Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10-17-2007, 08:55 PM   #21
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,615
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich_in_Tampa View Post
Usage wise, most people use the term antibiotic to mean anti-bacterial.
Thanks for the correction. Yep, I thought "antibiotic" referred only to medicines good for killing bacteria. As you noted, the mistake is apparently a common one, I found the same error in several other spots on the web.

I learn something here every day.
__________________

__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 10-18-2007, 07:39 AM   #22
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich_in_Tampa View Post
We are barely one step ahead of the bacterium with antibiotics, but some I've seen in the last few months are getting very tough to treat.
Rich, how lethal is this thing in an otherwise healthy person? If no antibiotics will work, would the person's immune system eventually figure it out and kill the bug?
__________________

__________________
FinallyRetired is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 08:56 AM   #23
Moderator Emeritus
Rich_by_the_Bay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 8,827
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoonToRetire View Post
Rich, how lethal is this thing in an otherwise healthy person? If no antibiotics will work, would the person's immune system eventually figure it out and kill the bug?
For perspective, serious MRSA infection is very uncommon in otherwise healthy people. The "locker room" outbreaks of MRSA and other bacteria are isolated incidents, and probably relate to an unusually invasive strain.

People who are debilitated, have been in nursing homes or hospitals, or have immune problems get infected from droplets or contact with others. If you have an IV or surgery, that would be one portal of entry but it can happen even without such. These are the populations most at risk.

Staph is everywhere in all people - it lives quietly on the skin and in the nasal passages. It can cause acne, skin boils and other routine infections. Usually the body fights it off.

Not sure if that answers your question, but at this point the problem is largely one of health care institutions. Community outbreaks are still uncommon.
__________________
Rich
San Francisco Area
ESR'd March 2010. FIRE'd January 2011.

As if you didn't know..If the above message contains medical content, it's NOT intended as advice, and may not be accurate, applicable or sufficient. Don't rely on it for any purpose. Consult your own doctor for all medical advice.
Rich_by_the_Bay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 09:13 AM   #24
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich_in_Tampa View Post
Not sure if that answers your question, but at this point the problem is largely one of health care institutions. Community outbreaks are still uncommon.
Thanks, Rich, that's what I wanted to know. The way it's reported on the news, it makes it appear as if it's everywhere and we're all going to die from it. They should have someone like you to provide perspective, but that wouldn't get the viewers.
__________________
FinallyRetired is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 09:39 AM   #25
Dryer sheet aficionado
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by laurencewill View Post
This type of thing is becoming more and more "relevant" to us as Tori's heart surgery grows near.
When you are in the hospital make sure the health care workers wash their hands before contacting you. Studies show the doctors are usually the worst offenders about hand washing. Also get out of the hospital as soon as possible. The longer you hang around, the greater your risk of hopital aquired infection. Good luck with the surgery! Odds are great there will be NO infection problems.
__________________
Beer man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 09:50 AM   #26
Full time employment: Posting here.
Kronk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Philly 'burbs
Posts: 547
One of the martial arts I do is Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, which is basically wrestling until someone submits (gets choked out or gets into a joint lock they can't get out of). Sometimes we have classes with gi (uniform); other times we do no-gi, where we wear shorts and T-shirts. Obviously there is a whole lot of body contact.

A few months ago I was sparring in a no-gi class for around 10 minutes with one guy. The next week he stops in with part of his leg wrapped and says that he has MRSA. I had a few weeks where I was worried about getting it, but fortunately I didn't.

Including that guy, I've known three people who have gotten MRSA, none of them in the hospital. Hopefully it is a coincidence that all three I met through martial arts, though none of them seemed to have contracted it because of martial arts.
__________________
Kronk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 10:21 AM   #27
Moderator Emeritus
Rich_by_the_Bay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 8,827
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kronk View Post
Including that guy, I've known three people who have gotten MRSA, none of them in the hospital. Hopefully it is a coincidence that all three I met through martial arts, though none of them seemed to have contracted it because of martial arts.
Strictly speaking, MRSA is not a disease or a diagnosis, it's a bacterium so you don't "get MRSA." You get a specific infection such as cellulitis (skin infection), blood infection (sepsis), or other type of infection where MRSA is the culprit. The exact same diagnoses can be caused by other germs just as well, including strep and many others. Furthermore, many people are carriers of MRSA but have no "infections" - they might be picked up in some type of screening or surveillance culture for unrelated issues.

