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Old 07-21-2015, 11:19 AM   #21
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So I called the IRS this morning. After calling several times and just getting hung up on it finally put me in line to talk to someone (I've dealt with them before so I knew I would eventually be put in line if I kept calling). After waiting on hold for about an hour I finally got through to an agent. I told her about the letter and gave her the info she needed to access the account, and then she put me on hold again for 15 more minutes.

When she came back she said that she didn't understand why the letter was sent and put me on hold for another 10 mins. When she came back on the line again she said it had something to do with the fraudulent return that was filed. I didn't fully understand what she was saying, but basically the fraudulent return somehow kept the real one from going through. She then said they had our return and everything was fine and we didn't need to worry about the letter. Even so, I still feel a little uneasy about the whole thing.
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Old 07-21-2015, 11:22 AM   #22
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So I called the IRS this morning. After calling several times and just getting hung up on it finally put me in line to talk to someone (I've dealt with them before so I knew I would eventually be put in line if I kept calling). After waiting on hold for about an hour I finally got through to an agent. I told her about the letter and gave her the info she needed to access the account, and then she put me on hold again for 15 more minutes.

When she came back she said that she didn't understand why the letter was sent and put me on hold for another 10 mins. When she came back on the line again she said it had something to do with the fraudulent return that was filed. I didn't fully understand what she was saying, but basically the fraudulent return somehow kept the real one from going through. She then said they had our return and everything was fine and we didn't need to worry about the letter. Even so, I still feel a little uneasy about the whole thing.
Well, I think you got the answer and it sounds like things are OK. Make some notes from the phone call with some details - the date and time of call, the agent's name if you remember it. Just it case you get another letter and have call again, you'll have that info handy to let them know you already called and the answers you got.

But I think you can breathe easy.
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Old 07-21-2015, 11:42 AM   #23
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Well, I think you got the answer and it sounds like things are OK. Make some notes from the phone call with some details - the date and time of call, the agent's name if you remember it. Just it case you get another letter and have call again, you'll have that info handy to let them know you already called and the answers you got.

But I think you can breathe easy.
Yeah, I think so too. It's still worrying a bit though because there wasn't a lot of confidence in her voice. She almost sounded unsure about whether it was actually fixed. She didn't even seem confident about the explanation she gave me. lol

I don't have her name or ID, but I do have the time and somewhat of an understanding of what she told me. Hopefully if I have to call back that will be enough.
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Old 07-21-2015, 01:46 PM   #24
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But he knows that he mailed in the check with the return, so it's still worth asserting - telling them he knows that they got the return because the check was with it. They can get his assertion on record. Why would they bother to dispute it at this point?

Yes, but my point is that the only 'proof' the check provides is that money was paid.... if they do not have the return, they do not have it.... they will not let him have a pass on sending it to them at some point...


I actually had a problem with the IRS concerning the date a return was mailed... they said it was mailed late... I pointed out that I mailed 4 different returns for the companies at the same time and the other 3 were not mailed late... it took me almost a year to get a penalty waived because someone 7 years earlier had mailed a return late and they waived that one.... seems you only get one waiver..... but they finally agreed since they did not keep the envelope as proof that it was mailed late and not just delivered late....
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Old 07-22-2015, 08:01 AM   #25
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I called the IRS 800 number, and waited a half hour to get someone. I was impressed that she gave me her last name and an employee number right away without my asking. She looked up my info and said they do have a return on file for me and they have received my payment, and that I can disregard the letter. I asked her why they would send out the letter in the first place, and she said she did not know. She also said they "just sent out a whole bunch of those letters". Thanks for all the replies!
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Old 07-22-2015, 08:02 AM   #26
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Glad to see this ending well.
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Old 07-22-2015, 03:08 PM   #27
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So I got one of these insane letters today. I filed electronically and the filing did include form 8962. I tried calling the 800 number and after wading through a phone tree I got hung up on. Guess I will have to try again later.


