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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-17-2007, 07:06 PM   #21
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-17-2007, 09:17 PM   #22
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

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Ugh, now I know why Nords ERd! Maybe being out in the Pacific though kept him from needing to go into too many shallow ports...
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-17-2007, 10:13 PM   #23
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

In the last month there have been two deaths caused by a person smoking while on oxygen. (Dayton OH)
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-18-2007, 01:25 PM   #24
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nords
Imagine the second-hand smoke potential of a submarine. Now imagine some of the world's most expensive & sensitive computers living in an environment filled with cigarette smoke.
On a vaguely-related note, I recall hearing, after smoking was mostly banned on
commercial airliners, that mechanics had mixed feelings about the whol thing.

Apparently smoking made it way easier to find hairline cracks in the pressure
envelope, as they'd have a nasty brown scum marking them. But on the
other hand, changing the cabin air filters became a lot less unpleasant and
unhealthy.

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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-18-2007, 01:57 PM   #25
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

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Originally Posted by ESRBob
I don't remember Nords ever telling us about this aspect of sub life. Hadn't though about it, but boat life above water has the constant benefit of fresh air. Now I'm thinking submariners are underpaid. Maybe the diesel issue is less today in nuclear-powered subs? Also do subs get rocked around like boat/ships by underwater currents or is it a significantly smoother ride down there? I know a little diesel smell goes a long way in a rough seaway...
Ooooh yeah, and ironically the group of guys responsible for the atmosphere-control equipment is also in charge of the toilets, the sanitary tanks, miscellaneous hydraulics & air compressors, the oxygen generator, and (on attack subs) the diesel. So when Auxiliary Division is having a bad day the whole crew suffers.

My "favorite" smell is the monoethanolamine, a nasty poisonous chemical that absorbs CO2 for extraction & discharge. It gives the entire boat that ambiance de je ne sais quoi... a truly indescribably smell between rotting fish and an oil spill. When I wore my uniform home I was required to disrobe in the garage.

A submarine diesel engine is about eight feet tall, six feet thick, and 20 feet long. I've forgotten (finally!) its horsepower but it typically powers an 850KW generator. The diesel always oozes fuel somewhere, even when it's secured, and I think Aux Div rolls in it when nobody's watching. The process of starting up, running, & securing the diesel without sending the submarine to the bottom is intricate enough to require practicing at least twice a week for a couple hours, so the smell of diesel fuel & exhaust never leaves. When you hear the "Reactor scram!" announcement and see a bunch of electronics techs standing around a scram breaker scratching their heads, it sure feels good to hear the diesel rumble to life and start crushing rocks until your skull vibrates. It sucks a lotta air through the boat, too, so everthing smells of fresh surf until the OOD inadvertently turns downwind.

The vast majority of submariners, me included, are notoriously poor sailors. A typical day on a sailboat, frigate, or destroyer would send submariners puking into port begging for mercy. The propulsion train's reduction gears are only warranteed for a 35-degree angle and the inertial navigators used to be limited to 40-degree rolls. 22 years ago I took a 42-degree roll, doing a pullup on the periscope handles, and thought the boat would never right itself. Boomers on patrol stay at such constant angles that the crew can distinguish the difference of half a degree, and a five-degree bubble sends everybody scrambling for their coffeecups.

Violent North Atlantic winter storms will cause 10-degree rolls at 400 feet, but they're generally undetectable at 600 feet!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ESRBob
Ugh, now I know why Nords ERd! Maybe being out in the Pacific though kept him from needing to go into too many shallow ports...
The continental shelf sucks, but out in the Pacific we'd rig for dive pierside, cast off the lines, and spend 30 minutes getting down the channel. When we cast off the tug we had a 10-minute scramble to finish the last of the topside rigging and lock the hatch before the OOD would reach the dive point. A mile off the beach the sounding would hit 2000 fathoms.

