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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-17-2005, 02:26 PM   #21
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

Quote:
Razz,

Man, that sucks big time. You were trying to do the right thing and take care of yourself.

I am really interested in hearing more if you don't mind. I found out six months ago that my total cholesterol is around 293, but my good cholesterol is really high so my ratios are good. My doctor doesn't agree that the ratios make the numbers OK and wants me to go on a high cholesterol drug.

Do you mind sharing what drugs you were on and what impact it has had ?

Thank you ! -helen

I was on Lipitor when it was a new drug. I was a guinea pig for the drug company. And my cholesterol wasn't all THAT high to begin with but hey, we're supposed to trust they doctor right?

They want to take one blood test as proof you need to be on medictaion forever and then require that you have your blood tested every 2 to 3 months forever. NOT to check your cholesterol but to make suree the drug isn't killing you via muscle wasting or liver destruction. But they will insist you must take teh drug or "risk" a heart atack or stroke. Then you ask them directly OK, so what are MY chances of a H/A or stroke with and without the drugs and they can't tell you. They might say your chances are X% higher trhan average but then they cannot tell you what the average person's chances are.

Anyway... the side effects of the statin were almost everything listed on the box except cancer and rhabdomyelisis. I will be on medication forever to counter act the effects of having my metabolism fried...AND the ill effects that are concomitant with frying one's metabolism. Osteoporosis, weight gain, and last year serious breathing problems that fortunately turned out to NOT be heart problems.

I was also hit with permanent ADRs from an antibiotic. Peripheral neuropathy mostly. (pain and numbness in my feet and legs. Squelched my exercise routine.

Of course all these effects were misdiagnosed for at least 3 yrs as all new diseases that "just happened" because I was "getting older" (I was 41) And along with this crap it cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars in boigus tests for conditions I didn't have but the dr wished I had and for theneeded tests that showed the conditions I DID have. And I will now have to spend 100,000 bucks for medication if I live to 80 and that's a guess. Who knows what iflation will do

Now, of course I DO have insurance but A) that isn't going to give me my health back and B) Even tho I really didnt pay for all that out of my own pocket the dr was shaking the money tree apparently without regard to my health. The only new disease we discovered was "Cholesterol Neurosis" on the part of Doctors

If the Dr wants to put you on drugs for "cholesterol" get the percentages he's worried about and get data on your arteries, They will refuse to get it. Because: 1) The test , cardiac catheterization, is hazardous, and 2) In most cases it will eliminate the need for drugs because it will show nice clear arteries.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-17-2005, 02:53 PM   #22
 
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

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I was on Lipitor when it was a new drug....
If the Dr wants to put you on drugs for "cholesterol" get the percentages he's worried about and get data on your arteries, They will refuse to get it. Because: 1) The test , cardiac catheterization, is hazardous, and 2) In most cases it will eliminate the need for drugs because it will show nice clear arteries.
The drug companies must be doing a hard of sell cholesterol reducing drugs. Our family doctor was.

He prescribed them for my father-in-law, who was taking an expensive cholesterol reducer up until he died -- of lung cancer.

When my annual blood test showed higher than normal cholesterol, the doctor suggested the same drug. Instead of taking medication, I reduced my consumption of beef and cheese and started walking daily. My cholesterol levels have been in the normal range ever since.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-17-2005, 03:16 PM   #23
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

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He prescribed them for my father-in-law, who was taking an expensive cholesterol reducer up until he died -- of lung cancer.

When my annual blood test showed higher than normal cholesterol, the doctor suggested the same drug. Instead of taking medication, I reduced my consumption of beef and cheese and started walking daily. My cholesterol levels have been in the normal range ever since.
Exactly! In my case however the LDLs (bad cholesterol) is still uncomfortably high even for me BUT the NIH heart atatck risk assessor says I only have a 4% chance of a HA in the next 10 yrs. I am 47 So like what should I worry about exactly?
My current Dr insistats that my cholesterol should be below 100. Well the recent report he cited was addressing ONLY high risk patients specifically denoted as : older, with heart failure, already had a heart attack oir bypass operation. NOT, healthy 40ish people. He still insisted and refused to ackowlegde that I was right about the report. And they wonder why some people go postal!