This is the sort of thing that turns people into libertarians/tea party/ffar right gubmint haters.
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Old 07-22-2015, 04:41 PM   #28
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I actually had a problem with the IRS concerning the date a return was mailed... they said it was mailed late... I pointed out that I mailed 4 different returns for the companies at the same time and the other 3 were not mailed late... it took me almost a year to get a penalty waived because someone 7 years earlier had mailed a return late and they waived that one.... seems you only get one waiver..... but they finally agreed since they did not keep the envelope as proof that it was mailed late and not just delivered late....
The advantage of mailing certified mail. The reciept proves the date of mailing according to the law. The return reciept then proves the IRS got the return.
Internal Revenue Bulletin 2004-43 "These proposed regulations amend 301.7502-1(e)(1) to clarify that, other than direct proof of actual delivery, the exclusive means to establish prima facie evidence of delivery of Federal tax documents to the IRS and the United States Tax Court is to prove the use of registered or certified mail. The IRS currently accepts only a registered or certified mail receipt to establish a presumption of delivery if the IRS has no record of ever having received the document in question. This policy not only is consistent with section 7502(c) but also provides taxpayers with certainty that, under the Code, a certified or registered mail receipt will establish prima facie evidence of delivery. Accordingly, the proposed regulations merely clarify and confirm current IRS practice under the existing regulations. These proposed regulations provide that the final regulations, to which these proposed regulations relate, will be effective for all documents mailed after the publication date of these proposed regulations. "
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Old 07-22-2015, 06:59 PM   #29
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The old school method is to go to one of the irs offices. I have found this about as effective as other correspondence schemes.
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Old 07-22-2015, 07:46 PM   #30
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The advantage of mailing certified mail. The reciept proves the date of mailing according to the law. The return reciept then proves the IRS got the return.
Internal Revenue Bulletin 2004-43 "These proposed regulations amend 301.7502-1(e)(1) to clarify that, other than direct proof of actual delivery, the exclusive means to establish prima facie evidence of delivery of Federal tax documents to the IRS and the United States Tax Court is to prove the use of registered or certified mail. The IRS currently accepts only a registered or certified mail receipt to establish a presumption of delivery if the IRS has no record of ever having received the document in question. This policy not only is consistent with section 7502(c) but also provides taxpayers with certainty that, under the Code, a certified or registered mail receipt will establish prima facie evidence of delivery. Accordingly, the proposed regulations merely clarify and confirm current IRS practice under the existing regulations. These proposed regulations provide that the final regulations, to which these proposed regulations relate, will be effective for all documents mailed after the publication date of these proposed regulations. "

Yep..... I know... I was being cheap with the companies money... had something like 11 returns to file... and never had problems before...

But, I do wonder what date would have been used... the company had their own stamp machine and we did all registrations in house... then took them to the post office and just dropped them off... so if the post office screwed up and delayed it a day.... still in the same situation...

I was able to show that we did purchase all postage on the same day... which is why I think they finally let it go...
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Old 07-22-2015, 07:56 PM   #31
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Yep..... I know... I was being cheap with the companies money... had something like 11 returns to file... and never had problems before...

But, I do wonder what date would have been used... the company had their own stamp machine and we did all registrations in house... then took them to the post office and just dropped them off... so if the post office screwed up and delayed it a day.... still in the same situation...

I was able to show that we did purchase all postage on the same day... which is why I think they finally let it go...
The certified mail reciept has a date stamped on it when the postage is calculated. That is the date used if mailed at the post office. Does your stamp machine do certified mail?
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Old 07-22-2015, 08:03 PM   #32
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Yep..... I know... I was being cheap with the companies money... had something like 11 returns to file... and never had problems before...

But, I do wonder what date would have been used... the company had their own stamp machine and we did all registrations in house... then took them to the post office and just dropped them off... so if the post office screwed up and delayed it a day.... still in the same situation...

