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Old 05-25-2011, 02:43 PM   #41
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Way to go Zero. Nice loss! You and Banister have motivated me to get started. Grocery shopping tomorrow, and diet starts Friday!
I'm in too....started today....I just need to get the right oats

Starting at 202 lbs.... looking to be south of 175 lbs but I will re-evaluate that goal as I get closer to it....

I read another blogger today who had set his goal at the 175 mark but was still uncomfortable there and he decided to drop another 10 lbs before he started the stabilization phase...

Good luck Bizlady!
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Old 05-25-2011, 03:13 PM   #42
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Because of this thread, I downloaded his book and read it last week. Although I don't need to lose weight (I did his Consolidation phase for a few days (with some Fiber One added) and lost the 3 lbs I needed in a flash - which wasn't happening with the high fat /sporadic low carb diet I tend to incline to ), it is interesting to see the difference/similarities with Atkins diet, main difference being the consumption of fat. Dukan explains that it takes more calories for the body to assimilate protein than fat or refined carbs (refined carbs taking the least effort for the body to assimilate), and that's why he recommends use of protein (while restricting refined carbs and fat) to lose weight.

I don't agree with everything he writes (avoid fat for other reasons), and I will keep on eating as many eggs as I want, using butter and eat ing occasional bacon, etc, but if you are having difficulty losing weight with high fat/low carb diet, you may want to try his diet (lower fat) to see if this gets you off the plateau.

This is nothing scientific, and not totally about weight loss, but I remember Hilary Swank's interview on how she prepared for Million Dollar Baby to build muscle. In addition to the physical training, she ate tons of egg whites, drank protein shakes every couple of hours.

I just found some more about Hilary Swank's training.
How To Build a Female Boxer Body Like Hilary Swank? by MunFitnessBlog.com
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Old 05-25-2011, 08:33 PM   #43
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Bizlady and VACollecter, I'll be pulling for you guys.

Actually, I'll post tomorrow a sample day or two of what I did and how stringent I held to it. Just as a suggestion or two in case you need a starter diet. Soul Food seasoning seemed to be a wonder drug for me.

As tmm said, it's really just Adkins without the fat and thus I think it gets the body to process it's own fat pretty early in the process.

Good Luck
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Old 05-26-2011, 11:34 AM   #44
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Thanks Zero!

I'm looking forward to seeing what you have actually done to help you stick to the plan!

Yesterday ~ I had a couple of eggs, a couple small chicken breasts on the grill and some sliced turkey breast out of the lunchmeat tray when I felt like I was looking for something else...

I went shopping this morning and bought some fish, fresh chicken breasts and some more sliced turkey....and I still need to get the oats

Today (so far) ~ a few "pulls" of chicken from the dogs roasted chicken (NO SKIN!) with my meds this AM and I just had two pieces of tilapia for lunch with a 3rd piece sitting in the pan to help with any afternoon cravings....

...and the quest continues!!
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Old 05-26-2011, 11:38 AM   #45
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Bought my supplies this morning and found the oat bran with the oatmeal section in the store. Was surprised that the grocery bill was actually less than usual even with all the meat. That said, we have always been big purchasers of fresh veggies and fruit. Oh, I will miss my fruit! But I am ready to go in the morning!
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Old 05-27-2011, 08:44 AM   #46
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Hey Zero ~ still anxious to hear your menu....

BTW ~ I just had a fresh grill cooked chicken breast for breakfast....numyummy!!

Bizlady ~ good luck with day 1!!
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Old 05-27-2011, 01:31 PM   #47
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Hey Zero ~ still anxious to hear your menu....

BTW ~ I just had a fresh grill cooked chicken breast for breakfast....numyummy!!

Bizlady ~ good luck with day 1!!
Hey, sorry for the delay, I went on a trip that was supposed to be laid back but instead has turned into a nightmare. Actually had one.

VA, isn't it amazing how tasty something like the chicken can be at breakfast?

