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Old 04-18-2012, 09:50 AM   #21
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Pork rinds are vegetables? I never knew that!

I never liked pork rinds until I started dipping them in ketchup. Now that is a gourmet treat!! The federal government said ketchup can be counted as a vegetable for school lunches, so now you have a real vegetarian snack.

I wonder if they'll approve chocolate syrup as a fruit juice?
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Old 04-18-2012, 09:51 AM   #22
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Ummm. I'd like to see the actual science there. I do know that there are lots of little old ladies. Big old ladies? Not so much.
I couldn't find the study referred to by flyfishnevada, but here's an article that talks about it. Who Lives Longer - Overweight People or Thin People

Regarding the big old ladies vs. little old ladies, my experience isn't the same. I've seen plenty of both. It's the old men who are in short supply.

And also anecdotally, I know a significant number of unhealthy thinner people. They always seem to be sick or tired, and have flabby muscles. I often wonder if they are just malnourished. Health doesn't appear to be that well tied in with weight, in my experience. Health is different, and has to do more with decent nutrition and exercise. Body weight doesn't seem to be the deciding factor to me.
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Old 04-18-2012, 12:14 PM   #23
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I couldn't find the study referred to by flyfishnevada, but here's an article that talks about it. Who Lives Longer - Overweight People or Thin People
Thanks Harley, interesting article. That study, in Japan, showed that overweight people at age 40 lived a little longer than their normal weight counterparts (~1.6 years longer for men) but obese people lived about 0.5 years less. (BMI>30 is considered obese in the study).

Much bigger differences when compared to very thin people (over 6 years), but the very thin definition is a BMI <18.5. (at 6'1.5" I would have to weigh 142lbs for a BMI of 18.5 and that would be ultra thin, imo).

What I do read into this study is that it is much better to be outside the the "normal" BMI range on the high side (>30) than it is to be below the low limit (<18.5)
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Old 04-18-2012, 12:38 PM   #24
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True, but "unhealthy" and "overweight" are substantially correlated, even if not at 1.0.
The OP article conclusion stands to reason, though using BMI may distort the extent "healthy habits" can offset the influence of obesity. The offset may be less, body composition would have been more credible than BMI.

Unfortunately unhealthy and obese indeed appear to be highly correlated as you can see by looking at mortality and heart disease vs mortality without the health habits slice. And if obesity reduces mobility with age (joint problems are more common with obesity), healthy habits and therefore lifespan may be threatened despite all intentions.
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Old 04-18-2012, 12:41 PM   #25
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Interesting articles. I guess this fits me. I have insurance through Kaiser Permanente and they have a full physical thing you can do every 5 years or so. They measure all sorts of normal stuff (cholesterol, bp, etc), as well as stuff like your lung capacity. And they look at BMI etc. They compile all the data then generate a report that tells you what your health age is.

I consistently get a health age of about 5 years less than my actual age. Drives my husband nuts (he's only 2 years younger with his health age.) The report also says I'm fat. I don't dispute that. I refuse to get on the yo-yo diet thing again. I just try to eat healthy food, and not stress about the weight.

I'm fat. No getting around it. BMI puts me at obese. But I eat healthy (lots of real food - not a lot of processed food. Tons of veggies and fruits, whole grains, etc.) I am a moderate drinker. Don't smoke. Have low cholesteral and BP. I should exercise more, but it's currently limited to walking the dog several times a week. So I've got all but the exercise covered in their "healthy habits" list.

My brother was a health nut. At age 48 he rode in the "Ride the Rockies" multi day bike ride, then in the "Tour D' Wyoming" multi day bike ride. He worked out, was an avid rock climber, had no body fat to speak of. He died less than 6 months after his Wyoming ride. These studies don't look at other diseases outside of cardiac/stroke. In our family - it's cancer. His second (unrelated) malignancy was incurable. (He'd kicked Melanoma in college).

I'm not saying don't practice healthy habits. But they are not a guarantee. My brother was one of the healthiest people I knew - until he wasn't.
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Old 04-18-2012, 03:32 PM   #26
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In addition to longevity, there's a quality of life and a vanity issue here as well. If you are 20 pounds overweight, you are carrying two bowling balls with you wherever you go. That doesn't sound fun to me.

People who are 100 pounds overweight are carrying 10 bowling balls -- I'm tired at the end of the day -- how do they feel?

I guess the vanity issue isn't important to most, because they've gotten used to the new normal. I assume this is true when I see overweight women wearing tight, clinging outfits that allow their muffin tops to escape.



