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Old 06-02-2007, 07:13 AM   #21
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If your boss walked in to your office tomorrow and said we cannot pay you anymore but you are certainly welcome to stay on as a volunteer and otherwise everything will be exactly the same, would you do it? (Yes unrealistic and illegal and you would be taken advantage of but assuming all those things were not true.) If you said yes, then you truly love your job and are being paid to boot.

There is nothing wrong with a vocation or employment if that is what you want. FI is the ability to do what you want when you want and that includes working. These people with $10,000 in retirement money do not have the freedom. I also think some folks think it is immoral to "sit around all day and not contribute to society". For the vast majority of us, society does not appreciably benefit from what we do. If you were a brilliant cancer research specialist that is one thing, but otherwise?

Yes in my personal life I do not know a single person who retired early (let's say before 60) and I know a man who is working who is just short of 80. Doesn't mean we need to be like them--financially they are not like us.
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Old 06-02-2007, 08:00 AM   #22
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If your boss walked in to your office tomorrow and said we cannot pay you anymore but you are certainly welcome to stay on as a volunteer and otherwise everything will be exactly the same, would you do it?
I'd be out of there so fast it would make your head spin.
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Old 06-02-2007, 09:26 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by CyclingInvestor View Post
I had a career (programming) that was a perfect fit for me - very easy, almost
always solo, my own hours, very little overtime, good pay, etc. I retired 7 months
ago, and there is no comparison. Now I can do exectly what I want. I do not
think anyone is going to pay me to take bike rides, nap when I want during the
day, hike, play with my dogs, or drink a nice bottle of wine. There is a huge
difference.
No doubt there is a difference, and one which you and most of us on this board perceive as a positive difference. But not everyone would respond the same way. I think there are a number of careers where I would be happy to work, striving to attain the F-U freedom of FI, but continuing on the job. Especially if I had time to stay in decent physical shape and I enjoyed the social interactions of the career. Someone like Jarhead who "retired" to a career of professional golfer is a great example.

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Old 06-02-2007, 10:32 AM   #24
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I found this article quite depressing. I think it is sad that people have so little imagination that they can not imagine what they would do if they did not have work in their lives. I could imagine the fascination for employment must be different for those who do make a difference on a daily basis i.e. those trying to find a cure for cancer, but for people like myself whose main job function is to make money for others, I don't see the point.

For so many older people out there, their financial situation is such that they would never allow themselves to envision retiring comfortably at an age considered to fall into the RE category.
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Old 06-02-2007, 11:24 AM   #25
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Yeah, I agree on the depressing article comment. Hell, after reading that I can't wait to die in my cube at the ripe age of 80-100. I will be a productive person according to the avg American's definition and I should have healthcare covered up until that point....
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Old 06-02-2007, 11:35 AM   #26
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what if your hobbies and things you plan to pursue post-ER become possible new careers?
I enjoy surfing and I enjoy teaching people how to surf, but if I had to be at the beach on 10:30 AM next Tuesday to collect $25 for a 30-minute surfing lesson then I wouldn't enjoy it. Too many dissatisfiers (student's self-imposed pressure, teacher's commitment, commute, work clothes, equipment & maintenance, and collecting the $$) and not enough satisfiers (the look on a new surfer's face when they stand up).

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I found this article quite depressing. I think it is sad that people have so little imagination that they can not imagine what they would do if they did not have work in their lives. I could imagine the fascination for employment must be different for those who do make a difference on a daily basis i.e. those trying to find a cure for cancer, but for people like myself whose main job function is to make money for others, I don't see the point.
I think these people take solace in the knowledge that their payroll deductions will save Social Security & Medicare!
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Old 06-02-2007, 12:31 PM   #27
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I enjoy surfing and I enjoy teaching people how to surf, but if I had to be at the beach on 10:30 AM next Tuesday to collect $25 for a 30-minute surfing lesson then I wouldn't enjoy it. Too many dissatisfiers (student's self-imposed pressure, teacher's commitment, commute, work clothes, equipment & maintenance, and collecting the $$) and not enough satisfiers (the look on a new surfer's face when they stand up).

