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Old 10-16-2014, 02:48 PM   #281
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No politics here... democrats and republicans were both exceedingly rude, and sounded like complete jerks.
I'm shocked, shocked that our representatives would play politics with such an important issue.
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Old 10-16-2014, 03:10 PM   #282
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I'm shocked, shocked that our representatives would play politics with such an important issue.
They wouldn't do that!

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Old 10-16-2014, 03:12 PM   #283
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Round up the usual suspects...
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Old 10-16-2014, 03:34 PM   #284
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Sometimes less is more. Pierre Rollin, a CDC Ebola expert who is now reviewing the infection control practices in Dallas, has said that dialysis rarely saves Ebola patients and is contraindicated because it is associated with a very high risk of transmission to staff. Nina and Amber and their colleagues were unknowingly taking this risk. It has not escaped me that they are both in their 20s, low on the totem pole and probably afraid to object.

Expert: Hospital did things right - and wrong
This does suggest that dialysis and intibation are not indicated for Ebola patients, as if they get that bad they probably won't make it anyway, and the risk to health care professionals is to high for these procedures. Now it does also raise another question, could some of these proceedures be performed by telepresence, i.e. a robot does the actual proceedure guided by a nurse on the other side of a glass wall (with tv monitoring etc). Make the robot so that it can we washed in bleach. It may be that the impetus for this has not happened yet but if we do telesurgery, it seems that it should be possible to do tele versions of these proceedures.

Found the wikipedia article on robotic surgery, it does exist the machines are about $1million each. Here is a link to the article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robotic_surgery
Actually suggests one could look at the robotic nurse also. (Likley is being worked on in Japan)
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Old 10-16-2014, 03:40 PM   #285
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Sometimes less is more. Pierre Rollin, a CDC Ebola expert who is now reviewing the infection control practices in Dallas, has said that dialysis rarely saves Ebola patients and is contraindicated because it is associated with a very high risk of transmission to staff. Nina and Amber and their colleagues were unknowingly taking this risk. It has not escaped me that they are both in their 20s, low on the totem pole and probably afraid to object.

Expert: Hospital did things right - and wrong
There was also a period of time where he wasn't isolated, and the nurses were not wearing protective gear beyond regular nurse gear. Then three days with a very sick man when the nurses were not wearing full protective gear. And no "expert" available to oversee and advise?

I notice this official report doesn't jive with the info coming in from behind the scenes via the nurses union. It indicates that they did have all the gear, were using it, and mentions nothing about how long it took to isolate the patient or for nurses to suit up with whatever gear they did have.
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Ebola in Texas
Old 10-16-2014, 03:42 PM   #286
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Ebola in Texas

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This does suggest that dialysis and intibation are not indicated for Ebola patients, as if they get that bad they probably won't make it anyway, and the risk to health care professionals is to high for these procedures. Now it does also raise another question, could some of these proceedures be performed by telepresence, i.e. a robot does the actual proceedure guided by a nurse on the other side of a glass wall (with tv monitoring etc). Make the robot so that it can we washed in bleach. It may be that the impetus for this has not happened yet but if we do telesurgery, it seems that it should be possible to do tele versions of these proceedures.

Found the wikipedia article on robotic surgery, it does exist the machines are about $1million each. Here is a link to the article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robotic_surgery
Actually suggests one could look at the robotic nurse also. (Likley is being worked on in Japan)

Not at this point in time.

We have here an ethical dilemma. Should a person critically ill with Ebola receive every possible treatment, even though this probably won't work, puts others in danger, and consumes enormous amounts of resources (which will be a gigantic issue if this spreads), OR, should nature be left to take its course? Individual benefits versus the greater good? Risk-benefit ratio of compassionate versus intensive care?


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Old 10-16-2014, 03:48 PM   #287
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... We have here an ethical dilemma. Should a person critically I'll with Ebola receive every possible treatment, even though this puts others in danger, and consumes enormous amounts of resources (which will be a gigantic issue if this spreads), OR, should nature be left to take its course? Individual benefits versus the greater good? Risk-benefit ratio of compassionate versus intensive care?
Wow! Engineers debate these economic questions all the time. I wonder if doctors do this too. My guess is that they do, but know not to make public comments about it.
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Old 10-16-2014, 03:54 PM   #288
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Wow! Engineers debate these economic questions all the time. I wonder if doctors do this too. My guess is that they do, but know not to make public comments about it.
All the time!
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Old 10-16-2014, 04:08 PM   #289
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It indicates that they did have all the gear, were using it, and mentions nothing about how long it took to isolate the patient or for nurses to suit up with whatever gear they did have.

