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Cholesterol and diet - You there haha?
Old 05-14-2016, 07:31 PM   #1
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Cholesterol and diet - You there haha?

I finally found an old thread started by haha that I was looking for. Here is the link.

LDL-C, LDL particle count, diet, and statins

I wanted to revisit this thread since my cholesterol has been creeping up a bit. I am now thinking of eating less beef and less diary.

I wonder if you would like to give an update? (I thought of PM'ing you, but I thought other people here may be interested in adding to the discussion )

Have you been eating more chicken? Does dark meat work as well or you are adhering to white meat? Still eating a lot of fish?
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Old 05-15-2016, 07:59 AM   #2
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You might want to read at Dr. Kendrick's book

The Great Cholesterol Con: The Truth About What Really Causes Heart Disease and How to Avoid It

He also has a lively blog at:

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org
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Old 05-15-2016, 08:45 AM   #3
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Didn't you see the news in April that Eli Lily cancelled the research and development of the drug evacetrapib. Although it worked and lowered bad cholesterol and raised good, it had no effect on heart disease. Seems pretty good proof that cholesterol numbers are not useful in evaluating heart disease.

Besides, its been known for years that the cholesterol you eat does not effect your blood cholesterol.
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Old 05-15-2016, 09:41 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by mpeirce View Post
I've been battling my doctor for a few years regarding cholesterol and heart disease. It's reached the point that I think she would prefer I find a new doctor. I was on a statin that kept my numbers down, but they pulled me off that one due to discovering a bad interaction with my blood pressure med. The new statin they put me on gave me major muscle pain and weakness. My doctor didn't believe it was happening. While researching that I ran across Dr. Kendrick. He makes an awful lot of sense, and his numbers check out as far as I can tell. I took myself off the pravastatin and felt much better, but now my cholesterol is up. She (doc) is really pushing me to take a statin. She is absolutely in the "high cholesterol = imminent death" camp. We're changing medical plans soon, and so I won't be seeing her anymore. I wonder what my next doc will think.
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Old 05-15-2016, 09:52 AM   #5
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My cardiologist just put me on 40 mg of a Lipitor generic, more concerned with keeping my LDL low and said HDL doesn't matter any more. I had a high cardiac calcium score in a recent test and he wants my LDL below 60.


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Old 05-15-2016, 10:17 AM   #6
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Both my parents were on statins for years, and both ended up with clogged arteries requiring surgical treatment. My dad had one near his heart and my mom had one in her neck. They weren't couch potatoes, stayed active running their business and traveling, but didn't do any formal exercise and had rich diets with lots of red meat, sauces, desserts, etc. Mom has high blood pressure, and dad never did.

My cholesterol has gone up these past couple years, in spite of regular cardio and weight training. I lost 9 pounds over the last year, and it still went up again according to a screening at work. Seems like those screenings show a higher value than my doctor, maybe because the screenings are usually in April, and my physical is usually after the summer months of extra activity.

I'm going to take ginger supplements, 3 g/day, and see what happens. Might even get a blood test with one of those online outfits after a couple months to see what my lipids are up to.
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Old 05-15-2016, 10:38 AM   #7
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IMHO your blood cholesterol doesn't really have anything to do with your risk. This was shown quite a while ago.

Quote:
nearly 75 percent of patients hospitalized for a heart attack had cholesterol levels that would indicate they were not at high risk for a cardiovascular event, based oncurrent national cholesterol guidelines.

Specifically, these patients had low-density lipoprotein (LDL) cholesterol levels that met current guidelines, and close to half had LDL levels classified in guidelines as optimal (less than 100 mg/dL).
Most heart attack patients' cholesterol levels did not indicate cardiac risk
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Old 05-15-2016, 02:29 PM   #8
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Back in 2013, tests showed I had high cholesterol. Dr put me on statin for a trial. I didn't like the side effects and we stopped. Had more blood work a year or so later and we agreed that although the cholesterol total was high, the ratios were excellent and I had minimal triglycerides and no other risks.

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Old 05-15-2016, 03:37 PM   #9
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The ratios are probably more important than the numbers. My HDL is naturally low, but I combat that pretty successfully with niacin. My triglycerides are too high, but are much lower than they used to be. I'm hoping they continue to drop as (if) I lose weight.
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Old 05-15-2016, 04:49 PM   #10
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I expect the responses to your post will run span a broad range. Regarding total cholesterol (TC), the American Heart Association as well as other medical organizations use TC as one of the risk factors for heart disease. This is typically based on the Framingham study which showed higher TC was correlated with heart disease. Similarly, higher high-density lipoprotein (HDL) a.k.a. "good cholesterol" correlated with lower heart disease. While the numbers themselves are a bit of a moving target, lowering TC and raising HDL seem like reasonable goals.

