Why doesn't anybody care about retirement?

[twaddle]

Twaddle, Defender of the Trolls, reporting for duty! X-ray vision says this one checks out. No troll. Just motivated by their own agenda, like every other working schmuck trying to get ahead in this dog-eat-dog world.

Carry on!

 

[Janet H]

Twaddle, Defender of the Trolls, reporting for duty! .

Carry on!

Honest - we don't need a troll defender! Now a bridge guard is another matter entirely....

 

[twaddle]

Oh, I think we have enough guards here.

When I was a young pup, I did seek out a financial advisor. Mostly because I was curious what sort of advice they could offer beyond what I could fairly easily figure out myself.

I wasn't impressed. I remember saying something like "That's it? You just plug a few numbers into a canned spreadsheet for me? I can do that myself!" We agreed to go our separate ways.

So, I did care about retirement planning from a fairly young age, but I just maxed out the ol' 401-K and saved some more, and through the magic of compounding.... Wait, that wasn't me. I started my own business and sold it for a small fortune. But you get the idea.

 

[chinaco]

Workin4me -- a few questions:

• Are you a certified planner or advisor?
• Are you a fee based advisor or do you work on commission?
• Are you a licensed Insurance Agent and/or do you have an NASD series 6 License?
• What types of services do you offer. DO you help them project budgets and needs or just the investment side?

No matter what... I can take a few years to establish oneself. Keep at it and things will fall in place. Just be sure to always do what is in the customers best interest and things will eventually fall into place.

Cold calls are brutal. The Insurance Industry has a huge turnover rate in new agents. Especially on the life an annuity side. I think perhaps 50% or greater of new agents don't last 1 year.


One thing that is probably working against you right now. Most people only begin to think about retirement planning when they hit a certain age (I am not talking about contributing to a 401k). If you are a lot younger than them, they probably are a bit skeptical of your experience. Let's face it... most professions require experience to become highly skilled. Schooling is just the fundamentals.

Never the less, if you like the profession, stick with it and work hard... you will get there.

 

[packrat44]

We built a patio a few years ago that involved pouring concrete. We made our 9 year old help wheelbarrow the concrete to the pad site and then spread it level. He started saving for college that day! I guess at 9 he realized that a life pouring concrete was not a future he was interested in.

Still waiting for him to thank me for being a slave driver.... but he at least he's hard at the books in college now.

Our family of four did all the construction for our vacation/retirement house (except excavation and placing concrete for the footing and stem walls) without prior construction experience. My son, 13 yo at the time, never worked so hard. He decided becoming an engineer and working with his mind was preferable to manual labor.

Twaddle, Defender of the Trolls, reporting for duty! X-ray vision says this one checks out. No troll. Just motivated by their own agenda, like every other working schmuck trying to get ahead in this dog-eat-dog world.

Carry on!

So you will be known as the "DoT" (Defender of Trolls);not to be confused with the Dept of Transportation.

 

[friscokid]

Workin4me -- a few questions:

• Are you a certified planner or advisor?
• Are you a fee based advisor or do you work on commission?
• Are you a licensed Insurance Agent and/or do you have an NASD series 6 License?
• What types of services do you offer. DO you help them project budgets and needs or just the investment side?

No matter what... I can take a few years to establish oneself. Keep at it and things will fall in place. Just be sure to always do what is in the customers best interest and things will eventually fall into place.

Cold calls are brutal. The Insurance Industry has a huge turnover rate in new agents. Especially on the life an annuity side. I think perhaps 50% or greater of new agents don't last 1 year.


One thing that is probably working against you right now. Most people only begin to think about retirement planning when they hit a certain age (I am not talking about contributing to a 401k). If you are a lot younger than them, they probably are a bit skeptical of your experience. Let's face it... most professions require experience to become highly skilled. Schooling is just the fundamentals.

Never the less, if you like the profession, stick with it and work hard... you will get there.