I'll give this a short one now and more later.

Grocery list.

6-8 chicken thighs, and seasoning called Soul Food (or onion, garlic, paprika powders to make your own) Coat the thighs in seasoning and put in a baggie to marinate.

7% fat sirloin burger. Possibly season it also with the Soul Food. Make 1/2lb patties shaped like Salisbury Steaks.

Containers of Oscar-Meyer Deli thin sliced turkey and also ham. These are for snacking.

Lots of canned tuna. Canned white chicken breast, etc.

0% Cottage Cheese and 0% Greek Yogurt and 0% Fat Cheese slices

Several cartons of Southwestern Eggbeaters.

-----------------------------------------
Typical day for me.
On waking: Cook your oat bran. Pour boiling water over it and then nuke for 20 seconds. Spray with fake butter, salt and pepper.

Breakfast: Omelet of Eggbeaters, put a slice of cheese over it, and have a spoon or two of you oat bran grits.

Snack: Take a few slices of deli ham, put cottage cheese on top and roll it up, spice it up with jalapeno peppers, or olives.

Lunch: a chicken thigh, best if grilled but otherwise slow fry it in Pam and when done put hot sauce to spice up. Have some cottage cheese to fill up a bit.

Snack: Put some Crystal Light orange in a cup of Greek yogurt.

Dinner: Seasoned hamburger steak patty, maybe smother with a spicy jalapeno and mustard sauce. Or with a tiny bit of catsup. etc. Or possibly, crumble the patty and mix it with your remaining oat bran grits. For some reason, that is tasty.

I promise a better menu will be out on sunday.
-----------------------------
On this trip I have not been able to follow the Dukan, lots of reasons but mainly no cooking facilities.
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Old 05-28-2011, 07:05 AM   #48
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Much to my surprise- did loose 2 lbs on day 1.

Started the diet with my "new" morning cappucino. Cup of skim milk, 1/2 teaspoon vanilla, one packet of artifical sweetner. Nuke it for 1 min 15 seconds, and spinkle with cinnamon.

Breakfast- was 1/2 cup 0% cottage cheese, and leftover grilled chicken (no skin-leg and thigh).

Lunch- made the oat bran pancake (not bad- can see lots of possibilities), 1 cup 0% greek yogurt with sweetner, scambled egg with 1 egg and about a 1/4 cup of egg whites.

Dinner- Generous (estimate 10 oz) serving of grilled salmon, 1/2 cup cottage cheese, glass of skim milk.

Snack midday- more yogurt with sweetner.

Did my 20 minute walk, and consumed the 1.5 quarts of water. Experienced a little dry mouth, but that was it!

I'll report back again at the end of my protein phase, which I plan on being 4 days.
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Old 05-28-2011, 09:24 PM   #49
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bizlady, glad the first day was a good one and some incentive, sounds like you got a nice menu going.

I had the dry mouth thing for a couple of days till my body acclimated and balanced the water load.

Hope you get some nice results.
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Old 05-29-2011, 08:58 AM   #50
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Ughhh....just finished Day 5 of the attack phase and weighed again this morning...ZERO pounds lost since my last weigh in...total of 4 pounds in 5 days...

I have decided to continue the attack phase for at least a couple more days

I have to admit that overwhelming hunger has never occurred...no dry mouth...no real menu problems....

I need to do better with the oats.....it's such a small amount allowed each day (1 and a half tablespoons) that it almost NEEDS to be added to something as Zero has suggested....I happen to have found that with a little salt and butter that it tastes very similar to those good old southern grits that I sooo love....and so I worry that when I fix them that way that I will be eating too much

As an evening/night time snacker/eater, any cravings for something sweet or crunchy comes then....so far so good....but DARN those M&Ms look good....and I DID have to leave the room when my DW was having popcorn night before last

All in all....very pleased although I have to admit to some disappointment this morning when I stepped on the scales.....

