Carbs or calories? Atkins vs WW

[googily]

Quote:

Originally Posted by candrew +1 Eat less, exercise more. It ain't rocket science!

I think for most people in this thread that is not necessarily a news flash. It's about how you structure your eating to ensure that you are satisfied while still operating in a deficit. And that works differently for different people.

[razztazz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by marko Back when Atkins was the rage I mentioned to my doctor that I wanted to try it, fully expecting a lecture on the dangers. Instead, he said: "I have six patients who were injecting diabetics and after being on Atkins don't have to inject anymore". I did lose about 20 pounds but found sticking with the regimen was really hard to do...plus I love pasta and bread!

Giving up regular infusions of pasta was harder than quitting cigarettes. I got over the cigarettes. I have never gotten over the pasta. Every once in a while I just let loose and have some.

[Cobra9777]

DW and I lost a combined 110 lbs by keeping our net carbs at 30-50g per day. I hit my target weight in about 2-3 months. DW took about a year, but she had a larger gap. We used myfitnesspal to track every gram of carbs and for some very careful meal planning. We did not follow any specific method, although DW had some information from her doctor that got us started down this path.

That was 2-3 years ago, but we still maintain a low-carb diet, averaging around 100g per day. But we don't fret about eating pasta, rice, potatoes, bread, or dessert from time to time, especially when eating out or over at someone's house. We just don't buy any of that stuff, so meals at home consist mainly of meat and fresh vegetables with modest fat... and red wine . We've both maintained our weight, although on a recent 15-day cruise, we each gained 10 lbs that took about 2 months to shed.

[Aerides]

Low Carb, regrettably, is the only thing that's really worked for me after about 35. I think it's in part because after about a week or two, when the only snack is a piece of meat or cheese or veggie, you go "eh I'll pass". But the long term benefits kick in I find when your overall appetite and consumption go down.

[Marita40]

That's the key. Low carb really curbs cravings. A low carb, high fat, moderate protein breakfast holds me easily to dinner time.

[googily]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marita40 That's the key. Low carb really curbs cravings. A low carb, high fat, moderate protein breakfast holds me easily to dinner time.

Exactly. My first meal of the day was around 12:30 pm, and it was mixed greens with about 6 oz of chargrilled chicken and ranch dressing and a few croutons, and about seven strawberries (thank heavens for the salad bar place downstairs). MFP says that's about 500 calories, 24 g carbs, 18 g fat, 35 g protein, and 4 g carbs.

Right now, three hours later, I could stand to maybe have a snack, maybe some cheese. But that would require going down three floors to the self-serve kiosk here at work, and I don't feel like getting up, so I'm just drinking more water instead. :-)

But I can remember back to my many years of trying to follow a low-fat approach, using carbs as the basis of my eating, that being under 500 calories at 3:30 pm would have had me beyond ravenous, and I'd be racing down to the kiosk to buy something "low fat," but loaded with sugar, wolfing it down, and would then be at 700 calories and still hungry and cranky, and would arrive home ready to break down cabinet doors to eat whatever I could get my hands on.

Bringing an end to the blood sugar spikes--even as someone who is not remotely close to being diabetic--is just huge.

[Bestwifeever]

Even Weight Watchers now takes carbs into consideration when assigning its points to foods--for the same amount of calories, a high carb food has more points, a high protein food has fewer.

[euro]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tailgate I'm a yoyo when it comes to diets...once I slip, I slide... DW is great about eating healthy, but she seems deprived of the good stuff. Only diet I've lost on was Atkins.. 22 lbs about 12 years ago. I think it's time to rinse and repeat. Any tips on Atkins? Golf buddy has lost 25 lbs in a short time and he swears by it (energy, easy vs WW, etc). I'm guessing that one size doesn't fit all..

There are many, many versions of low carb - if Atkins worked for you 12y ago, try the same thing again? But this time, make it a lifestyle, not just lose weight and then switch back to "regular" diet.
Check out Zoë Harcombe – Obesity Researcher, Author The Harcombe Diet or www.wheatbelly.com for more updated versions. Zoe is in the UK, Bill Davis in the US.

[joeea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tailgate I'm a yoyo when it comes to diets...once I slip, I slide... DW is great about eating healthy, but she seems deprived of the good stuff. Only diet I've lost on was Atkins.. 22 lbs about 12 years ago. I think it's time to rinse and repeat. Any tips on Atkins? Golf buddy has lost 25 lbs in a short time and he swears by it (energy, easy vs WW, etc). I'm guessing that one size doesn't fit all..

When I need to lose weight, Atkins/South Beach Diet is it. Low carb is easy to do, and (for my wife and I at least) effective.

Now if I could only convince myself to stay on it, I'd be all set... Damn - now I'm craving pasta...

As far as tips: get yourself a few cookbooks for Atkins and/or South Beach. It's nice to have a wide selection of recipes to choose from - otherwise it can get boring.

[Danmar]

In the long term, smaller portions, less carbs and liquor, more exercise seems to work for me. No magic bullet, at least in my case. Holding pretty well at 6ft 3 and 210 lbs.

[Blue Collar Guy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by razztazz Giving up regular infusions of pasta was harder than quitting cigarettes. I got over the cigarettes. I have never gotten over the pasta. Every once in a while I just let loose and have some.

, I got over the cigarettes ,not the pasta!, I love it.

[2017ish]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danmar In the long term, smaller portions, less carbs and [sufficient] liquor, more exercise seems to work for me. No magic bullet, at least in my case. Holding pretty well at 6ft 3 and 210 lbs.