Amen to that. When hobbies become jobs, they're no longer hobbies.

Too many people talk about "making your hobbies into a career", and that's just crazy to me...
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Old 06-02-2007, 01:02 PM   #28
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Perhaps some of the people who say they wouldn't know what to do with their time are rationalizing, because they haven't saved for retirement and ER isn't an option for them.
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Old 06-02-2007, 10:48 PM   #29
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I finished work last year December due to repetitive stain injury, which forced me to consider working for myself again.

I am glad I did! I now have a professional website that I am continuing to built myself. I started as a complete newbie and I am still surprised what I have achieved.

Lots of retired people think they are over the hill and too old to learn, but they couldn`t be further from the truth. The program I am using gives you step by step instructions with all the tools you need, and its great fun learning. You can do it for a hobby on any subject you like or create a successful on-line business.

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Old 06-02-2007, 10:51 PM   #30
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If your boss walked in to your office tomorrow and said we cannot pay you anymore but you are certainly welcome to stay on as a volunteer and otherwise everything will be exactly the same, would you do it? (Yes unrealistic and illegal and you would be taken advantage of but assuming all those things were not true.) If you said yes, then you truly love your job and are being paid to boot.

T
I am sort of there. I expect to retire in the next 7 months (boss just mentioned the next buyout will be Jan 03, 2008 and I am on the list). But I do like what I do. I would not want to do it 40 hours a week but if the boss invited me to spend a few hours a week as long as I wanted I would probably do it for no pay. NASA is like that. But as there will be cut backs it would be difficult staying in that environment rather than how it is today. My wife retired from teaching but it is in her blood so she 'works' a few hours a week placing student teachers in classroom and mentoring them. She loves it and it solves the identity question for her.
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Old 06-03-2007, 09:05 AM   #31
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Otherwise, "what are you going to do with all that time?" she asked.
I think that explains it there....part of the group that cant get to FIRE that identifies their self worth with work and looking more to fill an emotional need...still have to think most people dont get to FIRE because they cant....like Steve said, it takes some planning...
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Old 06-03-2007, 09:24 AM   #32
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No looking back for me. When I had the chance to bail out I did. I saw a growing number of nurses over the years who chose to hang in there. I am not sure that that is a good idea. The work is demanding and I have to say that we younger nurses did have to pick up their slack. That I do not think is fair. I remember one who kept misplacing stuff. We spent a lot of time backtracking for her. Some projects were delayed because she misplaced documents and the like. What a pain it the butt. But she was proud that when was on the job at 72 and thought she was great. One by one we left the unit. Some people have to work for financial reasons however most folks who can need to move off the stage because they are not as productive as they think they are, their co-workers are assisting them more than they realize.
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Old 06-04-2007, 10:22 AM   #33
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Now I can do exectly what I want. I do not
think anyone is going to pay me to take bike rides, nap when I want during the day, hike, play with my dogs, or drink a nice bottle of wine. There is a huge difference.
Oh boy. Yeah, I'd love to find a job I "love." Instead I've had very interesting jobs. Lots of fun and diverse work. But still all stressful, difficult, long hours, and so on. The quote above perfectly captures what i look forward to.

Hell, right now my wife and I work so much that we don't even have a dog. It would just sit in the apartment all day long waiting for us to eventually come home.

This has been an excellent thread by the way. I read the LA Times article last week and was curious what the group would think of it. As usual I wasn't disappointed by the thoughtfulness and diversity of opinions - that is, even the ones that do want to keep working.
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Old 06-04-2007, 12:40 PM   #34
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I think the point those of us who RE'ed are trying to emphasize is that RE is
not over-rated - it is better than you think it can be, no matter how much you
like your job (and mine was a great fit for most of my 27 years).

Saturday I biked 29 miles to help a realtor buddy who was holding an open
house to sell a condo in a secured complex. I sat in the lobby for a few hours,
drinking sodas and mocha frappacinos from a cooler, while letting people in
every 15-20 minutes.

