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Old 11-11-2010, 01:33 PM   #41
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There are some other references to Taubes and references to appraisals of his work on diet in the Wikipedia: Gary Taubes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .
Granted, I quickly ran through it but I didn't find anything to support your claim. Did I miss it?
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Old 11-11-2010, 01:38 PM   #42
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FWIW, Taubes has a masters degree aerospace engineering and often wrote on physics topics in the past. Of course this does not make him a scientist in the topic of his book. I would be interested in what active researchers in the field have to say about the quality of his book.

Interestingly, I recently read a chapter in book on the state of consciousness research by a scientist that studies mediation. A few reviewers also accused him of ignoring research out there and his reply was that the omitted studies did not apply to the question at hand, or it was considered and rejected as not quality research. One problem is that anyone can criticize and it can be hard for us non-science types to figure out what is a legitimate criticism and what is not. You don't want to be thinking that just because this person is an expert in his field he knows what he is talking about. But with sufficient poking around it seems like most of the time you can get a good idea of what is quality and what is not. One thing that I have done is read a few books on evaluating research. There are some good books out there, like Amazon.com: How to Read a Paper: The Basics of Evidence-Based Medicine (HOW - How To) (9781444334364): Trisha Greenhalgh: Books: Reviews, Prices & more, and Amazon.com: Meaning, Medicine and the 'Placebo Effect' (Cambridge Studies in Medical Anthropology) (9780521000871): Daniel E. Moerman: Books: Reviews, Prices & more and for those nice wishy washy hard to pin down social science questions, Amazon.com: Evaluating Social Science Research: An Introduction (9780803988538): Dr Thomas R Black: Books
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Old 11-11-2010, 01:56 PM   #43
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Granted, I quickly ran through it but I didn't find anything to support your claim. Did I miss it?
My claim being that he is an enthusiastic amateur? Is anyone really saying he is or has ever been employed as a scientist? My claim that he omitted mention of some research not supporting his thesis? In addition to the Kolata review that I mentioned, the Wikipedia article references a review by Bray, who discusses a "number of errors of omission or commission that are important when relating diet to disease." (It also refers to Taubes' reply to Bray, which I haven't read.)
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Old 11-11-2010, 02:34 PM   #44
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Old 11-11-2010, 02:56 PM   #45
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It won't allow me to enter data. ??
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Old 11-11-2010, 02:59 PM   #46
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It won't allow me to enter data. ??
Works for me, but only after I allow the page; i.e. no ad blockers or script blockers.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:17 PM   #47
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It won't allow me to enter data. ??
It worked for me... although it took me a while to figure it out. Yeah, the red areas are input and the gray are calculated... but it took me forever to decide what it was asking for (and that was after it dawned on me that I didn't need to know what a "stone" was). Anyway, it told me to up my intake to 2800mg a day (from 2400). Hurumph
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Old 11-11-2010, 05:53 PM   #48
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My claim being that he is an enthusiastic amateur? Is anyone really saying he is or has ever been employed as a scientist? My claim that he omitted mention of some research not supporting his thesis? In addition to the Kolata review that I mentioned, the Wikipedia article references a review by Bray, who discusses a "number of errors of omission or commission that are important when relating diet to disease." (It also refers to Taubes' reply to Bray, which I haven't read.)
His response to Bray is worth reading.
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Old 11-11-2010, 06:25 PM   #49
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Yeah, I studied those books, but they did not apply to the question at hand, or they were considered and rejected as not quality research.