I'd say full contact martial arts is a good way to expose yourself to staph from others who carry it, MRSA or otherwise. That doesn't mean you will develop a MRSA-generated infection or even become a carrier, though both are possible.

I am unaware of any way one can be confident about where the staph was contracted, other than in highly unusual circumstances.
__________________
Rich
San Francisco Area
ESR'd March 2010. FIRE'd January 2011.

As if you didn't know..If the above message contains medical content, it's NOT intended as advice, and may not be accurate, applicable or sufficient. Don't rely on it for any purpose. Consult your own doctor for all medical advice.
Rich_by_the_Bay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 11:00 AM   #28
Moderator Emeritus
laurence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: San Diego
Posts: 5,234
Thanks to all for the info/corrections. Rich, as always it's great to have a Doctor in the house!

So Staph itself is a serious concern for the health care community, but we won't be acting out King's "The Stand" because of it. Influenza is viral (duh - I know I knew that, brain fart, thanks SamClem), is there an easily communicable bacterial infection that could take advantage of becoming anti-biotic resistant?
__________________
laurence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 11:51 AM   #29
Moderator Emeritus
Rich_by_the_Bay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 8,827
Quote:
Originally Posted by laurencewill View Post
So Staph itself is a serious concern for the health care community, but we won't be acting out King's "The Stand" because of it. ...is there an easily communicable bacterial infection that could take advantage of becoming anti-biotic resistant?
All bacteria have the potential to become resistant. It's like Darwinian evolution in fast motion: hit em with antibiotics and it kills 99.9% of them. But their population is in the several millions so a few might survive who happen to be resistant just by random mutation. They repopulate and voila.

For that reason, for serious infection we grow the bugs then test them in the lab against common antibiotics to see what they are resistant to. We do a pretty good job with this. And there are drugs for MRSA that are very effective -- just don't want to overuse them when they aren't needed (though pharma ads sometimes encourge usage in their choice of formatting and font size, pictures of vicious tigers and damsels in distress).

I treat MRSA weekly if not daily. Bad as it is, it's not a flesh-eating, nontreatable death sentence in the vast majority of people.
__________________
Rich
San Francisco Area
ESR'd March 2010. FIRE'd January 2011.

As if you didn't know..If the above message contains medical content, it's NOT intended as advice, and may not be accurate, applicable or sufficient. Don't rely on it for any purpose. Consult your own doctor for all medical advice.
Rich_by_the_Bay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 12:53 PM   #30
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,615
Quote:
Originally Posted by laurencewill View Post
. . . is there an easily communicable bacterial infection that could take advantage of becoming anti-biotic resistant?
Okay, subject to revision by folks far more knowledegable than I . . .

Resistant strains of TB are a big problem, as there are several strains known to be out there. You may remember the recent incident in which a American suspected to have a resistant TB strain took an international flight and exposed a lot of folks. As it turned out, his strain of TB did respond to antibiotics. TB isn't incredibly infectious, but it's easy to catch it if you are near a carrier for a long time. Physical contact is not required.

Cholera and Typhoid are both nasty bacteriological diseases, ad there are strains of each that have developed resistance to the traditional antibiotics of choice. These are generally spread through food, and good hygiene among food workers (and use of proper public sanitation) can prevent an epidemic. Typhoid isn't usually fatal, cholera requires good supportive care and can be fatal without it.

Lots of other bacteriological diseases (plague, tularemia, etc) require an insect vector, so that provides a means to combat their spread.

