cholesterol

[ERD50]

Originally Posted by mark500

I am going to be totally politically incorrect here.

Thanks - I kinda wanted to say that, so thanks for taking the arrows for me

I have often thought that, when a group of people just don't have enough calories, they get thin. Very, very few exceptions. But we so often hear ' oh, I have a slow metabolism', etc , etc. I don't buy it, unless their doctor has identified a specific metabolic abnormality.

Now, I'll soften that a bit. One thing that may very well be true, is that some people may have a much higher built in drive level to eat. That would be hard to measure, so who knows? Maybe telling them to eat less is a bit like telling someone else to breath less? That could be a very powerful drive that is near impossible to overcome w/o actually physically restricting their access to food.

For me, my weight goes up sometimes, then I work to bring it down. No magic, eat more bulky foods, less total calories and more activity. It's not easy, but it's not really that hard either - it just takes diligence and constant monitoring. 200 extra calories a day will add up over time, and you have to pay attention to avoid the 200 extra - it's not much, a nibble here, a nibble there throughout the day can be over 200 easy.

-ERD50

[Khan]

I think the problem is we're fighting several hundred thousand years of evolution.

My main problem was stress eating. Eating extra (especially fat and protein) when under stress is a very sensible behavior for a hunter-gatherer, but a bad idea for a cubicle denizen.

After I retired I started losing weight without doing anything. A half pound a week for 3 years = ~80 pounds.

Yes, I could have lost weight while employed by carefully monitoring intake and by maintaining an exercise schedule, but I didn't.

[windsurf]

Here's more fodder: Low carb bests lowfat diet. Another study subject to the usual caveats re studies and the presumed filtration by popular press reportage: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25708495/

[Oldbabe]

"Average weight loss for those in the low-carb group was 10.3 pounds after two years. Those in the Mediterranean diet lost 10 pounds, and those on the low-fat regimen dropped 6.5."

Oh, great! Ten pounds after two years. What a great plan for those of us with 30 pounds to lose. Only six years to go!

[Rambler]

I did the low carb lost about 55 pounds and kept 45 or so off for more than 3 years, then really fell off the wagon. The original uptick started when an occasional sweet turned into a bit more often than occasional, then way too often, then complete meltdown. Where I live now in Asia, it is extremely hard to stay low carb if you want to lead a relatively normal life (asia = rice, lots of it). I enjoy a sandwich now and then, but if I expect to remain healthy and not gain, it has to be a high fiber, whole grain variety (not available here). I'm eating quite a bit of beans at the moment as it helps with another ailment, and I am finding that their high fiber seems to help keep me satisfied, and helps to keep the blood sugar from swinging too much.

As I said earlier, the low carb did help with reducing the ldl and tri-g, and raising the hdl. My chol is in a very good range still, but doc says I have to reduce the weight...

[ERD50]

Originally Posted by Oldbabe

Oh, great! Ten pounds after two years. What a great plan for those of us with 30 pounds to lose. Only six years to go!

IMO, that is the wrong way to look at it. For most people who put on an extra 30 #, they did it over a few years. Nothing wrong with taking a few years to take it off.

Originally Posted by Rambler

Where I live now in Asia, it is extremely hard to stay low carb if you want to lead a relatively normal life (asia = rice, lots of it).

And how many of those Asians on that 'hi carb' diet are obese, diabetic, and bad chol readings? Maybe it's not the 'carbs'? More likely the balance of *refined* carbs and total calories that other cultures eat.

-ERD50

[Khan]

Originally Posted by ERD50

IMO, that is the wrong way to look at it. For most people who put on an extra 30 #, they did it over a few years. Nothing wrong with taking a few years to take it off.




And how many of those Asians on that 'hi carb' diet are obese, diabetic, and bad chol readings? Maybe it's not the 'carbs'? More likely the balance of *refined* carbs and total calories that other cultures eat.

-ERD50

I imagine that until recently most Chinese people were rather poor, and barely got enough calories to sustain long hard work days.