The main impression I got from Taubes' calories book was that of beating a dead horse into the ground with a 90-pound jackhammer. God only knows why his critics feel that he ignored or overlooked credible research. Maybe they were too bogged down to finish reading it, too, or they starved to death before reaching the bibliography...
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Old 11-11-2010, 06:27 PM   #50
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His response to Bray is worth reading.
Well, I don't know about that. I find Taubes' views baffling, especially on exercise. The ordinary view on the relation between exercise and weight loss is that, when you exercise, you burn calories which would otherwise go to fat. Taubes seems to think that exercise causes an increase in stored fat, because it makes you hungry, and you consequently eat more, and so you gain weight. That makes sense only if you remove yourself as a causal agent from the process. Exercise may make me hungry, but I don't have to eat and therefore gain weight unless I put food into my mouth, chew, and swallow. It's the intake of calories that causes the weight gain, not the exercise, because I am not an automaton whose actions are governed by hunger or insulin peaks. I may be hungry and yet choose not to eat more.
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Old 11-12-2010, 01:15 AM   #51
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This is another of those "lots of studies but no proof of anything" items.
Makes my urine stink bad enough to cut dosage and freqency of use down to where I don't notice the smell.
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Old 11-12-2010, 05:27 AM   #52
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Makes my urine stink bad enough to cut dosage and freqency of use down to where I don't notice the smell.
Interesting; I had never heard of this symptom. I wonder if the smell might have been caused by the capsule material rather than the fish oil itself?

Ha
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Old 11-12-2010, 08:19 AM   #53
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Makes my urine stink bad enough to cut dosage and freqency of use down to where I don't notice the smell.
When I was taking them I was always burping a fish oil taste............. TMI!
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Old 11-12-2010, 09:44 AM   #54
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Well, I certainly hope PETA doesn't find this thread.

G20 under fire for treatment of goldfish - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
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Old 11-12-2010, 06:45 PM   #55
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I take 3600mg fish oil every day...keeps the cholesterol down. My doctor said you can't take too much fish oil
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Old 11-12-2010, 06:55 PM   #56
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I take 3600mg fish oil every day...keeps the cholesterol down. My doctor said you can't take too much fish oil

I think you'll hit the upper limit when the BM's are oily
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Old 11-12-2010, 08:11 PM   #57
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I take 3600mg fish oil every day...keeps the cholesterol down. My doctor said you can't take too much fish oil
Not true at all. Fish oil, just like any other oil, can be a little hard on the liver. Probably doesn't matter in your 20s or 30s, but when you reach starting-to-fall-apart age (50s or so), you have to watch it. Especially if you are on certain medications.

It's good stuff, but even vitamin C has limits.
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Old 11-12-2010, 08:15 PM   #58
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starting-to-fall-apart age (50s or so),
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Old 11-12-2010, 09:03 PM   #59
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There is a lot of conflicting data on exactly how much a person can (or should) control cholesterol. For instance, this off-the-top-of -my-head Google search:

cholesterol +atkins - Google Search .....
Good point. I don't worry too too much about the cholesterol I eat. I do try to eat leaner when I can. However, I do watch out for taking in too many carbs, and the kinds of carbs I eat. My main carbs are veggies and fruits...5 a day. Once or twice a week I have a little bit of beans. Once or twice a week I will have a small serving of whole grains. I avoid the "white" carbs and rarely have any added sugars. I take the fish oil because high cholesterol runs in my moms side of the family. She has it. When the doc diagnosed her cholesterol at 350, he told her not to eat any eggs, red meat, whole milk products, or dark meat chicken (or the skin), and to eat oatmeal for every breakfast. So, she faithfully ate oatmeal for every breakfast, had a couple slices of bread and a fruit at lunch and chicken breast and veggies for dinner. Essentially she ate almost no cholesterol containing foods at all. After 3 months he checked her cholesterol again, and it was up to 450 something. (She then gave up trying to reduce it without medication and stared on the pills.).

For me, this means that cutting out all cholesterol is obviously not the answer. I did a severe round of Atkins a few years ago and lost a lot of weight, along with a nice drop in cholesterol. But, I found that I went overboard with it, and ended up not being able to stay with it and the weight came back over a period of 3-4 years. Now I'm trying more of a slow-carb approach. Limited carbs of a primarily whole nature, and exercise...usually 12-15 miles of running and as much walking as I can find time to do in a week, and fish oil. The weight loss is coming, very slowly, but it is happening, and my cholesterol levels are fine at the same age as mom was when she was first diagnosed.

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Old 11-13-2010, 03:03 PM   #60
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... It's the intake of calories that causes the weight gain, not the exercise, because I am not an automaton whose actions are governed by hunger or insulin peaks. I may be hungry and yet choose not to eat more.
In fact, certain types of exercise cause you to lose your appetite...
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