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Old 12-07-2015, 10:26 AM   #41
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...


As far as details - we plan to share specifics (not necessarily exact numbers, but definitely account details) with our children when they are adults. My husband had to play detective on his parents assets when he became legal guardian. MIL had accounts squirreled away all over the place - plus stacks of paper bonds. (Treasury direct didn't have the complete list since some were very old... but given bond numbers confirmed they hadn't been cashed out.) I do not want to make my kids go through that detective work. Hence I have a "in case of death/incapacitation" document. (Even DH doesn't know all the details since he has less interest.)
+1 on this. We couldn't do our detective work until FIL was dead and gone and it is REALLY hard to uncover ALL the accounts. It was also very depressing to see the money he wasted on a FA who stole him blind charged high fees and put him in unsuitable/expensive investments. He had also made a royal mess of his estate with account co-ownerships and beneficiaries that contradicted his will in such ways that the conditions of his will could not be carried out.

I have been working on the "just in case" documents to try to make it easier on the kids and/or DW. At least DD#1 knows the password to my computer and Quicken. That info ALONE would have helped us out a LOT with FIL.
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Old 12-07-2015, 12:36 PM   #42
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I never talk specifics or even amounts. I typically generalize and just say in retirement you have two kinds of expenses: mandatory and discretionary. Add those together and that is your budget; which you then have three sources of funds to get those expense monies from: pension (if you have it), IRA/401k/savings, and SS. Ror someone with enough financial literacy, I make discuss investment options, withdrawal rates or strategy.

The problem most people have is no concept of saving enough to the point their money can then work for them. LBYM is such a foreign concept to many.
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Old 12-07-2015, 02:41 PM   #43
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+1 on this. We couldn't do our detective work until FIL was dead and gone and it is REALLY hard to uncover ALL the accounts. ...
+2 I had to do this with Dad, Gram and Great Aunt to different degrees. The basis of securities held was a real challenge but with today's reporting that would be better.

DD knows how to access Quicken and I keep a folder with quarterly statements from all our major vendors so it should be easy for her... even if I get hit by a beer truck on our way to dinner tonight.
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Old 12-07-2015, 03:30 PM   #44
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Just a counter argument because all I ever see is "don't share the numbers,
don't share, don't share."
One vote for no sharing because once that number is "out there" no telling where it will end up or how it can be used negatively in the future.

"Speak in vague generalities when addressing your accounts." (I just made that up. Feel free to use it).
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Old 12-07-2015, 04:39 PM   #45
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....Just a counter argument because all I ever see is "don't share the numbers, don't share, don't share." I feel that any 30, 40, or 50 year old etc that behaves in such a way needs to grow up ha. But yeah I agree, probably best to not share in most cases!
Here's a case for "don't share the numbers". I remember a friend telling me that when her father passed the kids had to pay for the funeral. She paid her share and then found out that her share was bigger than her brother and sister. They told her she should pay more (even though they were all equal as far as pay, housing and spouse) because they knew she had more saved then they did. She doesn't share the number any more. Think it's too late for that.
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Old 12-07-2015, 07:01 PM   #46
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Thank you all for sharing your thoughts in response to my question. I haven't figured out the nifty "quoting" function, so I'll just weigh in generally.

Kids: I'm in my 30s with a young kid, so it's not something I have to think about much right now. But if there is a sizable amount of money that kids can inherit, I think it's a good idea to share the details. You can also sort out issues that may exists between kids. That away they can be prepared to handle it and not figuring all that out while dealing with your death. My dad takes this to the extreme and has shared everything including his account passwords with us.

Siblings: As mentioned in my original post, this an area I have experienced issues with recently. My siblings know I am debt free, but they don't know current income and net worth levels. Because we had a discussion about debt and capital in connection with a family business, they also know I have seven figures in relatively liquid investments available. I'm an attorney, so I am sure they assume my income is at a certain level. Also, just by knowing the name of my firms, you can find public info about my salary.

Parents: My dad and I have talked money since I was in my early 20s. He was 50 with a negative network. I was just learning about personal finance and how to invest. I shared a book with him that I checked out at the library and since he read it he has built a 3M net worth. That's an example of how sharing info helps. But on the other hand, I sense him trying to make up for my siblings' lower earning potential (and I'll say poor financial habits). I got my law school tuition paid for. My siblings got an equal amount to put towards new homes, home renovations, and cars because neither went to college.

Friends: I agree with the point that the more people you tell the greater the risk someone with bad intentions acts on it. We have a good friend whose family owns a convenience store. Their wealth is well known and conspicuous. And they were held at gun point by masked men who knew where the safe was. One of the masked men was later ID'd as a former high school classmate.




