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Old 10-29-2011, 12:27 AM   #81
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Should I be feeling the workout in my shoulders? It's a good pain, not like I pulled something, but my coworkers said I shouldn't be feeling it in my shoulders.
I feel it in my shoulders, and just about everywhere else. Even the butt muscles get kind of tired.

Ha
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Old 10-29-2011, 11:56 AM   #82
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I thought about exercising. A while ago.

I just walk to work these days.
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Old 10-29-2011, 12:04 PM   #83
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I feel it in my shoulders, and just about everywhere else. Even the butt muscles get kind of tired.

Ha
While I haven't tried a C2 yet, most of the rowing motions I perform in the gym with free weights/machines are geared to targeting shoulders and back, and I would expect the same from the C2. I would assume when using the C2 it would be good to strive for a squeeze or pinch between the shoulder blades?

Strengthening the back and shoulders makes me feel great and getting sore is part of that. Just remember, there is a big difference between getting sore and feeling pain and if anyone is feeling pain, it is time to slow up, check your form or stop for awhile.
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Old 10-29-2011, 12:14 PM   #84
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This is good news for me. Where I am feeling it in my shoulders is where I feel it while backpacking. I've been trying to find a way to strenghten those muscles in the gym before going out on a long backpacking trip.

I am really glad you posted this thread, Ha! And thanks to the rest of you for the responses!
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Old 10-29-2011, 12:36 PM   #85
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While I haven't tried a C2 yet, most of the rowing motions I perform in the gym with free weights/machines are geared to targeting shoulders and back, and I would expect the same from the C2.
No, it's different than rows with weights because a huge part of rowing is driving with the legs. Rowing with the C2 is a whole body exercise.
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The basic rowing action is a coordinated muscle action that requires application of force in a repetitive, maximal and smooth manner. Every large muscle group will contribute to this action.
Good explanation with illustrations here: Concept2: Muscles Used While Rowing Similar page with different illustrations here: Concept2 - Muscles Used

While I've been doing the Fall Challenge I've also been working on my technique. The how-to video was a help, but I found the "common errors" video to be even more helpful. After watching it two nights ago, I played with some of the drills from the video in the gym yesterday. I could really tell that my body was working in a much smoother motion, the muscular effort/strain seemed greatly reduced, and I rowed at a faster rate.
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Old 10-29-2011, 12:59 PM   #86
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No, it's different than rows with weights because a huge part of rowing is driving with the legs.I could really tell that my body was working in a much smoother motion, the muscular effort/strain seemed greatly reduced, and I rowed at a faster rate.
Excellent video. I don't remember seeing this one before. The size of this woman's thighs gives a pretty good indication of how much of the work is done by the legs.

Ha
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Old 10-29-2011, 01:00 PM   #87
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No, it's different than rows with weights because a huge part of rowing is driving with the legs. Rowing with the C2 is a whole body exercise.
Right, I realize its a full body exercise/motion, however, I was trying to respond to the concern Helen raised about soreness in the shoulders as from my understanding a rowing motion absolutely should include shoulders and back.
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Old 10-29-2011, 01:31 PM   #88
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Right, I realize its a full body exercise/motion, however, I was trying to respond to the concern Helen raised about soreness in the shoulders as from my understanding a rowing motion absolutely should include shoulders and back.
I understand that, but my point is that rowing is not "geared to targeting shoulders and back", but is a whole body exercise. DOMS, as opposed to pain from muscular injury, should be an all-over feeling like Ha described. If Helen is feeling it solely, or particularly, in one place I would first think that she had a technique issue.

Shoulder muscles are included, but so are many other muscles.

Two examples from my own experience:

I overworked my anterior and middle deltoids in my left shoulder about a month and half ago from being overly ambitious in the weight room. No rowing for several weeks while I let it recover, but when I started back rowing I almost immediately developed soreness in the right posterior deltoids. It took me a couple of days to figure out that I was favoring the left shoulder out of fear, and changing my rowing technique to put extra stress on the right shoulder.

My thighs were extremely sore. Part of it was that I had discovered I really loved squats and was aggressively moving toward three 15-rep sets of 300 pounds. There was a lot of DOMS from that, but after I reached my goal in squats and chilled out on them for a while the sore thighs were still an issue. I finally figure out that it was coming from poor form while rowing (I was moving too far forward at the end of the recovery and just before the catch).

If Helen had been doing a resistance move like bent-over-rows then I would agree she should be feeling it in her shoulders. But from the full body exercise of rowing on a C2 she should be feeling it all over, not predominantly one muscle group.

