High cholesterol problem

[haha]

Thanks. I am convinced on the sugar thing, I was just looking for evidence about the differential effect of the small dense LDL carrying lipoproteins relative to the large fluffy LDL lipoprotein particles. My Dr. is not a believer. I'll spend some time looking around. Much safer for a Doc to be a late adaptor of a formerly taboo idea then to be an early adaptor.

Sugar taxes IMO would be hard to get, and I would fear them because there are a lot more people who might sign on for a fat-tax than for a sugar tax. What does your Doc lecture you about? Sugar in your diet or "unhealthy saturated fat"?

Ha

 

[Chuckanut]

The video posted above is long, about an hour and a half, and very informative. The good doctor is a professor of pediatric endocrinology, so I have to assume he does know something. However, I would enjoy hearing other authoritative voices who disagree.

 

[haha]

The video posted above is long, about an hour and a half, but very informative. The good doctor is a professor of pediatric endocrinology, so I have to assume he does know something. However, I would enjoy hearing other authoritative voices who disagree.

I hope you don't think I am disagreeing; I am not. But try anything put out by the ADA or American Heart Association for other viewpoints.

Ha

 

[TromboneAl]

I haven't read this yet:

Beyond Routine Cholesterol Testing: The Role of LDL Particle Size Assessment

http://www.centerforpreventivemedicine.com/04114med_messenger.pdf

 

[haha]

I haven't read this yet:

Beyond Routine Cholesterol Testing: The Role of LDL Particle Size Assessment

http://www.centerforpreventivemedicine.com/04114med_messenger.pdf

Thanks Al. There are a few references here that may be helpful. But he is really looking for an excuse to give more pharmacologial treatment to those who already qualify for treatment under current guidlines based on their standard LDL figure. He asserts that LDL as usually measured is strongly predictive of cardiac events. I have read but cannot cite papers that deny this.

Something is not quit right with this whole cholesterol thing, but unfortunately I do not know what. As best I know, the large, well done studies like the West of Scotland study show very little correlation of death rates with LDL, but it is hard to keep these things in my head.

Even statin treatment which does lower death rates modestly while dramatically lowering LDL numbers shows very little correlation between those two things.

A detail oriented person like me struggles with this.

Ha

 

[braumeister]

AFAIK, the way to get at least a rough estimate of your LDL particle size using your own blood test figures is to divide your triglyceride number by your HDL number. A T/H ratio of less than 3 is good (meaning your LDL particle size is most likely bigger), and 1 would be excellent.

Trig above 120 and HDL below 40 (so a ratio of more than 3) would be associated with the small, dense LDL particles, and would be worrisome.

Last time I checked mine, I had T/H = 94/88 for a ratio of 1.1 and I follow a low carb, high fat diet.

 

[TromboneAl]

I've now read it, and I'd summarize the article as: "The national guidelines say that LDL is bad, but it's starting to look like the small dense LDL is the real problem. You can measure LDL particle size, but if the patient has really low TG, then you don't need to even bother, since that patient won't have small, dense LDL."

My TG is 49 an HDL 69, so I'm hoping my new doctor will agree that that is good.

 

[haha]

I've now read it, and I'd summarize the article as: "The national guidelines say that LDL is bad, but it's starting to look like the small dense LDL is the real problem. You can measure LDL particle size, but if the patient has really low TG, then you don't need to even bother, since that patient won't have small, dense LDL."

My TG is 49 an HDL 69, so I'm hoping my new doctor will agree that that is good.

I think she will. though she may hassle you if your LDL is 'high". Primary care today is learning how to follow a flowchart and don't bother yourself with thinking as it will just get you into trouble with your overlords.

Ha

 

[TromboneAl]

Is your doctor old or young?

 

[JOHNNIE36]

This has been one of the most interesting threads. I am surprised at all the information provided by the members. You are most knowledgeable.
In my situation, having had cardiac bypass in 2004, I have been striving to maintain "good numbers". I mentioned in an earlier post on this thread that I was going to go from 80mg simvastatin to 40mg and see what happened to the numbers. Lab test earlier last week produced the following: Total cholestrol 199, HDL 46, triglycerides 175 and LDL 118. Although the triglycerides is a little high, I'm happy overall with the results. The ratio of CHOL/HDLC is 4.3 which is in the acceptable range.