Syphilis and gonorrhea are both bacterial. Resistant Gonorrhea starins are a real problem in some areas (esp Hawaii and California). There are signs of syphillis that is resistant to pennicillin, but that treatment still works very well.

Sorry, all out of sunny news for now.

samclem
__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 01:04 PM   #31
Moderator Emeritus
Rich_by_the_Bay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 8,827
What Sam said.

Sam, need a job?
__________________
Rich
San Francisco Area
ESR'd March 2010. FIRE'd January 2011.

As if you didn't know..If the above message contains medical content, it's NOT intended as advice, and may not be accurate, applicable or sufficient. Don't rely on it for any purpose. Consult your own doctor for all medical advice.
Rich_by_the_Bay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 01:12 PM   #32
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by samclem View Post
Resistant strains of TB are a big problem, as there are several strains known to be out there.
There's a mycobacterium that causes TB in fish and that humans can also get. In fact the disease is known as fish TB, or fish handler's disease, and it's getting more widespread. In humans doesn't cause TB but causes a nasty skin infection that's resistant to common antibiotics. The scientific name is mycobacterium marinum, and it's present in many waters in the US and around the world. In the Chesapeake it's present in many rock fish, so fishermen can get it if they're not wearing glove and get scraped by the fish scales. You can also get it from scrapes while cleaning fish tanks, or from coral. Reason I know about it, I caught it while cleaning the bottom of my sailboat in the caribbean and scraping my hand on coral growth.

It starts with a minor cut or scrape that doesn't heal, just stays the same for a week or so then gradually gets redder and larger, but still not a big deal. But the bug gets in the lymphatic system and starts working its way up your arm, leg, or wherever you got the scrape, and you begin to see some boils that are just under the surface. I got about 3 or 4 up my arm before I saw the doc. At first my GP gave me the standard antibiotics but it didn't touch it. I then got referred to an infectious disease doc who biopsied and grew it, told me what it was, and gave me three antibiotics that I had to take for six months. The pills messed with my stomach and made me feel very tired, so after a while he removed one and kept up the other two. After a couple of months the sores were gone, so he allowed me to get off the pills completely, and it hasn't returned.

It's a nasty infection, though it won't kill you. If left untreated, it continues to make colonies just underneath the skin that become painful and eventually break out and bleed. It also goes in joints and can give you lifelong arthritis. Fortunately, it doesn't grow well at internal body temperatures, which is why it doesn't give TB in the lungs. When I read about that, I began to use hot compresses on my infected areas, as hot as I could stand it, and I think that also helped.

Rich may correct me if I got any of this wrong, but it's one of those things that are nice to know about and avoid if one is around coral, cleaning fishtanks, etc.
__________________
FinallyRetired is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 01:36 PM   #33
Moderator Emeritus
Rich_by_the_Bay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 8,827
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoonToRetire View Post
Rich may correct me if I got any of this wrong, but it's one of those things that are nice to know about and avoid if one is around coral, cleaning fishtanks, etc.
Right!

Then there's mycobacterium intracellulare (bird TB) that people can get, and Valley Fever (Az, San Joaquin Valley of Calif, etc.), histoplasmosis in the midwest (usually but not always asymptomatic), the ever-present Lyme Disease in the upper midwest, Long Island and many other places; toxoplasmosis from your cat; you can still get plague - yes, plague as in bubonic plague - in certain areas near the 4-corners region, and the ever-popular giardiasis almost anywhere.

Personally, I rarely leave my house and when I do, it is with a mask and gloves, Purell dripping from my body. It's hard making friends.
__________________
Rich
San Francisco Area
ESR'd March 2010. FIRE'd January 2011.

As if you didn't know..If the above message contains medical content, it's NOT intended as advice, and may not be accurate, applicable or sufficient. Don't rely on it for any purpose. Consult your own doctor for all medical advice.
Rich_by_the_Bay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 02:09 PM   #34
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
twaddle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,378
Interesting bacteria factoid (according to Wikipedia, anyway): humans have more bacteria than we do human cells. About 10 times as many. We're basically big walking bacteria.
__________________
twaddle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 02:09 PM   #35
Confused about dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1
Don't be alarm on what you see in the news. Most of the time or lately the alarmist from the local government are issuing press release because they want money, piece of the pie or grant from the federal government.