Onward and upward....uhhh....I mean DOWNward!!
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Old 05-29-2011, 02:58 PM   #51
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VACollector, I agree that the oat bran is such a small serving it is like maybe 2 bites of good ole grits or "needs" to be added to something. I love flavoring it with salt, fake butter and pepper and adding it to anything beef. Like finely sliced steak or crumbled chargrilled burger.

BTW, I just got back from traveling and in the airport I ordered an Arby's and then ate it like I was eating the whole thing but only bit into the meat. I actually like just the plain meat, so I may have turned a corner.

Stuck at 20 lbs loss but I had to eat 'baaaaad" stuff while traveling.
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Old 05-30-2011, 10:58 AM   #52
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Found this Dukan Diet Forum this morning- great for support and RECIPES!

The Dukaners.com forum • Index page

I am on my 4th and last day of the PP phase, looking forward to PV starting tomorrow. Right on track with the Dukan calculator for projected weight in this phase....
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Old 05-30-2011, 11:54 AM   #53
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Forum & Bull? Don't we get enough bull in the ER forum?
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Old 05-30-2011, 01:14 PM   #54
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I am on my 4th and last day of the PP phase, looking forward to PV starting tomorrow. Right on track with the Dukan calculator for projected weight in this phase....
Thanks for the link Bizlady.....I can't say that I'm doing as well....and not really sure why...

All meat so far with NOTHING off of the allowable list and have lost ZERO weight in the last two days...

I'm gonna go ahead and introduce veggies today as i have been on the attack phase for 6 days....maybe that will help....
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Old 05-31-2011, 07:33 AM   #55
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Finished the attach phase yesterday after 4 days, and lost 5 lbs! Super happy with that as it would have taken me 2-3 weeks under any other diet I ever did.

I dragged my feet starting this as I just could not see myself eating all that meat. Turned out to be easy with the addition of the oatbran pancake and the 0% dairy. I REALLY like that I do not have to count anything on this diet. Makes it really easy.

I will weight myself now just 1-2 times a week, as I know I will get discouraged if the scale goes up a day, or goes slow.

VACollector-I had a 0 loss day, and had missed my walk that previous day--also cut down on dairy the following day and that helped. Don't give up, and get your water in. :-)

Now, on to PV for me!
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Old 05-31-2011, 08:00 AM   #56
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I will weight myself now just 1-2 times a week, as I know I will get discouraged if the scale goes up a day, or goes slow.
I previously decided the SAME thing....and you may have a point with the dairy as I had added fat free cottage cheese to my diet to get something with a different texture into my mouth....I was actually eating it by the spoonful as well as using it as a filler in the sliced turkey...

So I'll give up the dairy and see if I can get back on track....

My 2nd WHOOPS came from our cookout with the in-laws yesterday.....I discovered only this morning when I checked the list of 100 acceptable foods....CORN is not on the list....and after 2 and a half AMAZING ears that had been cooked on the grill....it looks like I will do a couple days of pure protein and see if I can salvage these 4 pounds that I've lost...


Note to dumb a$$ self ~ check the list BEFORE you eat
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Old 05-31-2011, 09:53 AM   #57
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.... and weighed again this morning...ZERO pounds lost since my last weigh in...total of 4 pounds in 5 days...
Quote:
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... and have lost ZERO weight in the last two days...

I'm gonna go ahead and introduce veggies today as i have been on the attack phase for 6 days....maybe that will help....
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... I will weight myself now just 1-2 times a week, as I know I will get discouraged if the scale goes up a day, or goes slow.
I know nothing about this diet, but I'd like to comment in general on these posts on weight measurement. My entire career involved measuring things.

First thing to be aware of, body weight varies naturally throughout the day and probably day-to-day, even for people whose average weight is very steady. My coffee mug holds almost 3/4 of a pound of coffee by weight. You perspire, and have other, ummm, outlets for body mass. Bottom line, we are trying to measure something with variability.