 

[Chuckanut]

From what I read the ratio of Triglycerides to HDL should be about 2.1 or less, not 3. Again, it is no wonder the public is confused. But, I think the medical establishment is still learning, so they are probably a bit confused also.

 

[haha]

Is your doctor old or young?

Young; about 38-40. And really good looking and obviously dedicated and intelligent.

Ha

 

[grasshopper]

Does NON-HDL in the real world mean anything? My total would have to be 188 or lower to meet current OK levels. My Dr. is happy with my panel, given no history.

 

[TromboneAl]

Young; about 38-40. And really good looking and obviously dedicated and intelligent.

Ha

Yeah, well check out my new doc, who I haven't met yet. Wow, huh?

​

 

[haha]

Yeah, well check out my new doc, who I haven't met yet. Wow, huh?

I think we both are in good hands.

Ha

 

[haha]

Does NON-HDL in the real world mean anything? My total would have to be 188 or lower to meet current OK levels. My Dr. is happy with my panel, given no history.

It looks like they just subtracted the HDL figure from total cholesterol.

Cholesterol is interesting. I could stop drinking, I stop stop using salt, and there must be one or two other pleasures I could give up, but I don't think I could get along without my fat. Tonight I had dinner at a son's house- three frenched lamb chops, and a raw chop of garlic and mint and a few other herbs, and I relished every lovely hunk of glistening fat on those chops.

Ha

 

[Moscyn]

Oh, his advice?? - Eat Real Food.

Oh dear, what's real food? Non-processed food? As regards my diet status, I'm still being good with limited red meat in-take but still taking my carbos though at a reduced volume.

 

[rgarling]

: Oh dear, what's real food? Non-processed food? ....

see: LCHF for beginners | Dietdoctor.com

 

[Moscyn]

see: LCHF for beginners | Dietdoctor.com

Thanks! Looks very informative. Will read this.

 

[Bestwifeever]

The bolded area describes what happened to my MIL (found with a quick google search of Lipitor and memory loss). Started after she started taking a statin, stopped when she quit. She took a generic and that was about 5 years ago so it couldn't have been Lipitor.

The link between Lipitor and memory loss

Of the approximately eighteen million people using Lipitor in the United States, about two percent have reported side effects that involve memory loss. Reported memory loss can range from short-term memory loss, feelings of disorientation, and mild confusion, to profound loss of memory that has a strongly detrimental effect on everyday life.

While researchers are hesitant to attribute this kind of memory loss solely to use of Lipitor, many patients report a reduction in symptoms if they switch to a different cholesterol medication. (Note: Never stop or change your medications, or reduce your dosages, without consulting with your physician.)

Whether or not memory loss is caused directly by Lipitor, or by other factors, there are other measures you can take to help reduce any symptoms of memory loss and generally keep your brain functioning at its best.

Lipitor and Memory Loss | Does Lipitor Cause Memory Loss?

I saw this news story just now and immediately thought of this thread (yes, I do have a boring life):

Federal health officials are adding new safety warnings about risks of memory loss and elevated blood sugar to statins, a widely prescribed group of cholesterol-lowering medications.

FDA adds new safety information to statin drugs - USATODAY.com

 

[braumeister]

Think that's bad? Check out this poor guy's story, a medical doctor who nearly lost his memory completely from Lipitor usage.

Dr. Duane Graveline - Statins and Statin Side Effects

My first book, Lipitor®, Thief of Memory, was written after my two bouts of transient global amnesia (TGA) associated with the use of Lipitor® in the years 1999 - 2000. Predictably at that time, I was focused on cognitive dysfunction and Lipitor®.

I soon realized the adverse reactions involved far more than impaired cognition, including personality change, myopathy, neuropathy and a chronic neuromuscular degeneration similar to ALS and all statins were contributing to these adverse reactions, not just Lipitor®.