IMO They had the protective care all hospitals use for infectious patients (gown,face mask ,booties & eye shields & gloves ) . Unfortanetely ebola requires much more than the standard hospital has available . Hopefully this was a learning lesson and protocols will be in place .My heart goes out to those nurses who are infected .
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Old 10-16-2014, 09:14 PM   #290
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Here we go:

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WASHINGTON (AP) — Under pressure to select an Ebola "czar" to lead the U.S. response against the disease, President Barack Obama conceded Thursday it "may be appropriate" to designate a single individual to head the administration effort.
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Old 10-16-2014, 09:40 PM   #291
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I think I just heard a black helicopter... Or was that a drone?
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Old 10-16-2014, 09:50 PM   #292
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I think I just heard a black helicopter... Or was that a drone?
It might have been the sound of scapegoat being born (kidded).
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Old 10-16-2014, 10:18 PM   #293
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I think I just heard a black helicopter... Or was that a drone?
Maybe that NBC reporter that broke quarantine to get something to eat should of had a pizza delivered by drone instead!!

Seriously though, we should be worried about the enterovirus 68 outbreak instead of Ebola. Enterovirus 68 has affected more people and is more mysterious than Ebola, and the media has put it on the back burner during the Ebola hysteria. Adults have died and some children have partial paralysis from enterovirus 68. and it has spread over most of north america.
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Old 10-17-2014, 06:29 AM   #294
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Seriously though, we should be worried about the enterovirus 68 outbreak instead of Ebola. Enterovirus 68 has affected more people and is more mysterious than Ebola, and the media has put it on the back burner during the Ebola hysteria. Adults have died and some children have partial paralysis from enterovirus 68. and it has spread over most of north america.
Then we should be using our Military here, not over in some wasteland across the world...
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Old 10-17-2014, 07:10 AM   #295
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Saw this morning that a cruise ship is being denied entry at the port of Belize because one of the passengers is a lab worker at the Texas Hospital. No signs of illness at this time but she and her companion are confined to their stateroom.
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Old 10-17-2014, 07:28 AM   #296
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Saw this morning that a cruise ship is being denied entry at the port of Belize because one of the passengers is a lab worker at the Texas Hospital. No signs of illness at this time but she and her companion are confined to their stateroom.
I saw that too. Let's hope that Ebola never takes hold. There is no way any American is going to be quarantined, unless you put them in a prison.

The USA can handle Ebola, 10 cases at a time. We imposed a travel ban to Israel, but we can't seem to do it for West Africa. We can't even keep possibly infected people at home...

There was even a vomiting person that died on a flight from Nigeria to JFK, but they quickly ruled out Ebola...
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Old 10-17-2014, 07:45 AM   #297
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Saw this morning that a cruise ship is being denied entry at the port of Belize because one of the passengers is a lab worker at the Texas Hospital. No signs of illness at this time but she and her companion are confined to their stateroom.
Day 19 and no symptoms, so probably OK. But "self-monitor" doesn't tell people to limit their travel? Then why self-monitor? If these folks are not allowed to work for 21 days, why are they not told don't travel? Makes no sense at all.
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Old 10-17-2014, 08:29 AM   #298
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May be this refusal to implement travel bans by the CDC/Administration is a grand plan to reduce the population and number of gov't benefit recipients

This logic that banning commercial flights from West Africa would cause the virus to spread more extensively in Africa seems ludicrous to me.
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Old 10-17-2014, 08:48 AM   #299
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Then we should be using our Military here, not over in some wasteland across the world...
The Posse Comitatus Act might prohibit that, although we are talking about the medical staff and their support staff, right? I'm not sure if that act would apply to medical personnel?
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Old 10-17-2014, 09:03 AM   #300
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I just wonder what people who may have been exposed, or definitely have been exposed, are thinking when they jump on a plane or cruise ship...

As for the travel ban, I thought I read early on that there aren't many, if any, direct flights to the most affected areas in Africa, so a flight ban would not be effective unless it used visas/passports, thereby stranding most of the "suspects" in Europe somewhere. Bet Europe would love that...

The CDC leadership has exhibited cranial-rectal inversion, but appears to be finally "getting it".

Nancy Snyderman should have known better, and should be quarantined in jail...

The most effective way, in my view, to slow this thing down is to focus on the areas in Africa where it's most prevalent, thus I support using our and other countries' militaries for logistical support.
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