Bloomberg.com: Science

[Rambler]

Originally Posted by ERD50

And how many of those Asians on that 'hi carb' diet are obese, diabetic, and bad chol readings? Maybe it's not the 'carbs'? More likely the balance of *refined* carbs and total calories that other cultures eat.

-ERD50

Lots of them. I have several diabetics and several with high cholesterol around me at work. I agree there is more to it than just carb. Much more to do with the balance (which is another reason I am trying to get "better carbs" from high fiber foods like beans as often as I can), and more protein. However, I think a lot of it has to do with the amount of exercise/labor you get. I believe that you can eat much more rice and be OK if you are doing a lot of that compared to little/no exercise. In today's work world in large cities, too many don't get or can't get enough exercise to offset the refinement in most of today's carb-rich foods.

I have been back and forth to Asia for over 27 years, and you might be surprised at the difference over those years. Many more are overweight/obese than back then.

Where I am, metabolic syndrome has become such a problem that the government has mandated that the doc/public insurance system follow-up with people the gov't deems at risk (determined at the gov't mandated annual physical exam) every three to six months. For men, I believe it is something like 70kgs/154lbs or more, or a 33 inch waist. For me, that would be a BMI of 21, which I feel would leave me weak and decimated.

Oh I'm Rambling again...the handle fits....Anyway, nutritional balance, exercise, and moderation are pretty much the keys, I suppose.

R

[Nords]

Originally Posted by Khan

I imagine that until recently most Chinese people were rather poor, and barely got enough calories to sustain long hard work days.

Like 18th- & 19th-century American farmers, especially out on the frontiers?

[Khan]

Originally Posted by Nords

Like 18th- & 19th-century American farmers, especially out on the frontiers?

An abundance of extra starchy and extra fatty food has coincided with decreased physical activity all over the globe.

[barker]

I've also read fish oil helps raise your hdl levels. Regarding low-carb, I think it works very well for some people at least, not sure about all people. I've personally lost about 100pounds doing low-carb. And my blood sugar levels and cholesterol levels are much improved.

[windsurf]

Here is a link to Dr. Eades' overview of the diet study (low carb, Mediterranean, and low fat) mentioned here a couple of days ago that just made the New England Journal of Medicine. Eades' explanation incorporates comments re the foibles of studies and also has a link to the primary text of the study for those inclined to go to the source. Eades and his wfie are the authors of Protein Power and so they have books to sell but his blog is a wealth of free commentary and source information for those who want to go beyond the often overly simplisitic diet reportage (often by journalists who are taking shortcuts and missing points). Health & Nutrition by Michael R. Eades, M.D. » Low-carb diet trumps low-fat diet, yet again

[haha]

I have been eating a very low carb diet for 10 years, ever since I had a borderline GTT. Not one piece of candy, slice of bread, or soft drink. I occasionally eat some dried beans or peas -a small portion. Mostly the carbs I eat are green veggies- salad, broccoli, mustard, spinach etc. All my numbers are good, though I really don't know what my cholesterol prior to going low carb was since I never kept any records. I know that it was basically unremarkable. Currently my HDL is higher than my triglycerides, though not by much, and my totchol to HDL ratio is below 3.

I dropped a quick 10 to 15 pounds, which gave me a pretty lean body. Basically everything seemed to get somewhat better to a lot better.

I know that I am usually in ketosis- everytime I get a urinalysis the Doc says (if it is a different person from before) why are you in heavy ketosis? You look healthy enough, people with ketones like this are usually half dead.

Without the weight and overall health effects I wouldn't do it, as it is kind of a pain, especially when I want to eat out. Also the very cheap diets that are featured in these forum pages are not available to me. This would also apply to really cheap countries where meat is a condiment. No can do. But I have had enough of most of those places anyway. Plenty of nice places with abundant meat and or fish to satisfy my modest travel needs.

One thing I like a lot is that I almost never get really hungry. I eat my three squares, but with normal hunger, never "oh crap I had better get some food and get it now", which was how I often felt prior to going low carb.