Question to the diabetics and pre-diabetics: Rowing would seem to be a great exercise for lowering blood glucose through muscular contractions. But I know that larger muscles also increase insulin sensitivity because they can accept more glucose. Does rowing create the right kind of muscular hypertrophy for that, or do you need resistance training to accomplish that? Or is size all that matters?

Edit to add: Couldn't remember the two types of hypertrophy: Myofibrillar vs Sarcoplasmic. To be honest, I can't decide which kind rowing would produce, but my inclination is to think that it would be sarcoplasmic.

And changed "decrease insulin sensitivity" to increase.....duh.
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Old 10-29-2011, 02:55 PM   #89
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Question to the diabetics and pre-diabetics: Rowing would seem to be a great exercise for lowering blood glucose through muscular contractions. But I know that larger muscles also increase insulin sensitivity because they can accept more glucose. Does rowing create the right kind of muscular hypertrophy for that, or do you need resistance training to accomplish that? Or is size all that matters?
Although I'm pre-diabetic, I'm not really sure of the answer to your question. What I do know is this: my blood sugar and other lab work has all been much, much better since I started weight lifting regularly. Subjectively, I think the C2 ought to be helpful for lowering blood glucose for someone like me who has been sedentary all her life. However, for someone like you who is so physically active already, I don't know. Sorry I can't be of more help. Maybe Ha or other C2 enthusiasts know more about this.
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Old 10-29-2011, 03:37 PM   #90
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I understand that, but my point is that rowing is not "geared to targeting shoulders and back", but is a whole body exercise. DOMS, as opposed to pain from muscular injury, should be an all-over feeling like Ha described. If Helen is feeling it solely, or particularly, in one place I would first think that she had a technique issue.
Got ya, I used a poor choice of words in saying targeting. However, even when doing a full body workout in the gym it is quite possible to have one muscle group sorer than others even if one is using good form. I would especially expect that to be the case if one is fairly new to a particular piece of equipment and may have some muscles that are weaker (imbalances) than others. That said, I can see your point if you've been doing the C2 for quite some time that you wouldn't expect one area to be sore vs another.
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Old 10-29-2011, 04:19 PM   #91
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IMy thighs were extremely sore. Part of it was that I had discovered I really loved squats and was aggressively moving toward three 15-rep sets of 300 pounds.
This is some serious weight!

About youir question re: blood sugar, the studies seem to be all over the map. However, rowing added to weights should help, as their mechanisms are said to be somewhat different.

William Krause at Duke has done many studies on exercise and different metabolic parameters. All the abstracts are on the web free, and many of the full papers.

Ha
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Old 10-29-2011, 07:47 PM   #92
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Just back from the gym. Got on the rower and realized that if I wanted to keep to my schedule of having Sunday off, and going car shopping on Monday in order to try and catch the dealer at the end of the month, that I probably needed to finish the Fall Challenge tonight. Fifty-six minutes and 8917 meters later I crawled off that thing having rowed 31,778 meters in 5 days.

Like my homeboy Forrest said:

That's the longest time I spent on an erg to date. One's mind tends to wander off, and I did come up with a new meaning for erg: Evil Rowing Gadget.
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Old 10-29-2011, 07:55 PM   #93
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Aw gee!! I'm surprised you're not 3/4 dead after a week like that.

Enjoy the time off...
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Old 10-30-2011, 05:04 AM   #94
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I recently got a Concept 2, which barely fits in my small apt. After using it for 5 weeks, plus some walking, I have lost 10 lbs. I am coming from completely sedentary and my rowing stats are modest to say the least, but gradually improving. Right now I am going for slow and longish, rather than any kind of speed or strenuousness (which I am incapable of anyway). I actually break up my workout into several sessions a day.

There is no way I can avoid seeing the rower sitting there silently reproaching me, so I pretty much have to use it.
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Old 10-30-2011, 11:46 AM   #95
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I recently got a Concept 2, which barely fits in my small apt. After using it for 5 weeks, plus some walking, I have lost 10 lbs. I am coming from completely sedentary and my rowing stats are modest to say the least, but gradually improving. Right now I am going for slow and longish, rather than any kind of speed or strenuousness (which I am incapable of anyway). I actually break up my workout into several sessions a day.

There is no way I can avoid seeing the rower sitting there silently reproaching me, so I pretty much have to use it.
Good going Tuckeverlasting. Sounds like yours is positioned like mine. I must step over it to leave my desk!

Ha
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Old 10-30-2011, 01:16 PM   #96
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Sounds like yours is positioned like mine. I must step over it to leave my desk!
That is pretty funny Ha, I have to step over mine every time I enter or leave the bedroom where my desk is too!