I totally agree - it can take some reps years to make it. I've been working on the compliance/principal side of the "business" for 12 years now and I've seen 'em come and go.

As for the cold calling, not a lot of firms allow their reps to do this anymore. As for getting your "message" out to the public, the "free lunch" seminars seem to be popular. But like one poster said, stick with folks in your age group.

 

[Sarah in SC]

Yeah the "free lunch" seminars the SEC just came down really hard on! Maybe not!

My suggestions: join a Rotary club, do free stuff, etc--all the marketing stuff any small business owner has to do to get the word out! You can't convert the masses--just get the folks that were already on the way to go a bit further. You know, like in Good to Great by Jim Collins. Good luck--and if you don't have them already, some credentials will help you get a foot in the door with the more savvy folks.

 

[Andre1969]

And then in my past experience, I worked for companies that put in generous matches into your 401K but you had to work with the company for 15 years or more in order to keep the match....in this day and age for young ppl (ex. college age) that's a long time. Plus it did no good for those who were "just passing through" and using the job as a beginner job. Sure you can transfer your 401K but you lost all the match money.......I just think it could be invested better while you're young and still not in your "career", moving from one job to the next every 5 years or so....

Just out of curiosity, is that delayed vesting common nowadays? I'm one of those rare people, I guess, who has stayed in the same basic job for about 15 years now. However, I'm a gov't contractor, and it's common for us to lose our contract when it comes up for renewal, and then whomever wins it just picks up all the employees that the gov't wants to keep around. Which is usually all of us. I can only think of two people who were lost in the transition last time, which was 2003. One of them was a heavyset, old, disabled man who made too much money. He actually bragged that he made more than a lot of these people, while doing less work. Not a smart thing to do in retrospect, I guess! The other was an older lady who tended to call in sick alot.

Anyway, I remember with my first company you had to be vested for 5 years to keep the company match. Back then I didn't invest in the 401k, although in retrospect I wish I had. That company got bought out, and soon thereafter I did start investing. With the new company were were vested immediately, so any company match was ours from the get-go.

Well, I switched to another company in 2000, and yet another in 2003. Both companies had immediate vesting. Chances are we're going to lose the contract again in 2008.

Maybe I've just been lucky with the vesting? Or, because they know it's a good chance we'll lose these contracts every 3-5 years, maybe they HAVE to vest us immediately?

 

[friscokid]

Yeah the "free lunch" seminars the SEC just came down really hard on! Maybe not!

My suggestions: join a Rotary club, do free stuff, etc--all the marketing stuff any small business owner has to do to get the word out! You can't convert the masses--just get the folks that were already on the way to go a bit further. You know, like in Good to Great by Jim Collins. Good luck--and if you don't have them already, some credentials will help you get a foot in the door with the more savvy folks.

Oh, the SEC did bring the hammer! But that doesn't stop folks from using them. They've brought in the big guns on VAs, VULs and MFs, but that didn't stop 'em.

OP, I'm guessing you're a rep for an insurance company, with the mention of VULs. If that's the case you'll no doubt get lots of pressure from your manager to sell their products. Be careful if you go down that road - I've seen a lot of new reps get ruined for slinging their firm's products.

 

[maddythebeagle]

So you will be known as the "DoT" (Defender of Trolls);not to be confused with the Dept of Transportation.

If he starts wearing tights and a cape, he will most certainly end up on "my ignore list"....

 

[justin]

I'm not sure how long ago workin4me saw companies with 15 year vesting schedules, but ERISA has governed vesting schedules quite a while back. From the Dept. of Labor: "Beginning in 2002, there are two basic vesting schedules. Under the three-year schedule, workers are 100% vested after three years of service under the plan. The six-year graduated schedule allows workers to become 20% vested after two years and to vest at a rate of 20% each year thereafter until they are 100% vested after six years of service. Plans may have faster vesting schedules."

