We are burned out

[crispus]

TromboneAl you are correct in your assumption 8k taxable, but we are adding 1k a month.

jIMOh Maryland income tax including county tax 7.58%.

cardude I like your idea of reversing it on my boss.

I feel better that we are either FI or real close. One question if we do pull the plug in the next year, we will need to withdraw using the rule of 72t. How much can one take out without incurring the 10% penalty?

We really appreciate all the help given on this forum.

 

[Milton]

I feel better that we are either FI or real close.

You are already there if you are prepared to cut spending and live modestly. I.e., you have less than is probably desirable for a comfortable retirement, but more than is strictly necessary to get by on.

We could sell our home and downsize, but there are 4 homes on my court already for sale. Some have been for sale for over a year. Terrible real estate market.

In the absence of (highly unusual) problems such as toxic waste, crack house next door, etc., virtually any property will sell quickly if reasonably priced. The houses that aren't selling in your court are overpriced: probably because the would-be vendors are determined to get back the amount they paid, or some such consideration that is irrelevant to potential purchasers.

If you are realistic and prepared to accept what Mr. Market is willing to pay, you shouldn't have any difficulty selling, if that's what you want to do.

My job is in printing sales, and I am being constantly micro managed, since the recession took hold in 2009. I have weekly meetings with the sales manager (owners brother in law) and the owner, which I dread. They are always going over everything in my call log asking why I am not getting more sales. Now they want me to do vast cold calling, when I already have a book of sales from over 30 years in the business. When I have an appointment, I always hit the businesses directly next to my appointment. I have not found cold calling to be very effective and I don't have a lot of time to devote to it. I guess we are a loggerheads and I just want out.

Oh, great. No wonder you are stressed. "These are the new leads. These are the Glengarry leads. And to you they're gold, and you don't get them. Why? Because to give them to you would be throwing them away. They're for closers."

 

[drb111]

Oh, great. No wonder you are stressed. "These are the new leads. These are the Glengarry leads. And to you they're gold, and you don't get them. Why? Because to give them to you would be throwing them away. They're for closers."

"put down that coffee...coffee is for closers!" great movie

I agree with others. The nice thing is that you are not forced to work for these stressed out bro in laws if you don't have to. MD taxes are terrible. Lived in Annapolis for 9 years. There are ways to cut your monthly budget it appears. Best option might be to reverse engineer to the boss, as was suggested, and hang on till 59.5 and then move on.

Good luck

 

[Milton]

Best option might be to reverse engineer to the boss, as was suggested, and hang on till 59.5 and then move on.

I agree. Just be careful in how you go about the proposed discussion.

If they are not entirely happy with your current performance (which appears to be the case, although perhaps I am reading too much into your description of the weekly meetings) and you present what amounts to an ultimatum, they may seize the opportunity to "accept your resignation", and you'll be out of a job before you know what happened.

That's not necessarily a bad outcome; but don't play the FI card unless you really are prepared to walk away.

 

[crispus]

I just watched that clip from Glenngary Glenn Ross with Alec Baldwin's speech. Wow it is classic. I will have to see that video. I think that is what my place would be like if the sales manager (brother-in-law) took over operations.

My wife and I had a long talk last night. With the strict rules under the revised 72t withdraw rate, we are going to try to stick it out to 59.5, but if I get canned before that date, at least I will stick it to the boss with unemployment relief. I will not going to use the ultimatum approach. I think I will not be as upset after the meetings, because whatever they do we should be fine.

 

[Milton]

My wife and I had a long talk last night. With the strict rules under the revised 72t withdraw rate, we are going to try to stick it out to 59.5 ... I will not going to use the ultimatum approach. I think I will not be as upset after the meetings, because whatever they do we should be fine.

Makes sense to me.

I just watched that clip from Glenngary Glenn Ross with Alec Baldwin's speech. Wow it is classic. I will have to see that video.

For those unfamiliar with the scene, here it is:
YouTube - Alec Baldwin - Best performanceWhile obviously overstated, it is (unfortunately) an otherwise accurate depiction of the pressures many employees are at least implicitly subjected to.