It was in this climate that I wrote my second book, Statin Drugs Side Effects. This is when I learned what reductase inhibition really meant. The reductase step blocked by statins was at the very beginning of the mevalonate pathway.

 

[audreyh1]

Federal health officials are adding new safety warnings about risks of memory loss and elevated blood sugar to statins, a widely prescribed group of cholesterol-lowering medications.

 

[sengsational]

, but I don't think I could get along without my fat. Tonight I had dinner at a son's house- three frenched lamb chops, and a raw chop of garlic and mint and a few other herbs, and I relished every lovely hunk of glistening fat on those chops.

The sooner the public figures out that dietary fat is NOT the enemy, the sooner heart disease will begin to wane. Let's take lard. This is stolen from Gary Tubes...47% of lard is mono unsaturated which is good for hdl and good for ldl. 14% is steric acid, which is good for hdl and has no effect on ldl. 12% is poly unsaturated which is good for ldl and has no effect on hdl. 28% is saturated, which has everybody spooked, but it's actually good for hdl and, yes, bad for ldl. Bottom line is that EVEN LARD helps your number more than it hurts 'em! Enjoy your dietary fat!

Something is not quit right with this whole cholesterol thing, but unfortunately I do not know what. As best I know, the large, well done studies like the West of Scotland study show very little correlation of death rates with LDL, but it is hard to keep these things in my head.

What's wrong is the people in power bought in to an incorrect theory and now cognitive dissonance keeps them from seeing what is now apparent after more data has been uncovered.

 

[JOHNNIE36]

Think that's bad? Check out this poor guy's story, a medical doctor who nearly lost his memory completely from Lipitor usage.

Dr. Duane Graveline - Statins and Statin Side Effects

Just finished reading the interview with the doctor and feel like I fall right in with his take on the effects of statins. I have taken various statins for years and still suffered a heart attack in 2004 and had cardiac bypass surgery. I'm still taking simvastatin and have noticed that over the last four years my muscle strength has been reduced dramatically. Three months ago I reduced my dosage from 80mg to 40mg. Recent blood work indicates continued good numbers on total, HDL and LDL with triglycerides
a little high at 175. Even though Im 75 years old I am really saddened at my loss of strength for a guy 6' 3" and 230 lbs. I can't hit a golf ball more than 175 yards, moved up to the gold tees and handicap still went from a 12 five years ago to to a 23. I'm thinking about talking to my doctor and telling I want to get off the simvastatin completely and let the chips fall where they may. That may not be a smart move but that is the way I feel right now.

Edited to add that DW also thinks my memory is shot. I keep telling her I only remember the things that are important. According to her, then I don't think anything she says is important.

 

[jclarksnakes]

I am a retired nurse. Working in orthopedics a LARGE percentage of my patients were obese. On television you see shows about people who weigh over 500 pounds and may think they are an oddity. You probably do not see many of them out and around in your community because they are usually not very ambulatory. Working in a hospital, at least here in the south you see a bunch of them. When orthopedic nurses are giving report to the oncoming nurses at shift change and they say that a patient is diabetic the incoming nurse should envision a fit and healthy person who carefully manages their disease. Instead we envision an obese patient who has poorly controlled diabetes and our envisioned image was virtually always accurate. If one of my diabetic patients wanted something to drink besides water and I offered choices including tea, coffee, milk and diet cola, 90% of those diabetic patients would specifically request regular cola instead. When I said that diet cola would be a better choice they universally said they would not drink it because they disliked the taste. Official policy on our floor was to attempt to educate but give the patient whatever they wanted in the end. Diabetes is a terrible disease and it seems that patients and the medical profession are doing a very poor job managing and treating it.

I have been preaching and living the low fat mantra for almost 20 years. Along the way I cut back on sweets and "visible" sugars. I did know that the hidden sugars were a problem but was not aware how big that problem was. I have sort of kept my weight under control (5 feet 7, 165 pounds) with calorie counting and exercise but I have always been HUNGRY. For all that time I have been perplexed that our society seemed to be gaining lots of weight while all around them they were seemingly bombarded with low fat foods and info. After having watched Dr. Lustig and the dietdoctor videos and doing some more reading I am as of today switching to a HFLC diet.