In the late '80s/early '90s it wasn't unusual for the bridge watchstanders (inside the cockpit) to be wearing aloha shorts & slippers below their proper military khaki shirts. But some senior staff weenie officer probably thought that was unprofessional and brought that good deal to an end...
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-18-2007, 03:48 PM   #26
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

So now I'm thinking more about subs -- howintheheck do you vent exhaust from a diesel? I can't believe you guys breathe the stuff outright. Is there some way to scrub it or get it out into the wet? For that matter, how long can you run on the same stale air before you have to come up for refreshers? I realize I never thought much about subs, and since I'm retired, why not now?
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-18-2007, 04:19 PM   #27
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nords
My "favorite" smell is the monoethanolamine, a nasty poisonous chemical that absorbs CO2 for extraction & discharge. It gives the entire boat that ambiance de je ne sais quoi... a truly indescribably smell between rotting fish and an oil spill. When I wore my uniform home I was required to disrobe in the garage.
Geez, Nords, this sounds positively toxic. Is it even legal?
No wonder you couldn't wait to ER!
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-18-2007, 04:27 PM   #28
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

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Originally Posted by Meadbh
Geez, Nords, this sounds positively toxic. Is it even legal?
No wonder you couldn't wait to ER!
BUMED says it's all well with NAVOSH & OSHA limits. The atmosphere gases & contaminants are all tracked & logged to remain with specifications.

Whatever that means.

311 mrem lifetime exposure to ionizing radiation from nuclear reactors is far less than my father & brother get in the Colorado Rockies from cosmic rays.

According to one study, the acute volcanic ash fallout I inhaled during the Mt. Pinatubo eruption is more dangerous than anything I've breathed on a submarine.

Having said that, during the USS NAUTILUS' trip under the North Pole in the 1950s, there was no standard for hydrochloric acid in the atmosphere and I don't think anyone was tracking it. When the crew returned from the voyage and had lost all their dental fillings to acidic corrosion, however, it gained attention. BUMED is always tinkering with the limits for various atmosphere contaminants.

Like TH says, someday we'll learn that all the broccoli I've eaten on active duty was more poisonous than anything else... and then there's all the fresh-baked doughnuts & bread and deep-fried meats...
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-24-2007, 11:42 AM   #29
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

Sorry to hear about your brother. I lost my brother to lung cancer at 45 in 2001. A dear friend of mine (we worked together from 1980 until she retired 12/31/04) just sent an email stating that a mass was found in both of her DH's lungs and the doctor is pretty sure that it is cancerous. He is 63 and has smoked since he was 13 yrs old. My 28 yr old son states that he smokes socially. I can't believe that he smokes at all.

I smoked from 1971 until the end of 1985. I can't believe that I was ever that stupid! It is hard to quit and I personally think that quitting cold turkey is best. My DH went through a program at WVU for approx 1 yr with meds and quit, then started again and finally quit again without meds this time. I hope and pray that he does not start again. He has gained so much weight though, which I worry about from the health standpoint. I keep wondering if I could have a slow growing tumor growing in my lungs, that has not caused a problem yet. I would like to get tested, but I don't think insurance would cover it and it would be expensive.

We toured the USS Bowfin when we were in Hawaii and I don't think that I could hack the submarine life. I know very little about submarines, but maybe they are bigger now. I still could not do it.
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers
Old 01-24-2007, 04:51 PM   #30
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Re: Kick that habit - especially you young dreamers

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Originally Posted by Nords
Like TH says, someday we'll learn that all the broccoli I've eaten on active duty was more poisonous than anything else... and then there's all the fresh-baked doughnuts & bread and deep-fried meats...
Yep, people who ate donuts while smoking will be proven to live 10 years longer than broccoli eaters, who will all expire due to complications of eating stuff that tastes like crap.

My high school was built the year before the big asbestos limitations went into effect and the whole place was packed with the stuff. The whole time I went there we had people sitting in the hallways monitoring little measuring pods that looked like canister vacuums without the hose.

It wasnt much comfort then, as it isnt these days, that our asbestos fiber inhalation rates were 'within state guidelines', considering this is from the same folks that considered ketchup a vegetable when included in a similar era school lunch...
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