Cardiac CT Scan for Calcium

For those that had a CT Scan done. Did you have it done because of other symptoms that gave you concern or was it a preventive measure like getting a colonoscopy at 50?


I had mine done because of a few risk factors... got a score of zero...


I paid the whole cost as my deductible was (well, still is) high...
 
I got a zero too on the hard stuff. Then a couple years later I got a CIMT and scored the lowest on the soft stuff. My cholesterol numbers are 'bad', have been 'bad', and will continue to be 'bad' until the medical establishment can change the definition of 'bad'. It's not the cholesterol that's the problem, it's inflammation. No inflammation, no build-up.
 
I got a zero too on the hard stuff. Then a couple years later I got a CIMT and scored the lowest on the soft stuff. My cholesterol numbers are 'bad', have been 'bad', and will continue to be 'bad' until the medical establishment can change the definition of 'bad'. It's not the cholesterol that's the problem, it's inflammation. No inflammation, no build-up.


Do you exercise? What do you eat?


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I had mine done because of a few risk factors... got a score of zero...


I paid the whole cost as my deductible was (well, still is) high...

Do you exercise? What do you eat?



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I'm what you might call a "statin-denier".
I'm genetically predisposed to having higher cholesterol ("hyperlipidemia"?) It's not sky-high, but generally "above normal".
My doctor(s) have consistently recommended statins, stating my risk factors; I've always declined. I've read up on the subject and the actual theme seems to be that controlling cholesterol levels have nothing to do with preventing heart disease, because cholesterol in and of itself does not cause heart disease! It's inflammation of the arteries and the resulting plaques that break loose/clog/burst! Lowering cholesterol has no preventative effect; i.e, it's not just the simple concept of "cholesterol clogs the plumbing". One of the best books out there is Gary Taubes' "Good Calories, Bad Calories; Fats, Carbs, and the Controversial Science of Diet". Check it out.

Anyhoo, a few years ago I had an "episode". I drank some really hot coffee, which, in hindsight caused symptoms of cold sweats, a drop in bp, and chest pain (There's a word for that type of reaction, but it escapes me at the moment...). Since I was a relatively healthy 50 year-old with no other symptoms, the ER I went to decided to do a CT scan. The result was a calcification score of ZERO. Hmmm, and I have high cholesterol...
My current doc was not aware of my CT scan and also recommended statins.

So I will not take statins, and just to show the doc I can have better lipid numbers, I'm eating more veggies, organic meats, and staying away from refined carbs. Looking forward to my blood tests later in the year.

The thing about statins: lots of reported scary side effects like permanent muscular problems and dimentia. My father took statins (life-long smoker and drinker) and he did get a little wacky in his later years...

Plus, and this is the real kicker, Google this: "How much will statins prolong a normal lifespan." Hint: not enough to bother with them.
 
The thing about statins: lots of reported scary side effects

Story of my life, ha ha ha It's a good thing I have good medical insurance or I;d have died broke years ago from a statin induced death
 
Do you exercise? What do you eat?



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A long time ago did, but had stopped for many years....

Just started to exercise again about 5 months ago... way out of shape and can feel the pain two days after exercise...

Eating better since getting married, but I would not say a 'great' diet... just good... but still eat Reese's and York's much more than I should.... have cut way back on fired food and have slowed down on breads.... not stopped, but slowed down...

But, any way you measure I have too much weight.... just at the edge of overweight and obese...
 
A long time ago did, but had stopped for many years....

Just started to exercise again about 5 months ago... way out of shape and can feel the pain two days after exercise...

Eating better since getting married, but I would not say a 'great' diet... just good... but still eat Reese's and York's much more than I should.... have cut way back on fired food and have slowed down on breads.... not stopped, but slowed down...

But, any way you measure I have too much weight.... just at the edge of overweight and obese...


Thank you Texas Proud. You must have some great genes to have the zero score while not exercising and eating the way you do.


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For those that had a CT Scan done. Did you have it done because of other symptoms that gave you concern or was it a preventive measure like getting a colonoscopy at 50?
If you follow a prevention model, the guideline is age 40 for men and age 50 for women (heart disease affects more women than men, but it affects them about 10 years later). If you've got additional risk factors, you would get scanned earlier.

If you follow the allopathic (conventional) model, you wait for symptoms. That was my case - chest pain during exercise. I wish I would have done it sooner, but can't worry about that now.
 
Do you exercise? What do you eat?
Not too much exercise. I certainly haven't seen the inside of gym since I was forced to in college, but do ride a bike, more to get out in nature than exercise. I eat a minimum of refined foods, but I'd say most people would say my diet is "unhealthy" because it includes meat and dairy. But I eat fermented foods (and beverages) that I make myself (bugz is good).