I was able to show that we did purchase all postage on the same day... which is why I think they finally let it go...
That assumes the entire issue was not one of computer defects. I got an inside peak of how messed up the IRS's technology was around 2004. I have no confidence they can add 2+2 together and consistently come up with a correct answer. Maybe the mass mailing was at least partially incorrect.
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Old 07-23-2015, 07:57 AM   #33
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This is the sort of thing that turns people into libertarians/tea party/ffar right gubmint haters.
It is easy to see your point, however the irony is that the underfunding of the IRS, often by politicos associated with these groups, has contributed directly to these customer service issues IMHO.
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Old 07-23-2015, 08:07 AM   #34
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Why don't we steer away from the partisan comments, as they never end well.
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Old 07-23-2015, 08:38 AM   #35
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The certified mail reciept has a date stamped on it when the postage is calculated. That is the date used if mailed at the post office. Does your stamp machine do certified mail?
I did not do them... but from what I saw all we did was put the certified mail sticker (or whatever you want to call it) on the envelope and then have the machine print out the proper postage... since they were larger envelopes with varying weights the postage was specific to the envelope...

I did not see the meter print anything on the certified thing we attached..


BTW, I did not send them certified which is where the problem comes in.....
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Old 07-23-2015, 09:16 AM   #36
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After an hour on hold I finally got an agent who confirmed everything is correctly filed. He said that essentially what happened is that the mountain of returns they get in mid April takes a while to process and the letter was generated before they got around to processing my return. Great way to showcase organizational dysfunction and bureaucratic waste, guys. The agent I dealt with could not have been more polite, though.
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Old 07-23-2015, 10:52 AM   #37
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After an hour on hold I finally got an agent who confirmed everything is correctly filed. He said that essentially what happened is that the mountain of returns they get in mid April takes a while to process and the letter was generated before they got around to processing my return. Great way to showcase organizational dysfunction and bureaucratic waste, guys. The agent I dealt with could not have been more polite, though.
This sounds exactly like the BCBS snafu we ran into last fall. Own small business with 2 couples covered. BCBS for 30 plus years just changed plans and signed to continue the auto-pay. This is in late November...get the coverage cards. Late December threatening letters, we haven't gotten your payment and your coverage may be cancelled. We call our agent and offer a paper check, she says no that will goof up the system. Get 3 more letters each more threatening then the last, before the middle of Feb,
keep calling our agent and she says don't worry you are covered....Feb 15 they take 3 months worth of payments. Third week in Feb they sent a letter that says, we are behind on processing our auto-payments and please ignore any letters saying you are behind in payments. I can't imagine the money and time that got wasted with this scenario So it seems health insurance coverage is causing lots of backlogs in the system.
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Old 07-24-2015, 07:53 AM   #38
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I glean from this valuable and important string(thank you OP for starting this), that one way to prevent fraudsters from claiming fraudulent refunds is to file with the irs to view one's old transcripts because doing so prevents others from registering in your name. It also seems to imply that that function(registering to view) is currently unavailable. Does anyone know if this is a temporary situation or permanent as the IRS is addressing the reality that the system has inadvertently allowed fraudulent returns to be filed? My second question relates to a situation we have. Our accountant files our returns on our behalf and has done so for years. Would my signing up to view our transcripts prevent our accountant from filing our returns in the future?
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Old 07-24-2015, 11:50 AM   #39
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I glean from this valuable and important string(thank you OP for starting this), that one way to prevent fraudsters from claiming fraudulent refunds is to file with the irs to view one's old transcripts because doing so prevents others from registering in your name. It also seems to imply that that function(registering to view) is currently unavailable. Does anyone know if this is a temporary situation or permanent as the IRS is addressing the reality that the system has inadvertently allowed fraudulent returns to be filed? My second question relates to a situation we have. Our accountant files our returns on our behalf and has done so for years. Would my signing up to view our transcripts prevent our accountant from filing our returns in the future?
Good questions, I too was wondering about your first question.
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:45 PM   #40
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It's really annoying that the online get transcript service has become unavailable. Wonder how long this will last? At least they don't say it's permanently gone, but it would be nice to know if it's going to be down for months:
Get Transcript

I don't think someone else filing will affect your ability to see your transcript. This is totally separate from the eFiling system.
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