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Old 05-06-2011, 08:13 AM   #181
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I've done a fair amount of reading on this subject, which makes me an expert on the internet!

If you have to fight back ravenous hunger, you are destined to fail, which is one reason why many/most "diets" don't work. Replacing unhealthy carbs - sugar and grains - with more "healthy fats" provides better satiety, as well as triggering different chemistry in the body.

As usual, some of the paleo and/or low-carb folks carry things to their absurd extreme (the internet again). But there's a fair amount of research to back it up.

In summary, I like the "eat real food, not too much" mantra. Get your carbs mostly from veggies and fruits, with minimal starches. Ditch the sugar, industrial oils, and grains. Eat butter, not margarine. Dispense with the "Special K", and eat eggs and uncured bacon. Dump the skim milk, and drink half-and-half. Take fish oil if you can't/don't eat grass-fed meat and fish. Simple, really...

Oh, and have more sex exercise, because it's fun, and helps keep you active and healthy, not because you want to lose weight.

^^^^ Agree with this, although I would ditch the half/half and substitute low fat organic, and delete the strikeout.
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Old 05-09-2011, 10:30 AM   #182
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“Our tissues need cholesterol, and LDL delivers it,” he notes. “HDL, the good cholesterol, cleans up after the repair is done. And the more LDL you have in your blood, the better you are able to build muscle during resistance training.”
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Old 06-22-2011, 08:01 PM   #183
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Harvard's study on staying slim

Potatoes bad, nuts good. What I found interesting was that it adds more support to the idea that not all calories are created equal and that there wasn't much difference in whole milk versus lowfat. It also mentions the insulin effect and potatoes.
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Old 06-23-2011, 08:01 AM   #184
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Harvard's study on staying slim

Potatoes bad, nuts good. What I found interesting was that it adds more support to the idea that not all calories are created equal and that there wasn't much difference in whole milk versus lowfat. It also mentions the insulin effect and potatoes.
Well, I never was of the opinion all calories are created equal. I also do not believe all carbs are created equal and there are good ones and bad ones. Aside from the comments on the common spud which I would agree are bad carbs, I would class sweet potato as a good carb source. Regarding the whole milk vs lowfat, that may be true in terms of little difference in contribution to weight gain, however, I would assume it could make a big difference in terms of putting fats into your bloodstream that create problems for people at risk in terms of BP, cholesterol, triglycerides.
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Old 06-23-2011, 09:21 AM   #185
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I am certainly not a doctor or nutritionist, but it is something i've been studying for the greater of 2 years now, and here's what I've learned thus far about carbs:

There are definitely the good and the bad carbs, and in order to maintain a good weight you have to eliminate the bad from your diet completely. I have found this to be true in my own diet, as soon as I dropped many bad carbs, I noticed that it was easier to lose weight and keep it off, especially in my abdomen where excess fat is stored more commonly in men.

Good carbs - complex carbohydrates, found in whole grain foods such as oatmeal and whole wheat bread are the best types of carbs for you. They have provide fiber for your body, which has several benefits and take more energy for your body to break them down.

Bad carbs - simple carbs are found in white bread, potatoes, and almost any white colored starch such as spaghetti, white rice, etc. Simple carbs are usually the result of food processing that strips foods of complex carbs, and should be thought of as the equivalent of straight sugar, since your body can convert it to sugar very quickly and using little energy. Even Milk falls into this category.

The thing is that all carbs are essentially converted to sugar in the body, however the body has to expend more energy to break down complex carbs (good for your metabolism), as opposed to simple carbs.

The body's retention of fat in normal circumstances is a result of a chain of events relating to the consumption of sugar...NOT necessarily fat (not that fat doesn't contribute at all, but sugar makes it stick). Sugar triggers the production of insulin, which in turn induces the body to store unused calories as fat in the abs, hips, thighs, butt, etc.

If you want a simple rule to losing weight and keeping it off, eliminate/reduce simple carbs and/or sugar in general from your diet. Period. This is in addition to "eat real food, not too much".

I remember last year about this time I was intensively working out, going to the gym, etc. but not seeing any results. Then I read this book The Belly Fat Cure, and the author broke down what makes people gain weight (that's where the analysis above comes from). I changed my diet, and as soon as a week later after adopting a diet free of sugar and simple carbs, along with regular exercise, I saw my abs tightening up.
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Old 06-23-2011, 11:27 AM   #186
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Potatoes bad, nuts good.
But don't lose sight of the fact that you should go easy on the nuts.
I love all kinds of nuts, and the first thing I did when we moved to this house was to plant a bunch of nut trees in the yard.