When I was monitoring weight loss, I had access to a very repeatable scale. Repeatability is far more important than 'accuracy', since we are looking for relative change here. I often saw daily variations of over a pound one way or the other (that I attribute to variations in 'retention'), that seemed to have no bearing at all on my average weight. My median weekly weight (see below) decreased slowly, but steadily. The daily deltas are small enough to be lost in the 'noise'.

An important rule to apply to measurements - if it is variable, you measure it more often, not less. And then you can apply some simple (or advanced) methods to try to account for the variability. I commonly came across this diet suggestion to weigh yourself less often, and I cringed every time. You should do the opposite - but with an understanding of what you are doing.

My advice:

1) Weigh yourself every day, at the same time under as close conditions day-to-day as possible. Write it down.

2) At the end of the week, do a little 'filtering' of the data. Simplest thing is to scratch out the low-high pairs until there is just one measurement. That is your median value for the week. Average the last two if you started with an even number of measurements.

3) You probably want to see some progress week-to-week on the median value. If that isn't decreasing, it is probably a pretty good sign that you didn't lose weight that week. You may or may not want to make a diet adjustment, you might want to wait another week to verify if this is a trend.

Let's take a hypothetical to see how this variation can hose up a diet:

Nominal starting weight: 170# (weight 'retention' factor is zero on this day)

Next time on scale: Your 'real' weight is 169.5#, you actually lost 1/2#, but you are 'retaining' 1.5#, so the scale says you weigh 171#. You want to react thinking you gained weight, but you actually lost weight. So you react in the wrong direction.

Next time on scale: Your 'real' weight is back to 170#, you gained 1/2# from the previous reading, but no change since you started. But this time, let's say you are not retaining anything, so the scale matches your 'real' weight at 170#. But your last scale reading was 171#, so you think you lost weight, when you actually gained it! Again, you might respond in the opposite way you should.

Now add in that the scale you are using is of questionable repeatability and long term and short term drift ('accuracy' is actually the least important factor). If you are really going to get hung up on changes of one pound out of, say 170, that is asking the scale to detect changes of about 1/2%. Don't be fooled by the number of digits a digital scale may show, that really has nothing to do with what is important in this case. You probably need a weight equal to your starting weight to use as a reference, unless you can really characterize your scale. A sliding weight style is probably pretty good for this, the standard springy ones are questionable.

-ERD50
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Old 05-31-2011, 11:13 AM   #58
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VA, hang in there, I hit one or two days where I lost nothing and only 1 day where I regained. But, I'm beginning to think the reason I lost a nearly consistent 1 lb per day was that my excess weight was clearly all belly fat. AND, that was gained mainly in the last year or so. Not sure if that's a factor.
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Old 05-31-2011, 11:24 AM   #59
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My advice:

1) Weigh yourself every day, at the same time under as close conditions day-to-day as possible. Write it down.

2) At the end of the week, do a little 'filtering' of the data. Simplest thing is to scratch out the low-high pairs until there is just one measurement. That is your median value for the week. Average the last two if you started with an even number of measurements.
I keep a running daily total along with a rolling 4-day average. I ignore the daily total and look at trends in the 4-day average. And, in my case, since I'm interested in fat loss but not weight loss, I take a daily stomach measurement for funsies. I know that method is extremely variable but, again, I look at a rolling average not a daily.
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Old 05-31-2011, 11:38 AM   #60
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I keep a running daily total along with a rolling 4-day average. I ignore the daily total and look at trends in the 4-day average.
A rolling average should be a good filtering technique for this also. It could still be a little 'jumpy' - sometimes rolling averages are kinda funny - you sometimes drop an outlier 'bad' data point, and replace it with an outlier 'good' data point (or vice-versa), and the results are a bit over or under-stated. But as you say you are looking at trends in that 4-day average, so you are effectively applying another level of filtering, and that probably gets you where you need to be.

There are endless ways to filter data, the key here is to do some filtering, it will most likely be better than no filtering, and very probably any simple method is 'good enough'.

-ERD50
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