As far as your father-in-law... how can they be sure his lung cancer wasn't caused by the Lipitor? MAybe he was a smoker. That's just playing perentages tho, not proof

Statins cause cancer. It's in the lab data. THAT is why you need to have the liver tests done every 3 months. But if somebody gets cancer while on statins... hey man anybody can get cancer. Lots of people NOT on statins get cancer. That is how they defraud and deceive.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-17-2005, 03:18 PM   #24
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

Man this is interesting! My cholesterol was off the chart.
Can't take the typical meds as my liver function is screwed up (probably all those manhattans)
Anyway, I went on the "wab" diet as suggested by our dear friend wabmester, and so I ate MORE meat and MORE cheese, but no juices, soda, bread, pasta,
rice, potatoes and cut back on sugar. Shazamm,
dropped my cholesterol 54 points in 6 weeks. About 2 months ago I had a heart scan just for grins. It looked good. Also, my last blood test said my cholesterol
related risk was just average. No family history of heart
disease or stroke. Bottom line, I am feeling pretty good
about this problem, which frees me up to worry about other stuff

JG
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-17-2005, 04:19 PM   #25
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

Hello GD-ER. I was told to do all sorts of things and take all sorts of tests. I had abnormalities, anomalies,
weird symptoms. As is my custom I ignored just about
everything (except the Wabmester diet which DW thinks is
pretty funny). Anyway, the heart scan was my idea.
Non-invasive, quick, not too pricey. That nuclear
stress test scared the hell out of me. I knew I was not
having that one.

JG
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-17-2005, 04:56 PM   #26
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

Reposted for spelling:

Quote:
Quote:Bottom line, I am feeling pretty good
about this problem, which frees me up to worry about other stuff
Exactly. I dont worry about heart crap anymore. Unfortunately the side effects from the medications have attentuated my overall quality of life so I don't enjoy anything as much as I should. But, yes, I can direct my attention everything else now.

Quote:
That nuclear stress test scared the hell out of me. I knew I was not having that one. JG
Nothing to be scared of. In fact it's one of the best tests short of a cardiac catheterization or autopsy. 1000% better than a regular treadmill test and infinity times better than a meaningless blood test which doesn't really even address your arteries or heart. It's just a statistical inference that sells pills.

My heart, the one the dr was so sure was gonna have an attack, was clear a bell. Even the cardiologist was impressed. Now, if my old man had had a test like that at the same age (43, the same age he had his first HA) do you really think he'd have looked as clear? Not likley.

I'm not really anti-medical establishment but let's face it , some tests ARE wortyh taking. Some just are not.



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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-17-2005, 06:59 PM   #27
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

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I was on Lipitor when it was a new drug. I was a *guinea pig for the drug company. And my cholesterol wasn't all THAT high to begin with but hey, we're supposed to trust they doctor right?

They want to take one blood test as proof you need to be on medictaion forever and then require that you have your blood tested every 2 to 3 months forever. NOT to check your cholesterol but to make suree the drug isn't killing you via muscle wasting or liver destruction. *But they will insist you must take teh drug or "risk" a heart atack or stroke. *Then you ask them directly OK, so what are MY chances of a H/A or stroke with and without the drugs and they can't tell you. They might say your chances are X% higher trhan average but then they cannot tell you what the average person's chances are.

Anyway... the side effects of the statin were almost everything listed on the box except cancer and rhabdomyelisis. I will be on medication forever to counter act the effects of having my metabolism fried...AND the ill effects that are concomitant with frying one's metabolism. Osteoporosis, weight gain, and last year serious breathing problems that fortunately turned out to NOT be heart problems.

I was also hit with permanent ADRs from an antibiotic. *Peripheral neuropathy mostly. (pain and numbness in my feet and legs. Squelched my exercise routine.

