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Old 09-05-2016, 12:59 PM   #61
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DW and I are in this situation too. We've agreed to consider the idea of a CCRC, probably sometime after we hit 60, we'll start thinking about it.

I will say that having to guide Dad through both independent living and then assisted living was a real eye opener. In the end, these are businesses and someone in the corporation will have a cold heart. Even in the best run place.

As for CCRCs, some may have fine print about removal if you are violent. I think they avoid that in most cases by drugging those prone to it into a haze. And if I do lose my mind and become violent, maybe a drug haze isn't a bad thing. I don't know. It is tricky, KIDs or NOT.

Finally, to the OP, don't forget NOW. Make sure all your documents are up to date! Should you and spouse go out together in a fiery crash, you may not want your assets going places at the State's choosing.
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Old 09-05-2016, 01:12 PM   #62
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That's pretty much the way I'm playing it. In fact I could stay here, hire someone to check on me 3 times a week, pay for cabs to take me shopping, get one of those I Fell Down and I can't Get up, alarms, pay someone to mow the grass and shovel the walkway and it would cost the same or less than moving into an apartment.
One nice thing about CCRC's is that you can get somebody to make sure you are taking your medication as dictated by your doctor, even if you are becoming a bit "drifty". Also, if you can't reach your alarm (or are unconscious or for some other reason can't operate it), they will check on you when you don't show up at meal time.

But with F right next door, we are thinking of trying to muddle along together as long as we can, checking on one another each day. Being introverts, we'd rather live in our own homes as long as possible.

If I was ultimately left completely alone, I'd promptly get on the waiting list for a CCRC.
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Old 09-05-2016, 01:39 PM   #63
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One nice thing about CCRC's is that you can get somebody to make sure you are taking your medication as dictated by your doctor, even if you are becoming a bit "drifty". Also, if you can't reach your alarm (or are unconscious or for some other reason can't operate it), they will check on you when you don't show up at meal time.

But with F right next door, we are thinking of trying to muddle along together as long as we can, checking on one another each day. Being introverts, we'd rather live in our own homes as long as possible.

If I was ultimately left completely alone, I'd promptly get on the waiting list for a CCRC.
Maybe I'm misreading just what CCRC is. If I am decreasingly functional beyond the At-Home living assistance I can pay for (Cheap stuff/non-institutionalization) I have the bread to throw at a REAL assisted living operation. I have no problem with that. But that little "What-if" scenario you painted is too small a number for me to wring my hands over. I cannot move into place maybe 10 or 20 years BEFORE I get "drifty" just in case I get drifty

If any of that other stuff happens ie I did everything possible with the alarms and visitations etc etc and I still fall and have to eat it... well then, to paraphrase Edward G Robinson "That's the end of Ricco."

If What I read as CCRC is really an Assisted Living Community, to quote Gilda Radner: "Never mind."
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Old 09-05-2016, 01:48 PM   #64
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razztazz: I guess the ideas is you just move among the levels of care seamlessly, versus having to do the hard work of finding a REAL assisted living operation.

You choose your CCRC while you have a brain, before you lose it and can't make that choice.

But there are other issues. Will the CCRC be there in 30 years? What will it be like? Will it have been sold to new ownership? Etc., etc. Those are the issues that give me pause. You ostensibly are making a real decision today, while you can, that really might only come into play 20 years or so hence.

As for medication reminders or health checks: independent living places will do that too, although you may pay a few bucks per day extra (they are all different). Most assisted living places do it as part of the normal pay. I'm guessing W2R might have just been talking about the later parts of CCRC living.
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Old 09-05-2016, 01:52 PM   #65
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If I was ultimately left completely alone, I'd promptly get on the waiting list for a CCRC.
It might be too late by then, some have waiting lists of ten years or more. We're already on one, having applied several years ago and I'm 66. They really don't want you there until you're at least 70 but I wanted to be at or near the top of the list when the time comes. The guy at the one we applied to said they've had one 90-some year old guy on the list more than a decade. Every time they call he says "Nope. Not ready yet." so he goes back on the list. So you do have that option if it's offered where you are.
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Old 09-05-2016, 02:01 PM   #66
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It might be too late by then, some have waiting lists of ten years or more. We're already on one, having applied several years ago and I'm 66. They really don't want you there until you're at least 70 but I wanted to be at or near the top of the list when the time comes. The guy at the one we applied to said they've had one 90-some year old guy on the list more than a decade. Every time they call he says "Nope. Not ready yet." so he goes back on the list. So you do have that option if it's offered where you are.
Yeah, that worries me, I admit it.
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Old 09-05-2016, 10:37 PM   #67
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Most people who move into CCRC's are in their early to mid 80's. Usually the move happens because of some "event" such as a fall. I definitely see the benefits of a CCRC but they won't manage your money or make healthcare decisions. That is left to the resident and his or her family members. Clearly we need some younger friends!