Yes there is drug restistant diseases out there but we don't have an outbreak or it is not an epidemic. Check your local government for the morbidity report on any infectious diseases and you will discover that all of the cases are down. Much of the local government public health are over staff and have nothing to do. They go out and investigate tb diseases for a whole month, finds one person that crosses the border with tb and issue a press release.

As I said there are drug resistant strains out there but it is 1 or 2 percent of the population. They are currently under treatment. We have good drugs out there that treats this patient.

Sadly it is all about money and funding or the piece of the pie.
__________________
boglehead2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 03:35 PM   #36
Moderator Emeritus
laurence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: San Diego
Posts: 5,234
Fascinating! In a morbid kind of way...thanks Sam/Rich/SoonToRetire.

Twaddle, I guess that makes us hosts, perhaps the bacteria has allowed/assisted us to evolve into intelligent beings to maximize our population size and increase the number of all night buffet hotels on the planet.
__________________
laurence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 04:05 PM   #37
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
twaddle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,378
Quote:
Originally Posted by laurencewill View Post
Twaddle, I guess that makes us hosts, perhaps the bacteria has allowed/assisted us to evolve into intelligent beings to maximize our population size and increase the number of all night buffet hotels on the planet.
That reminds me -- we haven't had a good thread on evolution in a while.

We are basically powered by mitochondria. They produce ATP -- the stuff we burn at the cellular level.

Mitochondria look like little bacteria, and it's thought that they evolved from symbiotic bacteria. So, we truly are hosts for the little buggers in many ways, and we wouldn't even exist as a species without them.
__________________
twaddle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 04:16 PM   #38
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
lazygood4nothinbum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich_in_Tampa View Post
Personally, I rarely leave my house and when I do, it is with a mask and gloves, Purell dripping from my body. It's hard making friends.
and just when i thought you were taking all the fun out of panic. you just gave me my holloween costume for this year. thanx doc.
__________________
"off with their heads"~~dr. joseph-ignace guillotin

"life should begin with age and its privileges and accumulations, and end with youth and its capacity to splendidly enjoy such advantages."~~mark twain - letter to edward kimmitt 1901
lazygood4nothinbum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 05:10 PM   #39
Moderator Emeritus
Rich_by_the_Bay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 8,827
Quote:
Originally Posted by lazygood4nothinbum View Post
and just when i thought you were taking all the fun out of panic. you just gave me my holloween costume for this year. thanx doc.
So, you're going to be a jar of Purell for Halloween?
__________________
Rich
San Francisco Area
ESR'd March 2010. FIRE'd January 2011.

As if you didn't know..If the above message contains medical content, it's NOT intended as advice, and may not be accurate, applicable or sufficient. Don't rely on it for any purpose. Consult your own doctor for all medical advice.
Rich_by_the_Bay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2007, 08:51 PM   #40
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Brat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 5,913
Most of you don't remember the days when antibiotics weren't generally available. People routinely died of phenomia, TB, and infected wounds. I am alive today because I was admitted to an Army hospital as a toddler in the very early 40s and treated with a then experimental antibiotic.
__________________

__________________
Duck bjorn.
Brat is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Medicare RX Prescription Drug Plans (Part D) modhatter Health and Early Retirement 1 03-22-2007 03:15 PM
Prescription drug plans with medicare modhatter Life after FIRE 2 03-09-2007 07:43 PM
Statin Drugs.............Why Drug Companies Need ALL of US On them.......... FinanceDude Health and Early Retirement 15 12-07-2006 08:20 PM
Senior Citizen Drug Dealers cube_rat Other topics 14 12-14-2005 07:04 AM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:18 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.