Of course all these effects were misdiagnosed for at least 3 yrs as all new diseases that "just happened" because I was "getting older" (I was 41) *And along with this crap it cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars in boigus tests for conditions I didn't have but the dr wished I had and for theneeded tests that showed the conditions I DID have. *And I will now have to spend 100,000 bucks for medication if I live to *80 and that's a guess. Who knows what iflation will do

Now, of course I DO have insurance but A) that isn't going to give me my health back and *B) Even tho I really didnt pay for all that out of my own pocket the dr was shaking the money tree apparently without regard to my health. *The only new disease we discovered was "Cholesterol Neurosis" on the part of Doctors

If the *Dr wants to put you on drugs for "cholesterol" get the percentages he's worried about and get data on your arteries, They will refuse to get it. Because: *1) The test , cardiac catheterization, *is hazardous, *and 2) In most cases it will eliminate the need for drugs because it will show nice clear arteries.
Wow, I'd be pissed. I'm really sorry to hear about the damage the drugs caused you.

I agree with you they are pushing these statins like they are candy. I do think it's the pressure from the drug companies that is behind this push.

My ratios look good, I have really low blood pressure, there is no history of heart diease in my family and I have had a healthy diet for years. I am going to refuse to go on the meds.

Here's a link to a high cholesterol message board. They talk a lot about statins there. Many people are ticked off about the use of statins:

http://www.healthboards.com/boards/f...splay.php?f=69

Thanks for your post,

-helen
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-17-2005, 07:25 PM   #28
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

Somebody once said to throw out everything in your medicine cabinet except for the aspirin, and not to take anything else.

Sounds like pretty good advice...
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 05:27 AM   #29
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

[quote=GD-ER l
Scared the hell out of me too. *They had me convinced I was headed for heart surgery any minute... And while they were at it, they took some head x-rays to find out why I was getting stress headaches... Found a spot which just might be a fatal brain tumor... Sooo, MRI time with more nuclears...

WELLLLL, the nukes showed all was clear and that I should just know when to keep my big mouth shut around military doctors...
<The radiactive glow is just about gone - I think...>

Sooo, no cholestoral tests, no physicals, no fingers up the old wazooooo, no doctors, NO etc... And maybe -- just maybe -- my medical benefits won't kill me... 8)[/quote]

Hey GD-ER! This could have been written by my Dad.
He says "Just stay away from them!" I basically agree
with this view. For example, over the past 10 years
or so (counting specialists) I have seen around
12-14 different doctors, been hospitalized, had two (2)
MRIs, several EKGs and about 5 rountine physicals.
All of this resulted in very little help for my problems.
I would guess 90% of what worked for me was
discovered through my own research on the internet and elsewhere. For example, all meds and supplements
I take (100%) were found by me. Sometimes
you gotta go see 'em, but I lean strongly toward the
"just stay away" approach.

JG
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 05:52 AM   #30
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

I agree with the above even though I do go twice a year to the doc basically to get my cholesterol meds renewed. When I turned 40, all hell seemed to break loose. I had some moments when I felt light headed and weak. My GP doc at the time thought I might have MS for some reason. After several scans and a MRI they thought I had some kind of liver disease. Next we do a liver biopsy and after all said and done, they chalk up my problem to chonic hepatitis and gave me a $5 bottle of predizone which lowered my liver enzymes. I took this for about 6 months and never had another problem.

I'm grateful that the docs corrected my problem, but they sure scared the hell out of me and ran up some enormous bills for a $5 dollar solution to the problem. :-/
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 05:57 AM   #31
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

I take heavy dosages of the standard New Orleans drugs - onion and garlic - raw, grilled, fried.

If you croak - it was probably a bad batch - or not enough garlic or a cross reaction with La hot sauce.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 06:27 AM   #32
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

OOps - I forgot boiled - in Zatarains seafood boil of course.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 06:40 AM   #33
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

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I take heavy dosages of the standard New Orleans drugs - onion and garlic - raw, grilled, fried.

If you croak - it was probably a bad batch - or not enough garlic or a cross reaction with La hot sauce.
I like all that too......thank God for lipitor.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 06:51 AM   #34
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

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I take heavy dosages of the standard New Orleans drugs - onion and garlic - raw, grilled, fried.