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Old 09-06-2016, 02:51 PM   #68
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I agreed to be alternate POA and Executor for my childless biological aunt and her husband many years ago. Another uncle was the primary POA and Executor. Well this uncle developed a brain tumor and died quickly, then my aunt developed lung cancer and died, leaving me as primary POA/Executor for her husband who is not my biological relative. My mistake, I should've resigned before it got to this, but now he is incapacitated, can't walk or talk, 91 years old. He was living in a CCRC and has been moved to the LTC section. I live 5 hours away, and it has been a lot of work taking care of his health and financial needs. I know this sounds heartless, but I just went through this with my own dad and I am really resenting having to do this with an uncle I was never even close to. This uncle didn't make it easy for me either....I have had to search for everything I need to conduct his business, ie, title to his automobile, safety deposit box key, tax returns, etc. I would never agree to do this again. Now I have to get rid of all the contents of his 2 bedroom apartment. The nursing home calls me daily asking me to make health care decisions. He does have biological nieces/nephews and I am seriously considering revoking my POA and having one of them appointed. Think hard about who you want to be your POA and it works best if you live close by.
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Old 09-06-2016, 04:01 PM   #69
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becca, bless you for carrying through this far. If it really is a burden, you probably should get the transfer to another POA taken care of soon, before he passes. Again, not to be heartless, but it gets really complicated then.

I have a friend in your same situation. In this case, an aunt of a spouse. He is an incredible man to do what he has done for her estate. Because of the local laws, and the fact most of her stuff went to probate, he's had to send out something like 18 letters to all kinds of per stirpes relatives AND get responses from each one. It has been a huge burden. Sure, he has taken a reasonable "expense" for this, but it is a pittance.

This kind of thing isn't easy for anybody.
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Old 09-06-2016, 04:35 PM   #70
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Now I have to get rid of all the contents of his 2 bedroom apartment. The nursing home calls me daily asking me to make health care decisions. He does have biological nieces/nephews and I am seriously considering revoking my POA and having one of them appointed. Think hard about who you want to be your POA and it works best if you live close by.
I had to do this with my mother's estate and helped DW deal with her father's and for her, near the end of his life it was close to a full-time job. And we were local. I can't imagine having to do it from 5 hours away.

I'd be the last one to call you heartless if you handed the task off to another relative.
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Old 09-06-2016, 04:40 PM   #71
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I agreed to be alternate POA and Executor for my childless biological aunt and her husband many years ago. Another uncle was the primary POA and Executor. Well this uncle developed a brain tumor and died quickly, then my aunt developed lung cancer and died, leaving me as primary POA/Executor for her husband who is not my biological relative. My mistake, I should've resigned before it got to this, but now he is incapacitated, can't walk or talk, 91 years old. He was living in a CCRC and has been moved to the LTC section. I live 5 hours away, and it has been a lot of work taking care of his health and financial needs. I know this sounds heartless, but I just went through this with my own dad and I am really resenting having to do this with an uncle I was never even close to. This uncle didn't make it easy for me either....I have had to search for everything I need to conduct his business, ie, title to his automobile, safety deposit box key, tax returns, etc. I would never agree to do this again. Now I have to get rid of all the contents of his 2 bedroom apartment. The nursing home calls me daily asking me to make health care decisions. He does have biological nieces/nephews and I am seriously considering revoking my POA and having one of them appointed. Think hard about who you want to be your POA and it works best if you live close by.
Thank you for this thoughtful and honest post. I hope one of his biological nieces or nephews will take it over for you.
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Old 09-06-2016, 05:37 PM   #72
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I agreed to be alternate POA and Executor for my childless biological aunt and her husband many years ago. Another uncle was the primary POA and Executor. Well this uncle developed a brain tumor and died quickly, then my aunt developed lung cancer and died, leaving me as primary POA/Executor for her husband who is not my biological relative. My mistake, I should've resigned before it got to this, but now he is incapacitated, can't walk or talk, 91 years old. He was living in a CCRC and has been moved to the LTC section. I live 5 hours away, and it has been a lot of work taking care of his health and financial needs. I know this sounds heartless, but I just went through this with my own dad and I am really resenting having to do this with an uncle I was never even close to. This uncle didn't make it easy for me either....I have had to search for everything I need to conduct his business, ie, title to his automobile, safety deposit box key, tax returns, etc. I would never agree to do this again. Now I have to get rid of all the contents of his 2 bedroom apartment. The nursing home calls me daily asking me to make health care decisions. He does have biological nieces/nephews and I am seriously considering revoking my POA and having one of them appointed. Think hard about who you want to be your POA and it works best if you live close by.
I can understand many of your issues. I cared for my father in my home for several years before he died, and then was the executor after his death. It was a challenging several years.

