Need help: Not sure whether to start medicine on lowering cholesterol level

[Lsbcal]

Tot chol of 7.7 mmol/l is 297.29 mg/dl
HDL-chol of 1.8 = 69.498
Direct LDL-Chol of 5.3 =204.633
Chol/HDL ratio at 4.2 = 162.162
...

I am no expert but these numbers do not appear worrisome. From the site below the total cholesterol is just on boundary between desirable and borderline high. FWIW, my total cholesterol is about the same and the doc is OK with it.

Cholesterol levels: What numbers should you aim for? - Mayo Clinic

 

[inquisitive]

Those numbers are extremely high. If LDL should be less than 70 and total less than 200, then a total of 300 and LDL of >200? I wonder if there is a strong genetic component, did your parents have high cholesterol? But your HDL is very high which is good. I have been wanting to raise my HDL, will have to start exercising and drink alcohol sporadically. What do you attribute the high HDL to? I think mine was under 40.

From what I've read of the diet I mentioned above, everyone had dramatic improvements in their cholesterol values by changing diet along with exercise. So I think it should be possible to improve based on lifestyle changes. Someone above gave themselves x time to do it and then had the values rechecked, I think it's a good approach if there aren't pressing issues.

 

[Lsbcal]

Maybe I interpretted the numbers incorrectly? I thought that "Direct LDL-Chol of 5.3 =204" was Total Cholesterol but maybe it is only LDL?

 

[Moscyn]

Yes, my LDL is very high. It came down a bit after some lifestyle changes of 6 months and went up again 4 months later - I think the numbers were messed up by prolonged flu medication including a course of antibiotics. I am giving myself another 6 months for my next test. My HDL is high likely due to fish oil and exercise but it has always been high just as my LDL has always been high for many many years. I have 2 doctors (textbook style - don't even look at any other numbers other than my LDL) insisting to put me on lowering chol medication, another one asking me to seriously consider taking meds and one who told me to make further lifestyle changes. I've had these numbers for the past 9 years. Never worried much about them until now as I move into my mid fifties. Someone in this thread asked whether lowering chol has any definite positive impact to health. I guess I don't know the answer to that but like most doctors tell me a higher than normal range is a red flag.


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[harley]

Remember that half the people who show up at the emergency room with heart attacks have high cholesterol and half have low cholesterol.

Do you have a reference to back that up? I'd be curious to see it.

Maybe I interpretted the numbers incorrectly? I thought that "Direct LDL-Chol of 5.3 =204" was Total Cholesterol but maybe it is only LDL?

Total Cholesterol was 297. Definitely high. But I think the HDL/LDL ratio of 4.2 is wrong. Isn't it 204/69? Basically 3/1? Still high, but not horrible. I've read in many places that a high HDL number is much more important to heart health than a low LD number.

 

[2soon2tell]

I am one who cannot tolerate statins because of liver or muscle problems. I can take Zetia which lowers cholesterol by slowing its absorption in the intestine.

Another thing I take is 500 mg of flush free niacin twice a day. This lowers my total chol and has raised my HDL chol.

 

[rbmrtn]

Do you have a reference to back that up? I'd be curious to see it.

I had it was closer to 75%, Most heart attack patients' cholesterol levels did not indicate cardiac risk | UCLA

 

[Lsbcal]

... I've had these numbers for the past 9 years. Never worried much about them until now as I move into my mid fifties. Someone in this thread asked whether lowering chol has any definite positive impact to health. I guess I don't know the answer to that but like most doctors tell me a higher than normal range is a red flag.
...

I do not have any strong viewpoint on this stuff. But I wonder how long an individual doctor studies this kind of issue before selecting their viewpoint? I'm not critical at all of the docs and would respect their views. I'd ask them to point me to some references I could read. Some docs will be amenable to this approach I imagine and others would perhaps feel we are second guessing them.

At any rate if I had high numbers I could not bring down over time, I'd want to have studied this issue by sourcing "reputable" articles. It's important to get good quality source material to make the best choice for oneself.

 

[mountaintosea]

Just my two cents, but doc tried to put me on statins. So far I've resisted. My advice from my mother was don't do it. She was on them until her 80s. She was having muscle problems, cramps etc. She told the doc that she is in her 80s and she's going to quit. She will be 90 this January. Her cholesterol had been in the 300s. Mine was about 211. My triglycerides are around 50, HDL 60s and LDL around 140. Obviously they didn't like the LDL.

 

[braumeister]

I had it was closer to 75%, Most*heart attack patients' cholesterol levels did not indicate cardiac risk | UCLA

That's a good reference. You probably won't find many published studies like this, because it goes against the conventional wisdom. My oft-repeated point is that there is simply no valid evidence that high total cholesterol (or high LDL) has any bearing on your heart attack risk. High HDL seems to be helpful, as does low triglycerides, but that's about it.

As one of my favorite writers on the topic says:

cholesterol will remain the mass murderer for as long as statins are as lucrative as they are or until the public are enlightened and courageous enough to say no to doctors who try to put them on this medication

Cholesterol & heart disease – there is a relationship, but it's not what you think

 

[RonBoyd]

Why You Should Check Your Heart Rate Variability | Mark's Daily Apple

People are always looking for that one biomarker to rule them all, the number on a paper that absolutely determines your health, longevity, fitness level, sex appeal, happiness, and productivity. Throughout the years, it’s bounced around as researchers think they’ve found “IT” – from cholesterol to LDL to BMI to small dense LDL to CRP to blood pressure to pulse rate and back again – but we always come up wanting. The “one biomarker” never pans out because biology is complex and irreducible to a single number.