Pre-2002, there was a similar vesting schedule requirement, over slightly longer periods (ie in the employer's favor).

This are the bare minimum vesting schedules that employers can have. They can always relax the schedules and vest immediately or more rapidly than ERISA requires.

(note: I'm not a financial advisor or attorney, so I know nothing about any of this and I might be wrong.)

 

[justin]

Plus it did no good for those who were "just passing through" and using the job as a beginner job. Sure you can transfer your 401K but you lost all the match money.......I just think it could be invested better while you're young and still not in your "career", moving from one job to the next every 5 years or so....

That's all......SS isn't bad. 401K's are great. But I believe in a healthy, robust portfolio.

Does you opinion of 401k's change after finding out that they are either 100% vested after 3 years or vested over time and 100% vested after 6 years? They seem to be a pretty good savings vehicle from my point of view. Assuming the products available and fees in the 401k are reasonable. I don't think it is unreasonable to expect someone to work 3-6 years before receiving their employer-provided retirement funding. That allows WAY more flexibility in the labor market than the old-fashioned 30 year defined benefit pension where you work for one entity your entire life.

Since you believe in a healthy, robust portfolio, what, as a financial adviser, would you suggest belongs in a healthy, robust portfolio?

 

[Sarah in SC]

Most vesting is now done on the "top heavy" basis, 2-6 graded or 3 year cliff.
Safe harbor plan matches must be 100% immediately vested.
For example, my current 401k match is 100% immediately vested and the profit sharing contribution is 2-6 graded.

 

[RunningBum]

I'm not sure how long ago workin4me saw companies with 15 year vesting schedules, but ERISA has governed vesting schedules quite a while back. From the Dept. of Labor: "Beginning in 2002, there are two basic vesting schedules. Under the three-year schedule, workers are 100% vested after three years of service under the plan. The six-year graduated schedule allows workers to become 20% vested after two years and to vest at a rate of 20% each year thereafter until they are 100% vested after six years of service. Plans may have faster vesting schedules."

In another thread workin4me claims to be a 26 year old young mother. I find it really hard to believe she ever had a job with a 15 year 401K vesting schedule, and I don't know that I'd trust a financial advisor who makes such a claim of a longer vesting schedule than I've ever heard of and that hasn't been legal in 5 years.

 

[youbet]

I'm not sure how long ago workin4me saw companies with 15 year vesting schedules, but ERISA has governed vesting schedules quite a while back. From the Dept. of Labor: "Beginning in 2002, there are two basic vesting schedules. Under the three-year schedule, workers are 100% vested after three years of service under the plan. The six-year graduated schedule allows workers to become 20% vested after two years and to vest at a rate of 20% each year thereafter until they are 100% vested after six years of service. Plans may have faster vesting schedules."

Pre-2002, there was a similar vesting schedule requirement, over slightly longer periods (ie in the employer's favor).

This are the bare minimum vesting schedules that employers can have. They can always relax the schedules and vest immediately or more rapidly than ERISA requires.

(note: I'm not a financial advisor or attorney, so I know nothing about any of this and I might be wrong.)

You are correct justin. Perhaps part of OP's problem in interesting folks in retirement counseling is lack of basic knowledge on his part. For example, if somehone told me that it was common today to have a 15 year vesting period, I'd immediately suspect a scam.

 

[Milton]

But all I get is rejection. "Not interested right now." WHEN will you be? When retirement is knocking on your door?

I suspect in the majority of cases people are trying to politely and efficiently end an unsolicited telephone call or sales meeting. For all we know, they may well already have retirement plans in place, and simply want to avoid a discussion about how you would do a much better job.

Finances have always been a passion for me (I started saving for college when I was 4 yrs old)

Oh please. That reminds me of the following exchange in Wall Street:

Gordon Gekko: "Spare me the cheap sales talk, pal. It's obvious."
Budd Fox: "Excuse me, sir?"
Gekko: "You heard me".