Pretty much the same for DW and I--with one important modification.

[sengsational]

Quote:

Originally Posted by exnavynuke Calories in < calories out works 100% of the time. It's science. How you choose to ingest those carbs and what amount of exercise is involved are the only differences between any two diets that actually work.

That leaves out how what you eat affects appetite.

It is incorrect, in my view, that people can eat the same number of calories of any number of macro-nutrient profiles and expect to have the same level of hunger. In other words, the person eating simple carbohydrates is likely going to be more hungry. Our bodies are programmed to never starve, so if one is, on average, more often hungry, that person will tend to eat more. Yes, you can say "I'm only going to eat X calories max, per day", but doing it for the rest of your life is "impossible". One thing you CAN do for the rest of your life is eat food that doesn't cause you to be as hungry.

Quote:

Originally Posted by exnavynuke p.s. If it's a diet you're on, that means you plan on stopping it at some point. That means you'll very likely move back to the old habits that got you to a point where you needed a diet in the first place. A lifestyle change is what is needed to ensure future weight remains where you want it.

Agree 100%

[exnavynuke]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sengsational That leaves out how what you eat affects appetite. It is incorrect, in my view, that people can eat the same number of calories of any number of macro-nutrient profiles and expect to have the same level of hunger. In other words, the person eating simple carbohydrates is likely going to be more hungry. Our bodies are programmed to never starve, so if one is, on average, more often hungry, that person will tend to eat more. Yes, you can say "I'm only going to eat X calories max, per day", but doing it for the rest of your life is "impossible". One thing you CAN do for the rest of your life is eat food that doesn't cause you to be as hungry. Agree 100%

I don't recall making any statements regarding how caloric intake affects a person's appetite... What you're talking about isn't "what makes weight loss work" (the thing I pointed out), it's really "what makes some people more likely to follow their diet", which is a different subject, hence why I made the follow-on comment about lifestyle changes.

[gauss]

I never had any desire to do low-carb, because I liked the carbs. I have lost weight on my own in the past by counting calories and exercise with tools like myfitnesspal and its predecessors.

For me weight loss is very much a mental game. When I focus on it and plan for it it happens. When I loose my focus the weight comes back.

In 2003 I lost 50 lbs. Then I got transferred to a new job location with a very different culture and problems emerged. I eventually gained much of the weight back.

In 2013 I lost 30 lbs (the new work site had improved by then). Then I developed a major kidney stone having me curled up on the couch for 5 weeks. I got really behind in things. Early the next year, my father died. I was only child so I spent much time funeral planning and managing his affairs. The weight came back.

This year I decided to try again but to do one thing different. I joined Weight Watchers (WW). My wife had done it for years. I figured that I could easily loose the weight and attain goal weight/lifetime status where you stop paying if you remain in compliance.

This was exactly the type of system that I needed. It would require me to weigh in once per month below my goal weight to avoid $15 charges. The frugal guy in me loves it. It keeps constant tension with the weight so I don't loose focus.

The first test came this month when I went on vacation for 10 days. I gained almost 10 pounds. Now I am concentrating on loosing this weight before the end of August so I won't have to pay anything.

Understand what is important to you and find a system that reinforces it.

-gauss

[Chuckanut]

Just to confuse things a bit more:

Is white bread better than whole-wheat? - CNN.com

Quote:

We originally viewed (white and whole-wheat bread) as radical opposites in terms of their health benefits. But to our great surprise, we found no difference between the effects those two breads had on the various end points that we measured," said study author Eran Segal, a professor at the Weizmann Institute of Science in Israel.

[razztazz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuckanut Just to confuse things a bit more: Is white bread better than whole-wheat? - CNN.com

This is not confusing to me Just read the label. Whole wheat, whole grain, refined starch...? All the same. Besides, think about it. 100% wheat/"Whole grain" is about 99% the refined white starch that they say is bad with a laughably small amount of husk mixed in. Another massive dietary hoax designed to take people's money. Even doctors and so-called health care types, in my personal experience, are supremely ignorant of almost everything having to do with diet and exercise. Can't read labels on food items or drugs, or my medical alert card

[CyclingInvestor]

Not that I recommend this for anyone else -

When I retired 10+ years ago at 48, I was way too heavy and diagnosed as prediabetic. Over the next 10 years I slowly lost 80 lbs by controlling portion sizes a bit and exercising a lot.

Not good enough. I was diagnosed as diabetic 6 months ago, put on a few drugs, and started strictly controlling carbs (60 grams/meal max), cutting out most of my favorite foods - pasta, pizza, fruit juice, ice cream, almost all alcohol etc. I do not even count calories anymore - I cannot find many calories that appeal to me - and have dropped 21 more pounds since then. I just had my "-100 lb" celebratory dinner last weekend.

[Tailgate]

OP here.... 2nd day of counting carbs.

Small print is enlightening.. today I learned that my morning coffee routine spends 6 of my 20 carbs for the day (on the induction plan). My magnifying app on my smartphone is going to get a lot of use for awhile... those numbers are hard to read, but critical in my plan.

[garyt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bestwifeever Even Weight Watchers now takes carbs into consideration when assigning its points to foods--for the same amount of calories, a high carb food has more points, a high protein food has fewer.

Yea, if you follow WW you will be on a carb restricted diet, just not as intense as Atkins,et al. I actually think WW is an easy way to lose weight, you can eat pretty much anything and for me at least it's way more enjoyable. I took it up with my wife a few years ago and lost 30 lb.s, to where I weighed less at 58 than in high school. Gotta hit the weights though when you diet so you don't lose muscle.