If you croak - it was probably a bad batch - or not enough garlic or a cross reaction with La hot sauce.
Mix in with crawdads, boiled crabs, and fried shrimp. Dose with a bottle of Dixie beer. (Is that beer still around?)
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 07:14 AM   #35
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

Generic Claritin is extreeeeeeemly cheeep at Costco or Sams Club. I think I paid something like $6 for two 60-tablet bottles.

Wife likes the stuff. Makes me jumpy. I've had way better luck just flushing out the sinuses with a little homemade saline solution in a nose spray bottle.

As with many things, remove the cause rather than treat the symptoms.

But if a costco membership saves you a trip to "The Pusher", thats a good tradeoff...
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 07:18 AM   #36
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

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Generic Claritin is extreeeeeeemly cheeep at Costco or Sams Club. *I think I paid something like $6 for two 60-tablet bottles.

Wife likes the stuff. *Makes me jumpy. *I've had way better luck just flushing out the sinuses with a little homemade saline solution in a nose spray bottle.

As with many things, remove the cause rather than treat the symptoms.

But if a costco membership saves you a trip to "The Pusher", thats a good tradeoff...
Costco has a pretty cheap lunch too. $1.50 for a polish dog and drink. Again, thank god for lipitor.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 07:25 AM   #37
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

Yep

Dixie beer and Crawfish. Throw in garlic toes and small onions into the boil - to ah er counteract the salt.

Capsacin aka red pepper is supposed to be good for something also - I forget what.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 08:23 AM   #38
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

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Sooo, no cholestoral tests, no physicals, no fingers up the old wazooooo, no doctors, NO etc... And maybe -- just maybe -- my medical benefits won't kill me... 8)
My father followed this regimen for almost 10 years.

In his late 60s he finally went to the doctor about a patch of dry skin on his leg. One question led to another and a set of "routine" tests were ordered.

The dry skin was either psoriasis or a side effect of a high-salt diet (since eliminated). The blood test showed a double-digit PSA. A "finger followup" revealed a stage IV tumor and led to a "just-in-time" radical prostatectomy. Other than the PSA he was completely symptom-free, although the tumor could have been found years earlier.

He sees a doctor regularly now. Me too.

Quote:
I found out six months ago that my total cholesterol is around 293, but my good cholesterol is really high so my ratios are good. -helen
There's a link between stress (adrenaline release) and rising cholesterol. So anything you can do to reduce the stress might help. In my case it turned out to be tae kwon do, ER, and less coffee (although not necessarily in that order).

I wouldn't continue with any doctor who reaches for a prescription pad before a grocery list. Admittedly it's difficult for HMO physicians to have enough time to get to know their patients, but many chronic medical conditions are more easily (and safely) treated with diet than with technology.
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 04-18-2005, 10:39 AM   #39
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

GD-ER...some guys pay extra for that... :P
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page
Old 06-15-2005, 12:02 AM   #40
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Re: The Retire Early Home Page

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Originally Posted by razztazz

Now, of course I DO have insurance but A) that isn't going to give me my health back and *
DO THIS NOW:

Go to www.DrDavesBest.com and order a couple of bottles of his pharmaceutical grade fish oil- take 6-10 capsules a day.

He's a board certified internist and anti-aging expert, and if you sign up for his free newsletter, you'll get tons of info on the magic of high-dose omega 3 fatty acid (fish oil)... the mother of all anti-inflammation agents (and all disease, we are learning- results from inflammation).

My bp was fine til I was put on lipitor due to nephrotic syndrome. My arms and hands cramped up terribly.

Turns out lipitor (statins) wipe out your heart's CoQ10, raising your bp. 200mg/day Jarrow CoQ10 allowed be to drop the lotensin they gave me for my lipitor-induced hypertension.

6-10 mg fish oil (Dr Daves- they are not all as pure) solved my muscle aches and helped my asthma.

From one Chester Arthur fan to another... get over to DrDavesBest.com and start eating plenty of fish oil... it CAN ONLY HELP.

If you got high bp- get on the 200 mg CoQ10, too.

Best Wishes- Don't Quit Yet...

Art
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