But I was desperate for some exercise I could do with my messed-up knees, and the rowing has got me where I can actually go for walks now, and pretty quickly too. So I count it a great success and well worth sacrificing a little space. I have it set up so I can watch TV while rowing.
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Old 11-02-2011, 06:34 PM   #97
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My Concept2 should be delivered next Monday! It was this and other threads here that led me to think about actually buying one. DH was - surprisingly - enthusiastic about it when I broached the subject. He had used the one at the gym and he liked it.

We ended up buying the Model E for the higher seat. The only problem is where we will put it in the new house we are building. I had designed my office to have room for a recumbent exercise bike (in an 8' long space in the room). It won't have room for the Concept2 unless I angle it -- or make the room a foot wider. Or, I guess I could put the Concept2 in the family room or maybe even the bedroom. Have to decide pretty soon as we are getting ready to finalize plans.

Right now we are in a rental and I've cleared a space for it in the family room and look forward to it arriving.
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Old 11-02-2011, 06:42 PM   #98
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My Concept2 should be delivered next Monday! It was this and other threads here that led me to think about actually buying one. DH was - surprisingly - enthusiastic about it when I broached the subject. He had used the one at the gym and he liked it.

We ended up buying the Model E for the higher seat. The only problem is where we will put it in the new house we are building. I had designed my office to have room for a recumbent exercise bike (in an 8' long space in the room). It won't have room for the Concept2 unless I angle it -- or make the room a foot wider. Or, I guess I could put the Concept2 in the family room or maybe even the bedroom. Have to decide pretty soon as we are getting ready to finalize plans.

Right now we are in a rental and I've cleared a space for it in the family room and look forward to it arriving.
Congratulations! I think you will be happy with it and find it easy to get a groove going with it in your routine.
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Old 11-02-2011, 07:04 PM   #99
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My Concept2 should be delivered next Monday! It was this and other threads here that led me to think about actually buying one. DH was - surprisingly - enthusiastic about it when I broached the subject. He had used the one at the gym and he liked it.

We ended up buying the Model E for the higher seat. The only problem is where we will put it in the new house we are building. I had designed my office to have room for a recumbent exercise bike (in an 8' long space in the room). It won't have room for the Concept2 unless I angle it -- or make the room a foot wider. Or, I guess I could put the Concept2 in the family room or maybe even the bedroom. Have to decide pretty soon as we are getting ready to finalize plans.

Right now we are in a rental and I've cleared a space for it in the family room and look forward to it arriving.
How exciting! I hope you and your DH have a lot of fun with your new Concept2.

I enjoyed rowing on it again today at the gym. I am still doing 5 minutes on it during each session, and I am not yet ready to increase the time. I think it is doing me a world of good, though, and I have an entire lifetime to work up to longer workouts on it.

I just listened to Leonidas' video again, the one showing common mistakes in form. Another help in getting my form right is the diagram available right on the C2's at my gym. I don't know if they all come with this, so I photographed it in case anyone might find it to be helpful.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg diagrams.jpg (33.0 KB, 5 views)
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Old 11-02-2011, 07:31 PM   #100
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Used Concept2 machines allegedly get sold on Craigslist, but I never saw one until Sunday night. Model D, less than a year old, private owner asking $650. I was the first runner up and somebody else got the machine. My cheap side is hoping that I will see another, but I was ready to buy a new one Sunday and just decided to check Craigslist on a whim before going to the C2 site.

Rowing for 35 minutes or so every day at the gym has an upside - I've become some sort of pied piper of rowing. The darn machines seldom get used, and the gym was talking about getting rid of them. Now, every time I sit down somebody comes along and sits on the next machine.

It's funny to watch them get a lesson in how hard this rowing thing can be. Most of them last a few minutes before crawling off. There was one guy who acted like he was racing against me. He sat down, arrogantly slammed the damper setting to the max, and started rowing like the hammers of hell. It hurt to look at his form it was so awkward.

I had been rowing for a few minutes as a warm up for a speed workout, and as he started rowing I started picking up my pace.

He started to pick up his pace.

I decided to have fun.

Every time I sped up or slowed down, he matched me. Or tried to.

Ten minutes of rowing at about 32-33 strokes-per-minute pace was enough for him. He crawled off and walked away on unsteady legs. I was anticipating someone shouting "call 911" from the direction he wandered off toward.

I haven't seen him since, but a few people have sat down next to me and then become regular rowers. One young woman who was always on an elliptical machine reading a book sat down next to me one day and she has since become a regular.

If I accomplished anything, I may have at least saved the rowing machines at my gym from being replaced by some crappy elliptical contraptions.
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