However, I think most people don't realize how many calories are in a handful of nuts.
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Old 06-23-2011, 11:29 AM   #187
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My guess is that 50 years from now we will still be blocking the aisles at Walmart, because all these things are mostly preceived as just one or another fad.

There is even a meme going around that potatoes help you to lose weight:

60-day potato diet leaves advocate 21 lbs. lighter - TODAY Health - TODAY.com

Ha
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Old 06-23-2011, 12:09 PM   #188
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Physics works- everywhere in the known universe....
Science-Based Medicine » Why We Get Fat
The writer of this article is steeped in conventional wisdom, and doesn't seem to understand Taube's argument concerning calories in, calories out.

First, the human body is not a closed system and can leave calories on the table so to speak. That is, it doesn't extract every calorie available in food. Also, there is likely to be significant variability among individuals in this regard. The experiment has not been done. It is possible there is so little variability among individuals that this effect is negligible. On the other hand it could be significant. Taubes wants to do the experiment.

Second, even if everyone did extract every calorie from every food in an identical manner, individuals' fat storage mechanism can be different. In other words, given the same food in the same amount, absorbing the nutrients equivalently, different individuals will use those nutrients in a different manner depending on the current state of their metabolism (activity, hormone levels, etc). Some will spontaneously increase their metabolism in response to the diet, while others will reduce their metabolism and store more fat.

Taubes also observes that the body's insulin response explains everything nicely, with no need for a more elaborate hypothesis. Generally, he seems to give excessively-long justifications for his ideas, which seems to throw people off.
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Old 06-23-2011, 12:57 PM   #189
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But don't lose sight of the fact that you should go easy on the nuts.
I love all kinds of nuts, and the first thing I did when we moved to this house was to plant a bunch of nut trees in the yard.

However, I think most people don't realize how many calories are in a handful of nuts.
OTOH, see this can of nuts:

macadamias.jpg

I personally go through one of these cans every two weeks. That's almost 400 calories a day, and doesn't include the roasted pecans that I eat. I don't gain weight.

I figure that any calories that I eat of these puppies means calories that I don't eat of something else (something which has more carbs). Use this picture when someone says that eating low carb is depriving oneself.

We buy 10 at a time at Costco.

Also, note that all nuts are not the same; cashews have five times the amount of net carbs as macadamias.

Serving Size: 1/4 Cup

LOWEST TO HIGHEST AT FULL CARB COUNT:
Brazil nuts 3.5 carbs 1.5 net carbs
Macadamia nuts 3.6 carbs 1.4 net carbs
Pumpkin seed kernels 3.8 carbs 2.7 net carbs
Walnuts 3.9 carbs 2.0 net carbs
Pecans 4.0 carbs 1.2 net carbs
Hazelnuts 4.7 carbs 2.0 net carbs
Peanuts 5.3 carbs 3.4 net carbs
Pine nuts 5.5 carbs 2.5 net carbs
Almonds 5.6 carbs 2.2 net carbs
Sunflower kernels 5.8 carbs 2.5 net carbs
Pistachios 7.6 carbs 4.7 net carbs
Cashews 8.5 carbs 7.6 net carbs

LOWEST TO HIGHEST NET CARBS:
Pecans 4.0 carbs 1.2 net carbs
Macadamia nuts 3.6 carbs 1.4 net carbs
Brazil nuts 3.5 carbs 1.5 net carbs
Hazelnuts 4.7 carbs 2.0 net carbs
Walnuts 3.9 carbs 2.0 net carbs
Almonds 5.6 carbs 2.2 net carbs
Pine nuts 5.5 carbs 2.5 net carbs
Sunflower kernels 5.8 carbs 2.5 net carbs
Pumpkin seed kernels 3.8 carbs 2.7 net carbs
Peanuts 5.3 carbs 3.4 net carbs
Pistachios 7.6 carbs 4.7 net carbs
Cashews 8.5 carbs 7.6 net carbs
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Old 06-23-2011, 12:59 PM   #190
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It would be hard for me to be an advocate for low carb, or any other diet plan. The evidence is mostly not very good, and all over the map.

Whenever one is considering trying some fairly radical idea, I think it is helpful to consider what I am trying to escape from, and what risks may I be accepting that I didn't have before.

