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Old 02-07-2014, 11:58 AM   #101
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But the taste improves after a glass or two...
Sure does . I often debate what to do with wine that has gone bad. Drinking it after getting drunk is one option. Another option is to mix with vitamin drink and chuck it down . The last option is to throw it away. But recently, I've replaced my wine vacuum stopper and stopped throwing out bad wine. Now, I don't waste a drop of wine.
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Old 02-08-2014, 08:27 AM   #102
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We find that fine wines are more prone to getting corked because they sit on the retailers shelf for too long here in Mexico.

Never had a corked wine when I buy the case from Costco! Just need to aerate it before drinking.
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Old 02-10-2014, 08:34 PM   #103
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I think it's important to know your own tastes/palate - for example, when I lived in Europe, there were different regions which had different tasting wines...you could go dry or sweet - also, you can compare wines grown in Europe and the US - I find CA wines tend to be sweeter and fruitier than many comparable wines in Europe - I prefer a more sour or dry wine.

As for the more expensive wines, if you have a bottle of a $100 + wine, the difference between that and two buck chuck is amazing....

However, do not be afraid to send back something you don't like. I remember being in a restaurant San Francisco and they had ordered a Pinot Noir that was a medal winner and about $250 - I smelled it and it smelled moldy to me - I did not like it and wouldn't drink it. My table mates thought I was crazy (except for one) and drank it. I didn't care. If it doesn't taste good to me, I don't want it.

I've had some amazing nice wines in Europe - Slovenia, Croatia, France, Italy and Portugal - loved them. Also, had some great wines in Chile. I find US wines overpriced and mixed to taste like candy....I guess I've trained my palate away from that.
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Old 02-10-2014, 08:48 PM   #104
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I think it's important to know your own tastes/palate - for example, when I lived in Europe, there were different regions which had different tasting wines...you could go dry or sweet - also, you can compare wines grown in Europe and the US - I find CA wines tend to be sweeter and fruitier than many comparable wines in Europe - I prefer a more sour or dry wine.

As for the more expensive wines, if you have a bottle of a $100 + wine, the difference between that and two buck chuck is amazing....

However, do not be afraid to send back something you don't like. I remember being in a restaurant San Francisco and they had ordered a Pinot Noir that was a medal winner and about $250 - I smelled it and it smelled moldy to me - I did not like it and wouldn't drink it. My table mates thought I was crazy (except for one) and drank it. I didn't care. If it doesn't taste good to me, I don't want it.

I've had some amazing nice wines in Europe - Slovenia, Croatia, France, Italy and Portugal - loved them. Also, had some great wines in Chile. I find US wines overpriced and mixed to taste like candy....I guess I've trained my palate away from that.
We also don't drink many California wines, or French wines. Generally, we enjoy wines from Spain, Portugal, Italy, Chile and New Zealand (esp. Sauvignon Blanc). The only California wines we drink are Chards and Zins.
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Old 02-10-2014, 09:28 PM   #105
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Red wine is my beverage of choice. I can easily tell a really cheap/young wine from a from a more expensive/mature one. While I can drink cheap wine, I find I tend to guzzle it more to get past the taste, so it ends up being a false economy. Fortunately for me, my happy point sits around the $7-15 and 2- 5 year vintage mark, beyond which I can barely discern the improvement, so I stick to that band and sip slowly to savour the taste
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:09 PM   #106
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If you see this movie, they all pretty much taste similar, because wine consultants are helping wineries all over the world set up the same processes.

Mondovino (2004)
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Old 02-11-2014, 12:01 PM   #107
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Back to the "is it BS" and off to my territory (beer, not wine)...

I went to an off-flavor beer tasting event last night (aka sensory training event). It was amazing how some people reacted to the "spiked" samples. There was one spike where there was a consensus (it was horrible), other spikes had a range of reactions from 'nothing wrong' to 'where is the dump bucket?' These were supposed to be at 3x perceptable levels.

Basic Sensory Training Kit
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Old 02-11-2014, 01:00 PM   #108
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These were supposed to be at 3x perceptable levels.
Yes, but those would be "average" levels.