I do think that a person can lose weight on any diet, but for some low carb is much more comfortable. I lost 25# in no more than 4 months off an already thin body living in the bush in South America, eating mostly bananas and corn cakes (arepa) and rice and beans. And damn little of any of it. But every night I dreamed of food. Food was usually uppermost in my mind. If I ever got to a market city I would wolf down huge slabs of meat.

Low carb is a very simple diet to follow. If it is a starch or grain or sugar or even some fruits, don't eat it. If it is meat or fish or eggs or leafy veggies, eat it until you feel full, which comes along pretty quickly.

Ha

[Dawg54]

Originally Posted by haha

Low carb is a very simple diet to follow. If it is a starch or grain or sugar or even some fruits, don't eat it. If it is meat or fish or eggs or leafy veggies, eat it until you feel full, which comes along pretty quickly.

Ha

I guess I could do it, but it wouldn't be easy. I'm very weak when it comes to sweets. Not much on candy, but do like a desert here and there. Actually I'm not much over weight, maybe 10 lbs. My numbers are good, but I do take a satin. If I could just cut back on the deserts and snacks, I could easily shed a few lbs. Oh well, theres always tomorrow.

[barker]

I followed and still follow Dr Eades low carb diet plan. Lost 100 pounds and still would like to lose about 30 pounds more. But my health has improved tremendously.

[MODERATOR EDIT: commercial website]

And here's a link to an amusing article on the social impact of eating low-carb: Diary of a Carb Phobe

Bill

[haha]

Originally Posted by barker

I followed and still follow Dr Eades low carb diet plan. Lost 100 pounds and still would like to lose about 30 pounds more. But my health has improved tremendously.

[MODERATOR EDIT: commercial website]

And here's a link to an amusing article on the social impact of eating low-carb: Diary of a Carb Phobe

Bill

This piece was written by Gary Taubes, who is a prize winning science writer, and who just wrote the excellent book-Good Calories, Bad Calories. At least it seems excellent to me, but I do have an anti-establishment bias. I borrowed it from the library, but I plan to buy it for the biblio and work through some of the cited articles in the UW Medical Library.

Ha

[Rambler]

Ha- is that borderline glucose (in)tolerance test?

R

[CuppaJoe]

Originally Posted by haha

....

I know that I am usually in ketosis- everytime I get a urinalysis the Doc says (if it is a different person from before) why are you in heavy ketosis? You look healthy enough, people with ketones like this are usually half dead.

....

One thing I like a lot is that I almost never get really hungry. I eat my three squares, but with normal hunger, never "oh crap I had better get some food and get it now", which was how I often felt prior to going low carb.

...

Low carb is a very simple diet to follow. If it is a starch or grain or sugar or even some fruits, don't eat it. If it is meat or fish or eggs or leafy veggies, eat it until you feel full, which comes along pretty quickly.

Ha

I don't eat this way myself, Ha, but sure, if I load up on fat and meat I'm not hungry for a long time.

Five years ago I was sitting in my cardiac rehab nurse's office. The radio classical music was interrupted by an ad for the Atkins diet. Nurse Jim went ballistic, "that diet has brought me so many patients."

[windsurf]

Originally Posted by CuppaJoe

I don't eat this way myself, Ha, but sure, if I load up on fat and meat I'm not hungry for a long time.

Five years ago I was sitting in my cardiac rehab nurse's office. The radio classical music was interrupted by an ad for the Atkins diet. Nurse Jim went ballistic, "that diet has brought me so many patients."

That kind of nonsense drives me crazy. I am not a proponent of the Atkins diet per se but I am very familiar with it. Many people envision months and years of pigging out on cheese and fatty cuts of meat. In reality, he used the gluttunous aspect as the induction which is a relatively short time and then the adherent builds-in carbs in the form of fruits and veggies. The people the nurse was talking about were no doubt most often victims of a LIFETIME of dietary indiscretions in the form of refined carbs, sugar, trans fats and all of the other pro inflammatory factors that have created the diabetes epidemic and, in large part, the tidal wave of patients from whom nurse Jim and his employer make their living.