 

[crispus]

I got bad news today. In the weekly sales meeting with the owner, brother in law and I, they in effect let me go. Basically the organization of 37 employees is between 20-40 years of age and they feel that they will get more bang for the buck with a younger more focused person. Now they did not put it into those words, but that was the feeling I got. Best case scenario I might be able to service my accounts as a freelancer. We have another meeting on Tuesday morning. My income in that case would go from 55-60 k down to 25-35 k, and that is best case. I might just be canned. I put a lot of effort into my job (help out with daily operations in my shop, service house accounts, go to various networking events, make cold calls, and log call backs along with servicing my personal accounts from my old family printing company.

Of course it could not be a worse time for this. As the market is tanking, our emergency fund is down due to paying off the house 3 months ago. We have about 10k in the fund along with 70+ in a roth ira. I guess I got what I was asking for, but I wanted it on my terms at least a year from now.

I am in shock today, a little sad and a lot confused about what to do next.

 

[W2R]

So sorry to hear of this, Crispus. What a shock.

 

[Bestwifeever]

Sorry to hear this. Be sure to apply for unemployment as you've been let go--you can probably do so online. That would defer using the IRA money.

Remember that only a week ago there was agreement that although it might be tight and working a little longer might be better, you could retire now as you have a nice nest egg. Hang in there.

 

[cardude]

Sorry to hear this. Be sure to apply for unemployment as you've been let go--you can probably do so online. That would defer using the IRA money.

Remember that only a week ago there was agreement that although it might be tight and working a little longer might be better, you could retire now as you have a nice nest egg. Hang in there.
__________________

+1 what she said....................

It seems to me like you were close anyway, so I wouldn't sweat it too much.

 

[NW Landlady]

So sorry to hear of this, Crispus. What a shock.

+1 - Hope you get this all sorted out. The recession has been a real strain on everyone, I am sure that contributed to this. Hang in there.

 

[jIMOh]

I got bad news today. In the weekly sales meeting with the owner, brother in law and I, they in effect let me go. Basically the organization of 37 employees is between 20-40 years of age and they feel that they will get more bang for the buck with a younger more focused person. Now they did not put it into those words, but that was the feeling I got. Best case scenario I might be able to service my accounts as a freelancer. We have another meeting on Tuesday morning. My income in that case would go from 55-60 k down to 25-35 k, and that is best case. I might just be canned. I put a lot of effort into my job (help out with daily operations in my shop, service house accounts, go to various networking events, make cold calls, and log call backs along with servicing my personal accounts from my old family printing company.

Of course it could not be a worse time for this. As the market is tanking, our emergency fund is down due to paying off the house 3 months ago. We have about 10k in the fund along with 70+ in a roth ira. I guess I got what I was asking for, but I wanted it on my terms at least a year from now.

I am in shock today, a little sad and a lot confused about what to do next.

Life works in mysterious ways

go to doctor and get checked up while you still have insurance

analyze spending and only spend what you need or truly want (right now), then focus on a long term retirement budget.

Lots of good people here. You can retire, you just need to make many decisions to make it smooth relative to income, expenses, assets and similar already discussed above.

 

[crispus]

I will hang in... feeling better. We will face Tuesday's meeting and then move forward.

My spouse has mentioned that she is not ready to retire, but may want to find a different job. I am definitely ready to leave the grind. However I am not sure that my spouse will come around to me not working and her working.

I have a lot of odd jobs to do around the house, and I don't mind keeping the house clean. I already cook every meal, and with more time I can find ways to save on groceries. Our car expenses will go way down with me not working. The hardest thing will be living under a strict budget, and being able to do some fun things that do not cost much.

I love the support and advice given on this forum.

 

[jIMOh]

Many on the forum have stated its better for one spouse to stop before the other- something about adjusting to no job is better than adjusting to no job and being around spouse 24/7 (if both are retired at same time).

 

[bbbamI]

Many on the forum have stated its better for one spouse to stop before the other- something about adjusting to no job is better than adjusting to no job and being around spouse 24/7 (if both are retired at same time).

Amen....

You'll do just fine crispus.....

 

[Nords]

My spouse has mentioned that she is not ready to retire, but may want to find a different job. I am definitely ready to leave the grind. However I am not sure that my spouse will come around to me not working and her working.
I have a lot of odd jobs to do around the house, and I don't mind keeping the house clean. I already cook every meal, and with more time I can find ways to save on groceries. Our car expenses will go way down with me not working. The hardest thing will be living under a strict budget, and being able to do some fun things that do not cost much.

If you add windows & laundry to your ER repertoire then I doubt you'll hear any complaints.

Play your cards right and she'll probably have some creative contributions to the "fun things that do not cost much"...