I started on a no oil, vegan diet as well as a statin after my cardiologist recommended bypass surgery. My TC dropped about 100 points and is currently under 100, but I'm sure my path is one that not many would choose.
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Old 05-15-2016, 05:29 PM   #11
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based on the Framingham study which showed higher TC was correlated with heart disease.
I think you'll find that current analysis of the Framingham study indicates that blood cholesterol levels are irrelevant as long as the TC/HDL or LDL/HDL ratio is low. So HDL is the actual factor at work here.

How to raise HDL? Not too hard. Exercise, stopping smoking, a little alcohol, reducing sugar intake, losing excess weight, and including a decent quantity of saturated fat in the diet are all good ways.
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Old 05-15-2016, 05:46 PM   #12
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The ratios are probably more important than the numbers. My HDL is naturally low, but I combat that pretty successfully with niacin. My triglycerides are too high, but are much lower than they used to be. I'm hoping they continue to drop as (if) I lose weight.

I was on niacin and my cardiologist told me to stop immediately. Apparently it can contribute to having a stroke.


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Old 05-15-2016, 05:53 PM   #13
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I must be lucky.

Still on my low carb routine - a year now.

I had my annual physical last week and everything was in range. Cholesterol was normal, no diabetes issues, low PSA (under 1.0), etc. EKG was normal. Doc said my results were boring (kiddingly). I guess this is good news for a 72 year old.
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Old 05-15-2016, 06:29 PM   #14
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Had 188 cholesterol, 79 Ldl, 73 hdl and 62 triglycerides in my last checkup. I'm up for another checkup in 6 weeks. I've been running 20-25 miles a week, and eating lots of carbs recently. Dr. has convinced me to go on paleo diet-very little carbs. I've been on it for 3 days, so I'll see what affect the diet has. But so far I'm craving carbs big time.


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Old 05-15-2016, 07:02 PM   #15
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Diet. Exercise.

When you take care of these two things click bait books and articles such as this one are of no interest to you. There's no "secret" to total optimum health (no "myths", no "hints", no "tips", no "hidden truths", either). The "truth" (diet/exercise) has been out there in plain view for decades and decades and decades and decades. As a very small example:

https://consumer.healthday.com/vitam...alth-news-359/

Quote:
making a few lifestyle changes is one of the best steps you can take to keep blood cholesterol levels under control. Exercising more, eating a healthy diet and managing your weight are all important steps in managing cholesterol. Itís also important to quit smoking, as this can also play a role.
https://consumer.healthday.com/fitne...es-710455.html

Quote:
"Typically, two to three exercise sessions a week for 20 to 30 minutes are enough for most people to develop results," said Kraschnewski. "Our studies have demonstrated older adults can double their strength in just 12 weeks."
Emphasis added
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Old 05-15-2016, 08:35 PM   #16
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But so far I'm craving carbs big time.


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Shortly after I cut back on carbs, I would have killed for one of these:

download.jpg

(but you will get over it)
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Old 05-15-2016, 09:01 PM   #17
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My cardiologist just put me on 40 mg of a Lipitor generic, more concerned with keeping my LDL low and said HDL doesn't matter any more. I had a high cardiac calcium score in a recent test and he wants my LDL below 60.


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LDL below 60? Anything less than 100 is considered optimal. I'd be questioning that.

EDIT: Sorry, I've had naturally high cholesterol my whole life (even when in my early 20's and very fit) and even though I've been on a statin for 30 years, I've never been down that low on LDLs. It just seems extreme, but what do I know?
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Old 05-15-2016, 09:21 PM   #18
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Some doctors target very low LDL levels in patients with heart disease (who have had an event) or are diabetic.

Meanwhile for folks with no disease and low risk levels, LDL of up to 160 is still OK. "Optimal" really depends on your profile.
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Old 05-15-2016, 09:29 PM   #19
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Some doctors target very low LDL levels in patients with heart disease (who have had an event) or are diabetic.

Meanwhile for folks with no disease and low risk levels, LDL of up to 160 is still OK. "Optimal" really depends on your profile.
You're right. I just assumed the doctor was pushing for a low LDL based off of one test, but there could be more to it than that.
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Old 05-15-2016, 09:36 PM   #20
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Shortly after I cut back on carbs, I would have killed for one of these:



Attachment 23906



(but you will get over it)

I really didn't need to see that.


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