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Old 12-07-2015, 08:53 PM   #47
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The problem most people have is no concept of saving enough to the point their money can then work for them. LBYM is such a foreign concept to many.
I agree! When I was working I traveled extensively. I got a lot of crap from some people at work. I told them I LBMM! If they have $2K a month house payments and I have 1K a month, that gives me 12 K a year to travel!
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Old 12-08-2015, 09:37 AM   #48
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The point is to build wealth across generations, supporting the players and cutting those who don't wish to play the game for the long haul.
Hmm, that's an interesting way of looking at it. What would this mean for an adult heir who chose to remain child-free? Would they be effectively cut out of any potential inheritance?
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Old 12-08-2015, 10:16 AM   #49
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My mom knows my finances. People who tell me how much they have/make (usually proudly) are the people who have less money than me. (Why do they tell me? I am not 100% sure. I just say that's nice, or something like that. I could share mine at that point, but I don't want to appear like I am trying to outdo them.) I have a couple of friends I could share my financial details with, but that never seems to come up or even if it does, only briefly. We do talk about financial strategies, how much we have accumulated in Roth IRA, etc, but never the net worth. In a way, I wish my friends/aquaintances talked more about how they do their finances. I am very interested in how people are handing it. Well, since that is usually not a topic we discuss, I am here to discuss it with you all :-)
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Old 12-08-2015, 10:38 AM   #50
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My adult children and I discuss finances openly--including showing each other our financial statements.
I figure that if I'm not qualified to teach them how to caulk or hunt, maybe I can show them (through my successes and mistakes) how to invest.
So far, so good.
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Old 12-08-2015, 11:43 AM   #51
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...I sense him trying to make up for my siblings' lower earning potential (and I'll say poor financial habits). I got my law school tuition paid for. My siblings got an equal amount to put towards new homes, home renovations, and cars because neither went to college....
This is one I struggle with a bit. For me and my 4 siblings, we all went education beyond high school.. some 4 year degrees and others 2 year or a year of trade school and I don't think our parents ever did any 'make-up' even though in all other respect they treated us equally including their wills.

We paid for 4 years of college for DD and she is doing well, earning almost six figures at 31 yo. DS decided not to go to college and is working in manufacturing at a barely living wage but still able to cover his modest LBYM lifestyle and save some for retirement. I have told him that like his sister, we would pay for up to four years of college for him should he ever decide that we wants more education.

If he doesn't take advantage of that offer, DW leans to using that money to help him someday with a house or newer car since he decided not to to college... I'm less sure and am somewhat of the mind that if he decides not to go then that money is our to do with what we please though I have no objection to helping him out here or there.

Since we haven't had to face the question yet, my attitude is as Ted Kennedy would say 'I'll drive off that bridge when I get to it.'
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Old 12-08-2015, 04:21 PM   #52
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Old 12-09-2015, 12:22 PM   #53
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There is nothing positive to be gained by disclosing finances to anyone other than spouse. And if you do have a family member or friend who would actually be happy for you and pat you on the back...you may want to work on your self esteem. There are better ways of boosting your ego. Im 32 and recently told my parents im shooting for retirement at the age of 50. Just that info alone made their jaws drop.
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Old 12-09-2015, 06:32 PM   #54
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ponyboy, Given your above post, why did you tell your parents your plans to retire at the age of 50?
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Old 12-09-2015, 07:41 PM   #55
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I share next to nothing. Although I generally know our net worth and know our expenses in detail, I never had a clue what our yearly income was unless I looked at our tax return. So if anyone asks, I generally say I don't know. That usually stops the questions.
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Old 12-10-2015, 07:38 AM   #56
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ponyboy, Given your above post, why did you tell your parents your plans to retire at the age of 50?
I didnt give them any financials...only the fact that im trying to retire at age 50. They know im frugal and a really good saver...they just dont know exactly how much.
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Old 12-10-2015, 09:05 AM   #57
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Hmm, that's an interesting way of looking at it. What would this mean for an adult heir who chose to remain child-free? Would they be effectively cut out of any potential inheritance?
Nope, what I mean to say and will admit that I was rather obtuse was that family (sons and daughters) who contribute to overall forward progress share in rewards and those who don't, don't. I have two children and one plans to have children and the other has no interest. Plan full 50% to each when we croak.

The point is to use the wealth that has been generated to enable future generations to continue to grow both in the wealth sense and in the personal development sense. I went to engineering school because it was free and I could get a good job, I have no interest in it but did well. My children were able to think about what they were good at, what would provide some personal satisfaction as well as finding potential for good income.
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Old 12-10-2015, 12:54 PM   #58
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Always felt when discussing money matters vague generalities were the best way to go when talking to anyone outside of immediate family. If anyone got inquisitive, I'd reply with percentages or some other nondescript response, which would usually end the conversation. Even when discussing money with "financial professionals" e.g bankers, brokers, unless there was clear reason for them to know specifics bits and pieces are all they get too. That was ingrained into me by DM, she always considered discretion was best concerning financial matters. Within family, other than DW only DM has ever been privy to our NW. Funny when I think of it too, all of my siblings, when discussing retirement plans bring up having utilized an FA for their plans while I've done it pretty much solo. DM let me know that she has named me as executor of her estate, so I guess she prefers the apple that did't fall so far from the tree to handle matters.
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different levels of openness
Old 12-13-2015, 03:41 PM   #59
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different levels of openness

With my sons (25 and 21) I am letting them know more and more, mainly because I am a widow and if some thing should happen to me I want them to know exactly who to contact and what information they will need.

Now in general they don't know dollars figures but being greedy little college students lol, they've figured out that we are some what above average. they spend holiday's at Disney annually and they know graduating without student loans is unusual.

One of my siblings unfortunately became an alcoholic/addict, love him but not he's not even allowed in my house unattended.

My sister knows quite a bit but she's a successful interior designer and way more financially literate than moi.

my coworkers know my salary mainly because like the military my job paygrades so it's not rocket science to figure out who makes what but that's pretty much it. We do discuss 401k plan and stuff like that.
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Old 12-15-2015, 06:13 PM   #60
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We operate on a need-to-know basis only. We give necessary information to those that need it. So, our pyramid of knowledge looks like this:
Us
Our mortgage broker (who's seen us financially naked, as it were)
Our CPA (doesn't know about our assets, but gets annual updates on our income)
My parents (who know only what accounts we have, not how much is in them. They know this because they are the fiscal/physical guardians of our kids)

Everyone else is welcome to use their powers of reasoning to arrive at a guess should they choose to try. The only answer we will confirm is "we're OK and plan to continue that way."
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