 

[chris2008]

Sometimes the best changes come through the back door and are not received with a warm welcome. But looking back at these days in one year you may find that your bosses did you a favour.

My recommendation: If your wife continues working do not stay in bed when she gets up to go to work but at least have breakfast with her.
My husband is a teacher and I work for megacorp. We made it a rule that even during his loooooooong school holidays we would have breakfast together in the morning. It makes me feel so much better and it gives him a good start for his activities.

 

[crispus]

My recommendation: If your wife continues working do not stay in bed when she gets up to go to work but at least have breakfast with her.
My husband is a teacher and I work for megacorp. We made it a rule that even during his loooooooong school holidays we would have breakfast together in the morning. It makes me feel so much better and it gives him a good start for his activities.

I think this is great advice. Thank you.

 

[crispus]

I had my meeting today. The outcome is that I will just service my accounts and build new ones at my own pace. Salary just commissions and cell phone. With my current accounts around $26k. My spouse wants me to look for another job while I continue to do this one. I personally don't feel bad about the outcome. I can work 4-6 hours a day, ask my customers for any referrals they know and do some cold calling. Before I was servicing and working on mostly house accounts and any new account I brought in I got nothing.

 

[Amethyst]

Crispus,

Sounds more like a reprieve from burnout, than a canning! What does your wife think?

I had my meeting today. The outcome is that I will just service my accounts and build new ones at my own pace. Salary just commissions and cell phone. With my current accounts around $26k.

I hope this works for you, and you get to work at your own pace for as long as you like. Keep planning toward FIRE, though, in case the reprieve turns out to be temporary!

Amethyst

 

[Milton]

Salary just commissions and cell phone. With my current accounts around $26k. My spouse wants me to look for another job while I continue to do this one. I personally don't feel bad about the outcome.

You would be wise to follow your wife's suggestion

While I certainly don't know all the circumstances, it sounds like from the bosses' perspective this new arrangement is merely a temporary expediency. In the next few months, you may be cut loose entirely.

In any event, there is nothing to lose by exploring other opportunities. And at least you now have some spare time in which to interview.

 

[rescueme]

Many on the forum have stated its better for one spouse to stop before the other- something about adjusting to no job is better than adjusting to no job and being around spouse 24/7 (if both are retired at same time).

That's been our situation. DW/me were to retire the same day/same age.

About two months before she was to leave, she admitted that she was not "emotionally ready" (although financially ready) to retire.

A bit over three years later, I'm still happily retired (and busy); she is happily wor*ing.

Any day she wishes to hang up her spurs? She can leave with no regrets...

 

[crispus]

My wife was a little depressed last night, after I told her of my employers deal. Today I have already visited 5 accounts and got 3 orders. I think that now that I am not involved with the other store and its accounts, I will be able to grow my personal account base.

My spouse wants me to look for a higher paying job aggressively. I feel that I will network to that end with my clients and friends, but I also feel that I am not that marketable at my age and experience. I ran a small family print shop, and for the last 4 years have worked for another printer.

I cut out HBO and Showtime today saving $30 per month, took a leave of absence from my golf club saving $400 per month, and lowered our automatic charitable giving saving $42 per month. I am fine with all that, but my wife says instead of cutting back how about more income. We love each other very much, but I think she needs some time to get comfortable with our new normal.

 

[Meadbh]

My wife was a little depressed last night, after I told her of my employers deal. Today I have already visited 5 accounts and got 3 orders. I think that now that I am not involved with the other store and its accounts, I will be able to grow my personal account base.

My spouse wants me to look for a higher paying job aggressively. I feel that I will network to that end with my clients and friends, but I also feel that I am not that marketable at my age and experience. I ran a small family print shop, and for the last 4 years have worked for another printer.

I cut out HBO and Showtime today saving $30 per month, took a leave of absence from my golf club saving $400 per month, and lowered our automatic charitable giving saving $42 per month. I am fine with all that, but my wife says instead of cutting back how about more income. We love each other very much, but I think she needs some time to get comfortable with our new normal.

Crispus, I'm glad you are dealing with this so constructively. You have made advances already! DW needs some time to grieve before she is ready to move on.

 

[Orchidflower]

Crispus, as an old time sales manager the best advice I can give you is to keep your chin up and keep moving forward. You're already doing some creative thinking. You can come out of this better than before...trust me....just keep going forward.