 

[Eyerishgold]

workin4me

Like it or not your age probably has alot to do with your lack of success so far. The people who you want to be your clients (RE: rich folks) don't want you as their "advisor" because of your lack of experience. They recognize you as, or believe you to be, a sales person rather than someone who provides sound financial advice.

I'm not that much older than you but I would want somebody with experience guiding my finances. Just imagine how somebody in their 40's or 50's with sizeable assets views you. Put yourself in their shoes. If you had 750k+ in assets, would you trust somebody in his/her 20's to tell you what to do with your money?

 

[Andre1969]

Oh please. That reminds me of the following exchange in Wall Street:

Gordon Gekko: "Spare me the cheap sales talk, pal. It's obvious."
Budd Fox: "Excuse me, sir?"
Gekko: "You heard me".

Well, in a sort of way, I started saving for the future when I was young. I really don't remember it, but my Mom told me that when I was a kid and the ice cream man could come around, I'd ask her for money to buy something. But once she started giving me an allowance, for stuff like that, I'd start hoarding!

My Mom also bought a bunch of savings bonds for my future, starting right after I was born. But that was HER saving for my future, and not ME!

 

[FinanceDude]

I just started working as a financial adviser and I was so excited to help people plan for retirement. It was something I always thought about. Finances have always been a passion for me (I started saving for college when I was 4 yrs old)

But all I get is rejection. "Not interested right now." WHEN will you be? When retirement is knocking on your door?

What do I do to put some fire in their bellies? Or is there nothing I can do to make my generation see that they shouldn't hang all their retirement plans on Social Security and one 401K--if they have one?

Man, you're one funny adviser...........

 

[FinanceDude]

When I was a young pup, I did seek out a financial advisor. Mostly because I was curious what sort of advice they could offer beyond what I could fairly easily figure out myself.

I wasn't impressed. I remember saying something like "That's it? You just plug a few numbers into a canned spreadsheet for me? I can do that myself!" We agreed to go our separate ways.

So, I did care about retirement planning from a fairly young age, but I just maxed out the ol' 401-K and saved some more, and through the magic of compounding.... Wait, that wasn't me. I started my own business and sold it for a small fortune. But you get the idea.

 

[FinanceDude]

Since you believe in a healthy, robust portfolio, what, as a financial adviser, would you suggest belongs in a healthy, robust portfolio?

It's an ambush........don't hit that tripwire..........

 

[FinanceDude]

workin4me

Like it or not your age probably has alot to do with your lack of success so far. The people who you want to be your clients (RE: rich folks) don't want you as their "advisor" because of your lack of experience. They recognize you as, or believe you to be, a sales person rather than someone who provides sound financial advice.

I'm not that much older than you but I would want somebody with experience guiding my finances. Just imagine how somebody in their 40's or 50's with sizeable assets views you. Put yourself in their shoes. If you had 750k+ in assets, would you trust somebody in his/her 20's to tell you what to do with your money?

Most advisors I know that are really successful are in their 30's and 40's, and have 10-15 years experience.............

 

[jIMOh]

Because your average person is now a idiot, who can tell you how many touchdowns Peyton tossed on Sunday, but cannot even point their own country out on a map.

If the average person is an idiot, consider that 50% of people are below average.

Make something idiot proof and the world will invent a bigger idiot.

FA are not bad, they need to see how to add value. Implementing a full scale financial plan will be difficult for someone with only $50 left at end of month.

 

[Milton]

I'm not that much older than you but I would want somebody with experience guiding my finances. Just imagine how somebody in their 40's or 50's with sizeable assets views you.

From workin4me's post on the other thread: "No real investments started YET just a simple 401K offered by my husband's work".

 

[Eyerishgold]

From workin4me's post on the other thread: "No real investments started YET just a simple 401K offered by my husband's work".

Really??

A case of do as I say, not as I do?