are other values - religious, personality, social - as well as appearance that needs to be factored in.

I just wonder if it is to much of a compromise to marry someone that fits all of the other categories except the frugality. Very difficult to think about.

Especially if the girl is from a wealthy family where they might even assist in keeping up her standard of living (and thereby raising my own as well). I definitely am not looking to gold dig and don't even know if I would like living that lifestyle. I think there is something good to be said about eating what you kill rather than relying on hand outs.

Has anyone married a spouse that did not share similar financial background and ideals?
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:38 PM   #24
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Financial compatibility might not be the #1 element for a happy marriage, but I'd certainly place it in the top 3.
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:40 PM   #25
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You might be in for a tough search -

"The online bank ING Direct recently conducted a survey that asked participants to name words that might come to mind if someone offered to set them up with a person described as frugal. Of the respondents, 27 percent answered "stingy." 15 percent said "boring." Only 3.7 percent said sexy."

If Frugality a Turnoff?
Dating Frugal People - Frugality Turns Women Off - Marie Claire

So for the male posters here with frugal wives, where did you meet her? I guess you found one of the coveted 3.7%.
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:47 PM   #26
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A good way to find frugal females would be to join them in cheap but healthy pastimes like hiking and swimming: sports that don't require much equipment!
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:51 PM   #27
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A good way to find frugal females would be to join them in cheap but healthy pastimes like hiking and swimming: sports that don't require much equipment!
Good idea. I'd add Pilates or yoga classes to your list.
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:51 PM   #28
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So for the male posters here with frugal wives, where did you meet her? I guess you found one of the coveted 3.7%.
Just by pure luck, at the same large apartment complex. It both took us about 5 years to find each other too. We didn't marry young.

And she is definitely 1 in a 100. We both feel fortunate to share many important values.

I've recently hung out with one of my BILs, and he is crazy unfrugal. He invited me to country club outings and other money draining activities. Man, it is not my scene at all. Despite the fine wine and good food, I didn't like it at all. I can say to the OP if your girl likes country clubs and you expect to hold onto the cash, fuggetaboutit.

(Off topic: it is ironic that I have one BIL living in a shack in the woods, and another who basically lives in a country club quaffing fine wine. The contrasts of people in my life.)
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Old 05-24-2013, 04:17 PM   #29
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Marrying early is what we did, which I guess made it easier not to be so picky, like some of my friends who are in their late 30s and early 40s and still not married. I think there is a lot of analysis paralysis that happens when you wait a longer time.
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Old 05-24-2013, 04:58 PM   #30
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.............
So for the male posters here with frugal wives, where did you meet her? I guess you found one of the coveted 3.7%.
Wife #1 was frugal until we both started earning a lot, then she started feeling like she was being deprived while I was saving like crazy for FIRE. She got half my 401(k) and I got half her expensive private dance lessons.

Wife #2 found me in the used husband bin at Match.com. But by that time of life you either have frugality credentials or not. I could see how she lived and managed her money and I had confidence that we were compatible in that sense. So far, so good.
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Old 05-24-2013, 05:37 PM   #31
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I wish it were only so easy to find someone that matches exactly what you are looking for.

I do value marriage and kids so I would like to finally settle down soon. It is difficult/impossible to find someone that is perfect.

I have found in life that rich girls are generally better educated, more interesting, and driven - but they are also much less likely to value frugality. On the other end of the spectrum are hippy type girls that are happy making their own clothing (or going nude...), but I find they are generally denser. (No offense to people from either category on the thread...)

Then there are other values - religious, personality, social - as well as appearance that needs to be factored in.

I just wonder if it is to much of a compromise to marry someone that fits all of the other categories except the frugality. Very difficult to think about.

Especially if the girl is from a wealthy family where they might even assist in keeping up her standard of living (and thereby raising my own as well). I definitely am not looking to gold dig and don't even know if I would like living that lifestyle. I think there is something good to be said about eating what you kill rather than relying on hand outs.

Has anyone married a spouse that did not share similar financial background and ideals?
Since marriage and children are a goal in your life, do not dismiss every opportunity or you will end up a lonely old man. I agree with most posters that it would be very beneficial if she shared your financial values. Do not make looks the number 1 value in a permanent relationship. If things would go south she will not appear pretty no matter what she looks like at separation.
To your question: Yes, I was married to a spouse who had parents who had a decent lifestyle and grandparents treated her like a goddess paying for all her college and bought her a new car at graduation, etc. Trouble was, I did not come from any money and we both entered careers that did not pay much. So she had a wine appetite on a beer budget. I was in charge of the budget, but she was in charge of the credit cards and checkbook. That was not a good strategy. The more she spent, the more I wanted to hoard. It ended after 5 years. 20 years later, we have remained friends through raising our child. She is now a very responsible person financially and appears to be in great shape. If we had met later in life it may have worked out. At my age of pushing 50, I am in Ha's camp. I will never marry again, but I believe my GF of 6 years will eventually move in with me.
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Old 05-24-2013, 06:05 PM   #32
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Seems like the important topic of life goals should come up in a discussion at some point in the relationship well before you contemplate getting married. If her goal is constantly having you make more money to keep her lifestyle up in the manner to which she is accustomed, tell her sounds good, use her for what you want, then dump her.

Conversely, run by her your idea of using your high paying banking job to save up a pile of money that will enable you to slow down the pace a bit and [insert whatever floats your boat or yacht here]. If she bolts, she just saved you lots of alimony and equitable distribution losses down the road (and maybe mega child support).

Seems like financial harmony is up there pretty high on the list of things that are important.