The threshold of perception for almost any substance varies between people a lot more than most folks think.
For example, I'm extremely sensitive to diacetyl, but not too sensitive to DMS (both common off-flavors in beer). I have friends who are the reverse, and others who are right in between.
Also, some people are simply "flavor-blind" to certain substances.

That kind of sensory training is always interesting, though.
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Old 02-11-2014, 01:49 PM   #109
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Back to the "is it BS" and off to my territory (beer, not wine)...

I went to an off-flavor beer tasting event last night (aka sensory training event). It was amazing how some people reacted to the "spiked" samples. There was one spike where there was a consensus (it was horrible), other spikes had a range of reactions from 'nothing wrong' to 'where is the dump bucket?' These were supposed to be at 3x perceptable levels.

Basic Sensory Training Kit
Our brewing club has discussed buying the kit and doing a few sessions with it to educate ourselves to these various flaws. But it's a little hard to get exited about spending $250 to drink bad beer, when there is so much good beer that our members bring to meetings!

Looking at the list, I do think we have come across all those off-flavors over the years when members bring in a beer asking for help in identifying a flaw. I had to google "Trans-2-nonenal" - but yes, I've tasted that cardboard taste in oxidized beers.

It's certainly true that individuals have way different thresholds for these flavors. Since I don't entry many comps, and mainly brew for my own tastes, I'm pragmatic and say "If an off-flavor exists, and I can't taste it, does it make a sound in a forest?".

One of the BJCPs (edit - I see I cross posted with braumeister, it's not him, but he might know him) is super sensitive to Diacetyl (buttery flavor, thrown off by yeast under some conditions). But I typically don't taste small amounts of it in beer, and since a small amount is considered appropriate in some styles, I just smile and say "Yeah, I wasn't brewing this to style, so I was going for a little buttery note in this beer". He knows I'm kidding.

-ERD50
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:48 PM   #110
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That trans-2-nonenal was the one everyone could taste...this spike smelled like you were deep in the oldest stacks of an old library...not my description, but it was dead-on. I've never tasted an oxydized beer nearly that bad, hehe.

I'm not hypersensitive to diacetyl, but do pick it up some. The DMS spike didn't taste much like the 'naturally occuring' DMS to me (more cream corn than corn chip, which is what I find 'in the wild'). And some of the other spikes also seemed not to match real-world off-flavors. So yeah, I'm not sure spending $250+$40 shipping! is worth it. This tasting was bankrolled by one guy who is holding 3 sessions, getting the light lager base donated, and charging $10. So if he gets 10 people at each event, he's even.
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Old 02-15-2014, 10:21 PM   #111
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I know what I like and what the 'experts' like. Sometimes they coincide.

I like big reds. Back in the early '80s bought 2 cases of Cab from Cilurzo winery in Temecula. Drank one bottle a month, usually with guests for dinner. Before one meal I noticed this bottle was better than last months. Next month was better still. It became the best Cab I'd ever tasted.

A few months later we were wine tasting in Temecula. Mr Cilurzo was in, as usual. Told him what had happened to my wine, asked it others had similar experiences. He said yes, with a satisfied smile. Then he said he has standing offers to buy any bottles he can find. I said if I was unemployed I'd consider it, but I'd rather finish the wine. Then I asked if anyone had sold their bottles. 'No one.' he replied.
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Old 02-15-2014, 10:22 PM   #112
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Red wine, aspirin and cancer:

More evidence that red wine and aspirin protect against cancer | Ars Technica
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Old 02-23-2014, 02:20 PM   #113
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I've gone on wine tours in France and Italy and I have friends and relatives near different California wine regions. In my East Dallas/Lakewood neighborhood there is an actual winery, several wine bars, specialty wine stores and numerous high-end grocery options. I prefer drier wines and i have some faves but it really comes down to ok, good, nice, wow or yuck/gross. Here's a good chart: http://winefolly.com/wp-content/uplo...3.png#fullsize
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