Sunday I helped at an animal adoption event for 5 hours. I helped dogs in/out
of cages, walked them when needed, and walked around, meeting a bunch of
new dogs.

Had I been working, this would have filled my weekend and left me tired for
Monday. Because my weekend is now endless, I could enjoy the activities as
interesting changes of pace.

I cannot imagine waking up nowadays, thinking "Gee, I have enough time and
money to do whatever I want for the rest of my life, and am still young and
healthy enough to do most of it. This is so boring I think I will go back to work"
I had a hard time imagining anyone would, once the opportunity presents itself.
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Old 06-04-2007, 07:32 PM   #35
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Probably more than the money issue is fear of "free time" that keeps people working. I know so many people my age (58) and older who could easily retire, but they always say "I wouldn't know what to do". Infortunately, if you've waited this long to even give passing thought to that subject, it may be too late.
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Old 06-04-2007, 09:06 PM   #36
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Had I been working, this would have filled my weekend and left me tired for
Monday. Because my weekend is now endless, I could enjoy the activities as
interesting changes of pace.
Endless weekend.

I like the sound of that.
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Old 06-04-2007, 09:32 PM   #37
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Endless weekend.

I like the sound of that.
It lives just like it sounds....endless days of no scheduled work (other than the Honey Do List); you do what YOU want to do.

We decided to go camping; so we loaded the RV and headed out on a Monday to a couple of RV parks a few hundred miles away. We will take in a couple of National Parks and then head back home before the crowds take over these places.

The park we are in now is only about 25% full so it is great...no close neighbors and views most folks can only dream about.

Live is good! Retire Early.
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Old 06-05-2007, 08:37 AM   #38
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It lives just like it sounds....endless days of no scheduled work (other than the Honey Do List); you do what YOU want to do.

We decided to go camping; so we loaded the RV and headed out on a Monday to a couple of RV parks a few hundred miles away. We will take in a couple of National Parks and then head back home before the crowds take over these places.

The park we are in now is only about 25% full so it is great...no close neighbors and views most folks can only dream about.
Ahh, that's awesome. I really shouldn't visit this forum before going to work!!
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Old 06-05-2007, 09:25 AM   #39
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Ahh, that's awesome. I really shouldn't visit this forum before going to work!!
Do as I do: visit while AT w*rk...
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Old 06-05-2007, 11:14 AM   #40
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If your boss walked in to your office tomorrow and said we cannot pay you anymore but you are certainly welcome to stay on as a volunteer and otherwise everything will be exactly the same, would you do it?


ummmm...no. I honestly can't think of a single 'job' that I'd want to do that for. And believe me, I enjoy my job. Sometimes I actually love it. But it, it takes my energy & I deserve to get paid for expending said energy.

The only think I'd do for free is some kind of philanthropical work where the good I was doing was my payment. But then I'd need to have some kind of income to be able to do that (maybe from FIRE?).


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Too many people talk about "making your hobbies into a career", and that's just crazy to me...
I think it depends on your hobby. IMO, a number of hobbies, like photography, painting, & other arts can translate into some kind of money-maker, with minimal extra effort. And it could be worth getting the extra cash, if only so you can more quickly afford new toys to upgrade your hobby.

Other hobbies, like say...bird watching, might be a bit harder (although I guess you could become some kind of bird guide) & take much more outlay, especially in time.

I guess you could say that piano-playing was a hobby of mine for years. I played regularly from the time I was 4 until about 20. By the end, I was quite good, & did weddings, funerals, dinners sometimes. A lot of older, well-meaning people suggested I try to do it professionally, which I was pretty agast at. To me, piano is the kind of thing that, once you have to DO it every day, in a certain way, for certain people, it's no longer joyful & loses all appeal (not to mention all the competition involved in getting any kind of decent-paying job playing the piano).

Whereas something like say, photography, if you've got some really lovely pics that friends frequently compliment, putting them up on etsy.com & seeing if anyone buys them would be much easier, & doesn't seem like it would put a damper on the hobby at all.
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