Besides 'bad' cholesterol accompanied by (apparently) no/low inflammation, I'm blessed with low blood pressure, just like my dad. I've been asked if I was an endurance runner (bwahhh, haha ha!). I think BP, cholesterol, CHD inflammation, etc are driven from a combination of genes and where your microbiota ended-up settling. I wish that 23andMe would join with uBiome, ask health questions, and see what they find out.
 
I have been wanting an updated scan but have been holding off due to the radiation. As I recall 10 yrs ago they said it was the amount in TWO chest x-rays. Not exactly enough to turn me into the Incredible Hulk but my rule is: Less radiation is better than more radiation. Have the radiation levels they used dropped? I was surprised that some people mentioned they have had several in just a few years.
Yes! Radiation levels have dropped! Depends on the scanner, but the EBT scanner I use is the same level of radiation as a mammogram, so I have no qualms about doing it yearly.
 
Thanks to Dash man for bumping this thread. It's pretty timely for me too. I had a scan done about two weeks ago. My score was about 2200. Doc says that's about as high of a score as he has seen. Next step is to do some additional testing. I'm wearing a blood pressure monitor today, recording BP every 20 minutes for 24 hours. I've got a stress test scheduled for next week. Stress test is supposed to determine if any near-term intervention may be required. Assuming that is negative (fingers crossed), Doc wants to treat by making changes in diet and by stepping up exercise regimen. DW and I sat down with a nutritionist yesterday and got recommendations for changing the way we eat. Both Doc and nutritionist believe that diet makes the biggest difference. I think our pending retirement (later this year) will make it easier to make the changes we need to make.

Good luck to you Dash in dealing with your condition.


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Geez, why do docs say things like, "as high of a score as I've ever seen!" He just hasn't seen a whole lot of scores then. The preventive cardiologist and internist that I help specialize in this stuff and have many, many patients with higher scores than that. Heck txtig, it might be ALL hard, stable plaque and not increase risk hardly at all! You won't know that until your second scan though when you can measure rate of growth (or hopefully rate of stabilization or regression even!)

I hope he's planning on more testing than checking your blood pressure and giving you a stress test. And I really hope that stress test is not the kind where they inject you with nuclear isotopes - that is a tremendous radiation load. Because what if your BP and your stress test are ok? Then you still have no idea of the CAUSE of your plaque.

He is on the right track: diet, exercise, getting you into a nutritionist. I'm just not seeing the root cause analysis that hones in on the specific things to address.
 
Thank you for all the good input. Even though my cardiologist appointment is a month away, dietary changes started today and exercise tomorrow. Exercise is always a challenge because of my arthritis and neck/back issues, but I'll find a way.


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I too had neck/back and knee issues. One day after the regular exam and treatment, my PA says to me, "Pete, have you ever considered Yoga?" He went on to say, "I've been doing it for about two years now...." and so then the guy had immediate credibility with me. He wasn't just lecturing me about something he read in a journal, he was sharing his own experience.

So I tried it. It took awhile. It's different. And...I love it. Better than that, my neck/back/knee are all stronger to the point that in addition to yoga, I now swim, bike, and even slow jog a bit...no pain. I credit the yoga.

My local rec center has classes literally every day of the week. All that for a senior rate of less than 20 bucks a month.

Best prescription I ever got! And...anyone...I mean anyone can do yoga. There are yoga classes for chronically ill people with cancer for example. There are gentle, seated yoga classes for those who have trouble getting onto or up from the mat.

Think about it!
Pete
 
Not too much exercise. I certainly haven't seen the inside of gym since I was forced to in college, but do ride a bike, more to get out in nature than exercise. I eat a minimum of refined foods, but I'd say most people would say my diet is "unhealthy" because it includes meat and dairy. But I eat fermented foods (and beverages) that I make myself (bugz is good).

Besides 'bad' cholesterol accompanied by (apparently) no/low inflammation, I'm blessed with low blood pressure, just like my dad. I've been asked if I was an endurance runner (bwahhh, haha ha!). I think BP, cholesterol, CHD inflammation, etc are driven from a combination of genes and where your microbiota ended-up settling. I wish that 23andMe would join with uBiome, ask health questions, and see what they find out.


Yep, it sounds like you have won the gene lottery too. Good for you!

What fermented foods and beverages you make BTW?