Ditto the ideas of doing cheap things. Is a picnic in the park or a hike in the woods just as enjoyable to her as a $200 dinner with wine or an evening of cocktails and clubbing? Pretty good test. Maybe you can afford the expensive dinners and cocktails and clubbing, but it would take a lot of funds to engage in those activities (and competitive luxury goods shopping).
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Old 05-24-2013, 06:14 PM   #33
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Thanks Mulligan - that is exactly the type of relationship I am scared about.
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Old 05-24-2013, 06:29 PM   #34
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Like Ha and Mulligan and (I imagine) many other divorced men and women, I never plan to marry again.

But you know what?

1. I don't feel like marrying the first time was a mistake. I want to experience life and live every bit of it to its fullest. Marriage and having children are huge experiences and not ones that I would want to miss out on, even though once is enough.

2. Now, marrying a second time? For me THAT would be a mistake.
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Old 05-24-2013, 09:21 PM   #35
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Thanks Mulligan - that is exactly the type of relationship I am scared about.
Banker, you are in a different spot in life though than I was then, and where W2R, Ha, and Myself are now. W2R's first point on her last point is very telling and basically seconded by Ha in his own humorous way, that marriage with the children was not a mistake. It just didn't work out, and at our points in life it is not needed again. But we are not 30 years old and wanting to start a family. You are already older and have a sense of perspective, something that I didn't really have at a younger age.
You seem like you have a firm grip of who you are and what you want. It is out there, just be patient, yet don't be too dismissive right off the bat on anyone. Enjoy the ride, so to speak, and you will know when the time comes if the relationship is worth continuing.
My best friend for the past 25 years is currently in his mid 40s. The vast majority of the time it would be the three of us; me, my girlfriend of the day, and him going to do things together, as he never could find anyone to date. About 10 years ago, he was resigned to the fact that he would be single his whole life despite not wanting that. Then out of the blue he finds him a sweet little cutie, 15 years younger than himself. Fast forward, and now he has been happily married for 8 years with 2 lovely kids. Sometimes it just takes time to find what you want!
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Old 05-24-2013, 09:23 PM   #36
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I would say it was some work to get here, but honestly once you are used to LBYM, maximizing income, and investing wisely, it hasn't really felt like a sacrifice. It's a way of life I enjoy.

My issue is that I've been dating a lot recently and find that many girls are high maintenance - especially those from rich families. They enjoy shopping for pleasure, expensive vacations, etc...

It's also been shown that most divorces stem from financial issues.

My question is, how much weight should one put on looking at a potential spouses money habits? Is it more important to find someone that is intelligent , attractive and shares similar interests? Would you not pursue someone that seemed excellent except for being loose with money?

What if the woman comes for a rich family so is used to that way of life? I don't think I could support a woman that solely shops at high quality designer brands. I also wouldn't feel comfortable taking hand downs from a rich family either.

Any thoughts?
I have 6 years on you, and am in the same boat (never married yet, although have been engaged twice - LONG stories on that).

After making crazy extreme financial sacrifices and being a UPAW (ultra-prodigious accumulator of wealth) for most of my 20s and early 30s, there's no way in hell I would consider marrying someone that spends money like water. Some of my previous relationships were with women who were like that - only you don't really see that until after a little bit of time. There are ways to pick up on things like that initially through indirect means, but I save the verdict until I'm certain.

My main way of meeting women is through eHarmony. At least on that site, you can get matched up with women who often share some important traits - including some financial habits, but also other general interests and personality traits. It's certainly not a sure thing, but definitely easier/better than randomly meeting women at _______ (insert any method here), or just looking at random profiles on match.com or some other website. I wouldn't specifically tell you NOT to use other means, but just be extra vigilant in your search for the right potential spouse, and don't you dare waver on your standards.

However, having said that......in the area of fiscal compatibility, I have realized that because I can be off the charts in terms of sacrificing and denying myself expenditures, there's almost no way I'd ever find a female counterpart with my similar drive to accumulate wealth and retire early. So you have to be realistic and realize that if you meet someone who has a lot of great qualities, yet saves, say, "only" 10% of her income, that still puts her in the a very rare group these days. Don't you dare think you'll find someone with your exact same drive - you WILL have to 'make a concession' on that specific point.

Also, everyone has different paths in their past. Some make bad decisions and learn and grow from that. Seeing what their overall attitude and current direction is is better than seeing what financial means they currently have (which I think you already are looking at, but just wanted to iterate it and keep it fresh in your mind
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Old 05-24-2013, 10:55 PM   #37
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The virtues of childfree lifestyle. I'm not sure childfree couples truly appreciate their blissful circumstance. Like drinking a glass of refreshing water in an oasis without first having crawled across a blistering desert.
This childfree couple spent the day at Seaworld. We may not live in the desert, but we've seen it close up. .

To the OP, I'll chime in and say that shared values are the most important quality in a partner. Don't marry a princess. Marry a partner who wants to shoulder the burdens and joys of life together. There is nothing better.

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Old 05-24-2013, 11:18 PM   #38
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Get to know Scientist or Engineer chicks. We tend to be highly analytical and good at calculating compound interest. And we combine high-paid careers with a lack of fashion sense, so no splurging on clothes or shoes.
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Old 05-24-2013, 11:52 PM   #39
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Any thoughts?
Don't get married at all. Get financially independent and then split your time between Thailand and Brazil. You will be happy.
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Old 05-25-2013, 12:23 AM   #40
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Get to know Scientist or Engineer chicks. We tend to be highly analytical and good at calculating compound interest. And we combine high-paid careers with a lack of fashion sense, so no splurging on clothes or shoes.
Co-signed! My software engineer wife is more frugal than I am, and currently makes slightly more than I do (we've traded top earner status several times over the years).

This thread makes me glad to have married young, before either of us had any appreciable assets. Apparently, I hit the marriage lotto.
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