My husband and I have no children and no family at all. We know we are on our own, and are planning the best we can for our future care. My question to you is....would it have made a difference to you if there had been an agreement of payment for your oversight right in the beginning? A legal process that paid you a specific amount, let's say somewhere between $5,000.00 - $10,000.00 a year, every year until the death of both your aunt and uncle, to be the fiduciary and POA? Would that make it a little easier to bear?

I have no idea the legalities involved but I am sure there are many. I guess I'm just asking if knowing your time and effort was being acknowledged through an agreed upon amount of payment, would you want to continue?

I would expect that needing to trust the person appointed is most essential, but asking someone to do this without an understood "fee" is asking to much, I think.
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Old 09-06-2016, 06:12 PM   #73
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I volunteered to do this for a friend of mine who has Alzheimer's and her DH was dying of cancer. I did not want her to be a ward of the state. She has no kids but does have 2 adult step children. I was doing everything but thankfully the stepson took over the financials for me although I have access to review. It is a lot of work and she is an hour away in a facility. We go to visit every few weeks to keep track of how is doing on meds, etc. The home calls us for stupid things but when her neck was stuck down and she couldn't raise it and it was hurting they never called. A call to her doc got her meds changed and it went away. However, if it had stayed that way too long it would have been permanent. We never expected to be paid because they could not afford it. I think if one of the other kids is willing to take it over that would be great providing they really do look after him in the home. YOu should just make sure they will look out for his best interests. This is a lot of work and not fun.
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Old 09-07-2016, 10:52 PM   #74
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I agree, it is a lot of work looking after someone in a CCRC or home, and if you don't do it, the person doesn't get as much attention as someone with strong advocates who visit frequently will get. Just human nature.


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Old 09-08-2016, 07:53 AM   #75
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I agree, it is a lot of work looking after someone in a CCRC or home, and if you don't do it, the person doesn't get as much attention as someone with strong advocates who visit frequently will get. Just human nature.
Very true, even in the very best facilities.
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Old 09-08-2016, 08:55 AM   #76
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Interesting topic. We are also child-FREE, and this does cross my mind, although working in healthcare myself, I've seen many cases where family/children are out of the picture. I don't judge, you never know what caused family strife.

I'm surprised this wasn't mentioned yet although I may have missed it. There is something call Geriatric Case Management, privately paid for, whereby you hire a nurse or social worker to basically manage you and advocate for you. Aginglifecare.org is a good start.

From what I know the nurse is basically on call 24/7, if anything happens to you, fall, hospital etc, they go with you. They get paid for all phone calls they make on your behalf. I've worked with several in the past and they are really great to work with, especially in cases where there's no family involvement, or family is long distance.

I had a medical doctor as a patient and his daughter was also a doctor but lived overseas. The GCM was the go between.
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Old 09-08-2016, 10:52 AM   #77
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Many very high quality people posting on this topic. The world is lucky to have you all.

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Old 09-08-2016, 01:15 PM   #78
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I'm surprised this wasn't mentioned yet although I may have missed it. There is something call Geriatric Case Management, privately paid for, whereby you hire a nurse or social worker to basically manage you and advocate for you. Aginglifecare.org is a good start.
Thanks for this idea. This would reduce the burden on friends/ family. I will definitely consider this as part of my plan.


I suppose you could also hire a social worker who specializes in senior care.
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Old 09-08-2016, 01:59 PM   #79
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Great information. Not only are we childfree, we live in a barn miles from town and no neighbors in sight (to see the buzzards circling, I guess). The plan is to sell out when we can't manage out there any longer. I hope we find a good advocate when needed. God Bless all the big hearts that take care of the elderly.

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Old 09-08-2016, 03:03 PM   #80
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I'm surprised this wasn't mentioned yet although I may have missed it. There is something call Geriatric Case Management, privately paid for, whereby you hire a nurse or social worker to basically manage you and advocate for you. Aginglifecare.org is a good start.

From what I know the nurse is basically on call 24/7, if anything happens to you, fall, hospital etc, they go with you. They get paid for all phone calls they make on your behalf. I've worked with several in the past and they are really great to work with, especially in cases where there's no family involvement, or family is long distance.

I had a medical doctor as a patient and his daughter was also a doctor but lived overseas. The GCM was the go between.
This is something I plan to set up for us as we age. Seems like such a great solution to reduce the burden on friends/distant relatives (for those of us without children, especially).
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