Personally, I don't care about living longer, but I want to feel good (and look OK) while I'm still alive.
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Old 04-18-2012, 03:38 PM   #27
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Personally, I don't care about living longer, but I want to feel good (and look OK) while I'm still alive.
+1

What I like about the younger next year book is that the authors are not recommending weight loss, diets or that their exercise regimes will mean living longer. The book is all about quality of life in the last decade or so before we pop our clogs.
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Old 04-18-2012, 04:07 PM   #28
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Personally, I don't care about living longer, but I want to feel good (and look OK) while I'm still alive.
+2.
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Old 04-18-2012, 05:02 PM   #29
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In addition to longevity, there's a quality of life and a vanity issue here as well. If you are 20 pounds overweight, you are carrying two bowling balls with you wherever you go. That doesn't sound fun to me.

People who are 100 pounds overweight are carrying 10 bowling balls -- I'm tired at the end of the day -- how do they feel?

I guess the vanity issue isn't important to most, because they've gotten used to the new normal. I assume this is true when I see overweight women wearing tight, clinging outfits that allow their muffin tops to escape.



Personally, I don't care about living longer, but I want to feel good (and look OK) while I'm still alive.
Come on Al, she looks pretty good by me.
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Old 04-18-2012, 05:18 PM   #30
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Personally, I don't care about living longer, but I want to feel good (and look OK) while I'm still alive.
I want to live longer, too. OK, so I'm greedy - - feeling and looking good are great, but there's more to want.
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Old 04-18-2012, 05:57 PM   #31
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I tend to put the most credence in insurance companies' "healthy weight" tables. I figure insurance companies have had 200 years of cold, hard-eyed assessment of what correlates with living longer (and thus, with their profits). Naturally, individual results and statistics don't always match up.

It's funny that the tables are for women fully dressed and wearing 1-inch heels. No self-respecting woman ever leaves her shoes on while getting weighed!

Met life ideal height weight tables references

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Old 04-18-2012, 06:09 PM   #32
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It's funny that the tables are for women fully dressed and wearing 1-inch heels. No self-respecting woman ever leaves her shoes on while getting weighed!

Met life ideal height weight tables references

Amethyst
Absolutely ! As they near the scale I am already kicking off my shoes . According to Met Life I am at my ideal weight but I would still like to lose five pounds . It is a vanity thing !
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Old 04-18-2012, 06:10 PM   #33
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I was looking on the chart for the Super Duper Large Frame but can't seem to find it.
At 6'4" and 278 I guess I'm in big trouble but that's without heels and the chart doesn't go up that high.
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Old 04-19-2012, 06:31 AM   #34
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First of all: how to eat pork rinds - Get a personal size bag; open bag; shake bag while adding Tabasco sauce to taste; enjoy.

Now here is the thing about fat, skinny, and living longer (IMO). Living longer is only rewarding when you enjoy it. If an occasional dish of black walnut ice cream makes you feel good, enjoy.
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Old 04-19-2012, 07:16 AM   #35
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At 6'4" and 278 I guess I'm in big trouble but that's without heels and the chart doesn't go up that high.
You have incentive to lose 100 lbs, cause your 0-60 and 1/4m times will improve. As you well know, a racer needs to look for every possible edge.
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Old 04-19-2012, 08:06 AM   #36
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FWIW -- longevity is not the same as healthy. The final years of an obese person's life will not be the same as that of an active, healthy person. (At the same time, it is true that a small percentage of the obese can be metabolically healthy.)
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Old 04-19-2012, 08:38 AM   #37
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I want to live longer, too. OK, so I'm greedy - - feeling and looking good are great, but there's more to want.

And who is that lovely young woman in the Avi? The smile almost seems to be that of someone who has just retired
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Old 04-19-2012, 08:45 AM   #38
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Oatmeal Stout in the AM.Breakfast in a bottle.Good for mind,body and soul.
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Old 04-19-2012, 09:03 AM   #39
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And who is that lovely young woman in the Avi? The smile almost seems to be that of someone who has just retired
Thanks for the compliment - -it is me in 1974, back in Hawaii. That is the happiness of youth with my whole life ahead of me, not the happiness of the newly retired. Had I known how much fun retirement is, and how long it would be until I could retire, maybe I would have looked a little glum.
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Old 04-19-2012, 10:55 AM   #40
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BMI is a pretty crude measurement as are any height weight tables which don't account for body fat or bone density. FWIW...Body Fat Measurement: Percentage Vs. Body Mass or Top 10 Reasons Why The BMI Is Bogus : NPR (I tried to choose more neutral websites, vs sports medicine et al).
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"If we think of BMI being a rough measure of body fatness, there are people -- especially some highly trained athletes -- who are overweight but not overfat," says Heymsfield. "Likewise, there are people who are of a normal weight according to BMI scales but who are overfat. BMI is a broad, general measure of risk. Body-fat assessment is much more specific to your actual fat content and thus provides a more accurate picture."
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