If the idea is to lose 15-20#, but one is otherwise healthy, maybe do whatever diet works but perhaps then go back to a more typical diet plan for life.

If diabetes is nipping at one's heels, perhaps a more radical diet prescription is warranted, if that seems to keep sugars in check better.

My thought is that if scientists doing these studies are are in conflict with one another, what chance do I have of sorting it out better?

Ha
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Old 06-23-2011, 09:28 PM   #191
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It would be hard for me to be an advocate for low carb, or any other diet plan. The evidence is mostly not very good, and all over the map.

Whenever one is considering trying some fairly radical idea, I think it is helpful to consider what I am trying to escape from, and what risks may I be accepting that I didn't have before.

If the idea is to lose 15-20#, but one is otherwise healthy, maybe do whatever diet works but perhaps then go back to a more typical diet plan for life.

If diabetes is nipping at one's heels, perhaps a more radical diet prescription is warranted, if that seems to keep sugars in check better.

My thought is that if scientists doing these studies are are in conflict with one another, what chance do I have of sorting it out better?

Ha
Hmmm...a better chance? All you (or I) have to do is try a few eating/exercise regimes, find the one that works best for us, and do it (the hard part). The scientists keep trying to find the one thing that works for all people, when pretty much nothing works for all people. Politicians have that same problem. However, unsolvable problems make for good job security.
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Old 06-23-2011, 09:42 PM   #192
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Hmmm...a better chance? All you (or I) have to do is try a few eating/exercise regimes, find the one that works best for us, and do it (the hard part). The scientists keep trying to find the one thing that works for all people, when pretty much nothing works for all people. Politicians have that same problem. However, unsolvable problems make for good job security.
Very good point Harley.

Ha
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Old 06-23-2011, 09:55 PM   #193
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Hmmm...a better chance? All you (or I) have to do is try a few eating/exercise regimes, find the one that works best for us, and do it (the hard part).
I agree. A problem is that there are many regimes (hundreds?) out there, and most do not work. That's not controversial, the majority of diets result in failure. After someone has yo-yo'd her way through six regimes she's screwed.
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Old 06-24-2011, 12:07 PM   #194
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Here is an interesting recent post by Jenny Ruhl, a low-carber who has diabetes and who is very careful with her reporting. It's about what we might expect from the media, now that the ADA is having their annual shindig.

Why can't these guys just content themselves with drinking too much and going to "gentlemen's clubs"? They would cause way less harm.

Ha
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Old 06-24-2011, 12:27 PM   #195
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What are the proteins on those macadamia nuts? I always find it a challenge to consume enough protein, unless I eat 5X/day.

Also noticed the sea salt which sounds good for iodine levels, I'll check them out at Costco.
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Old 06-25-2011, 10:39 AM   #196
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What are the proteins on those macadamia nuts? I always find it a challenge to consume enough protein, unless I eat 5X/day.

Also noticed the sea salt which sounds good for iodine levels, I'll check them out at Costco.
I just happened to by a small package last night. It's 2g of protein per 1/4 cup (the same size T-A was using above).
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Old 06-25-2011, 10:50 AM   #197
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Here is an interesting recent post by Jenny Ruhl, a low-carber who has diabetes and who is very careful with her reporting. It's about what we might expect from the media, now that the ADA is having their annual shindig.
Ha,

Is this the article you were referencing? I really admire Jenny's writing, also.

Diabetes Update: Idiotically Dangerous Diet "Reverses Diabetes" but So Does Moderate Carb Restriction Without Calorie Restriction
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Old 06-25-2011, 11:01 AM   #198
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I just happened to by a small package last night. It's 2g of protein per 1/4 cup (the same size T-A was using above).
Thanks gindie, I am due for a visit to Costco tomorrow and will give them a try. I've been eating walnuts, they are higher in carb, but also a few more proteins.
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Old 06-25-2011, 11:36 AM   #199
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Yes, that is it, sorry I forgot to link it. In addition to her knowledge and familiarity with the literature, I like the way she shows her righteous anger at the way patients, human beings, are basically milked for profit.

How many diabetes drugs, when someone bothers to do the research, have been shown to hinder survival?

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Old 06-25-2011, 11:48 AM   #200
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However, I think most people don't realize how many calories are in a handful of nuts.
That explains why I gain weight by just reading this forum ...
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