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I had an EBT Calcium scan in my late 40's (father had first heart attack in late 50's and second at 65 killed him) and had a zero score. I'm thinking of having another (turning 65). My doc suggested statin a year ago for elevated cholesterol but I developed muscular aches and although testing said no damage, he suggested I stop. A few months ago, I resumed at half dose (5 mg lipitor generic) out of curiosity and don't seem to have side effects. I exercise regularly and BP is OK. My brother just had surgery to repair a heart valve so I'm wondering about that as a potential issue at some point. I will be having an annual physical in the near future so will discuss things then I guess.
 
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Hi Ian - I think you have a good plan to get another scan. As far as the muscle aches on a statin (that you are gratefully not experiencing now), these are often alleviated by supplementing some CoQ10. CoQ10 is a naturally-occurring substance in our bodies that produces energy for cell growth and maintenance, and guess what? Statins deplete it. So, keep CoQ10 in mind if the muscle aches come back.

And yes, discuss your brother's heart valve disease with your doc. Your risk is higher now because of that, and he may want to be proactive and have a look - I prefer echocardiograms vs. something invasive from the cath lab.

Sounds like you've made it to 65 without an event or symptoms, so I'd say your future looks outstanding!
 
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Turmeric and garlic also help lower cholesterol. There are 8 foods. I eat tons of them.


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Hi Ian - I think you have a good plan to get another scan. As far as the muscle aches on a statin (that you are gratefully not experiencing now), these are often alleviated by supplementing some CoQ10. CoQ10 is a naturally-occurring substance in our bodies that produces energy for cell growth and maintenance, and guess what? Statins deplete it. So, keep CoQ10 in mind if the muscle aches come back.

And yes, discuss your brother's heart valve disease with your doc. Your risk is higher now because of that, and he may want to be proactive and have a look - I prefer echocardiograms vs. something invasive from the cath lab.

Sounds like you've made it to 65 without an event or symptoms, so I'd say your future looks outstanding!


I tried the CoQ10 and it did not work.... upped the dosage and still did not work... doc said I am in the few % of people who just cannot take statins...
 
I have had results in lowering my cholesterol by taking phytosterols (plant sterols). I get them from Vitamin Shoppe.

See Phytosterols and cholesterol metabolism. - PubMed - NCBI

I don't see an article here just a review.

So, what are these plant sterols specifically?

How much should I be eating or taking as a supplement per day?

I noticed that article and every other one listed to the right have dates between 1997 and 2009. Old news? Superseded? Were plant sterols "all the rage" back then? I used to get robo calls from a highly placed local MD here in those days selling Phytonutrients and nutraceuticals and they sued the word sterols a lot.
 
I don't see an article here just a review.

So, what are these plant sterols specifically?

How much should I be eating or taking as a supplement per day?

I noticed that article and every other one listed to the right have dates between 1997 and 2009. Old news? Superseded? Were plant sterols "all the rage" back then? I used to get robo calls from a highly placed local MD here in those days selling Phytonutrients and nutraceuticals and they sued the word sterols a lot.

Its just a pub med abstract of the article. I take one super phytosterol 900 MG, 2X/day. You can find them at Vitamin Shoppe; they also have lower dose ones as well. You might have to experiment. I can't comment on the old news, just that this supplement worked for me. I have a friend who is a radiologist who suggested giving them a try. They are plant based nutrients.
 
I lowered my cholesterol by 40 points in a month by doing the same thing as DFW. YOu can take up to 3/day but I only needed one.
 
Thanks to Dash man for bumping this thread. It's pretty timely for me too. I had a scan done about two weeks ago. My score was about 2200. Doc says that's about as high of a score as he has seen. Next step is to do some additional testing. I'm wearing a blood pressure monitor today, recording BP every 20 minutes for 24 hours. I've got a stress test scheduled for next week. Stress test is supposed to determine if any near-term intervention may be required. Assuming that is negative (fingers crossed), Doc wants to treat by making changes in diet and by stepping up exercise regimen. DW and I sat down with a nutritionist yesterday and got recommendations for changing the way we eat. Both Doc and nutritionist believe that diet makes the biggest difference. I think our pending retirement (later this year) will make it easier to make the changes we need to make.


Update: I had a nuclear stress test performed last week. It did not show anything abnormal. Cardiologist gave me the option of waiting a year and doing another stress test, or having a cardiac catheterization now, which would provide a definitive picture of what's going on in my heart and would reveal any blockages. Catheterization involves going into a vein in the leg and working a tube with a camera up into the heart. He definitely wasn't pushing the catheterization, just giving me the option. I'll talk it over with PCP later his week and make a decision. But, the more I read on these high calcium scores ( like mine) the more it makes sense to me to check it out.



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