However, there is one biomarker showing promise as a broad indicator of overall health and fitness: heart rate variability (HRV), or the variation in the intervals between heart beats. If your heart beats like a metronome, with intervals of identical length between each pulse, you have low heart rate variability; this is “bad.” If your heart beats follow a more fractal pattern, with beat intervals of varying length, you have high heart rate variability; this is “good.”

 

[RonBoyd]

Silence was the stern reply | Dr. Malcolm Kendrick

... here is the letter. It is typical of many hundreds that I receive from people suffering severe and significant statin related adverse effects. In virtually every case their doctor has dismissed the adverse effects as even existing.

When, rarely, their doctor has accepted they are having adverse effects they have NEVER, according to those who write to me, made any attempt to inform the authorities that their patient has suffered a statin related adverse effect. Medwatch in the US, the Yellow Card system in the UK…

 

[RonBoyd]

Statins: The Good, the Bad, and the Unknown

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/832841?src=wnl_edit_specol&uac=2356AT

The driver for his article was a recent experience in which he treated a patient's myalgia and arthralgia by discontinuing her statin. Dr Mandrola had no qualms about stopping the statin, citing a lack of data supporting a significant benefit for these drugs in primary prevention.

The commentary generated more than 600 responses from Medscape readers, a substantial majority of whom agreed with his viewpoint.

 

[harley]

We need your password to read the article.

Probably wouldn't hurt to include your SSN and your mother's maiden name. Thanks.

 

[RonBoyd]

We need your password to read the article.

Probably wouldn't hurt to include your SSN and your mother's maiden name. Thanks.

<chuckle> I didn't realize I was a member... who would have me?

Anyway, registration is quite simple -- not much more than name, password, zip code, a valid e-mail address, and your profession (I may have fudged on that, I don't remember).

In any event, the website is pretty benign.

 

[Free_at_49]

My cholesterol has been the same since I was a teenager, 200-220 with an occasional spike to 240.

There is a new test -- "Calcium Scoring", measures artery blockage. My result was zero (0), basically I have the "arterial age" of a 30-yr old . So by itself, cholesterol is not a disease. After 60 years it has caused no blockage, YMMV. My doctor is no longer recommending statins.

Also I've noticed an inverse relationship between cholesterol and vitamin D3. Thoughts?

 

[Moscyn]

There is a new test -- "Calcium Scoring", measures artery blockage. My result was zero (0), basically I have the "arterial age" of a 30-yr old . So by itself, cholesterol is not a disease. After 60 years it has caused no blockage, YMMV. My doctor is no longer recommending statins.

Also I've noticed an inverse relationship between cholesterol and vitamin D3. Thoughts?

I've not heard of the Calcium Scoring test and will read up on it. Not heard about the vit D3 relationship too but my gynae put me on daily Vit D3 since 15 years ago. Been taking everyday - does not seem to improve my cholesterol numbers.


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[RonBoyd]

... but my gynae put me on daily Vit D3 since 15 years ago. ...

Why did she prescribe this? I was under the impression that the only Vitamin D the body can use is that made by itself from sunlight -- that Vit. D from (for instance) pill form is simply passed through..

 

[Moscyn]

He prescribed this tog with daily calcium tablets after I had a hysterectomy. I believe it is good move as I was having a stressful working life which didn't give me many hours to cook, exercise and get outdoor life.


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[d0ug]

The story about cholesterol the American Heart Association started saying saturated fat was bad and unsaturated fat was good this was done without any study only a gift of 1.7 million dollars from Proctor and Gamble this was exposed this year. The only study they quote was a study done by Dr. Keys who choose 9 country study and ignored other countries that proved the study was fraudulent.. Like the native Eskimos who eat nothing but saturated fat and are legendary for no heart problems or cancer.

A study published in the Annals of Internal Medicine found that participants who consumed high-fat dairy products, such as whole milk, butter, and cheddar cheese, had about a 60 percent lower risk of developing adult-onset diabetes than those who opted for skim milk and fat-free yogurt.

I think it is not so much that the medical system has been telling us the lies, as that they were also deceived by the proclamations issued by the large manufacturing companies, defending their products.
Crisco started out as grease for machinery, when the proper petroleum-based grease was not available, due to the use of it during the war. So, they figured out how to hydrogenate vegetable oil into what we now call shortening, and they used that for mechanical grease.
After the war, there were whole plants set up to process the vegetable oil, so they tried using it for cooking, renamed it "Crisco", and told the world that it was much healthier than butter, since it was made from pure vegetable oil.

Just one example of where big business has influenced the medical profession to back up their story, and help sell the product. Some probably knew the truth; but since most modern doctors actually study very little about nutrition, most of them probably just followed along with popular opinion.

There is more and more doctors now speaking out about this scam.

 

[RonBoyd]

... where big business has influenced the medical profession to back up their story, and help sell the product.

And none bigger than the USDA, which is leading that charge.

 

[Moscyn]

Anyone tried Red Yeast Rice tablets or Weider Red Mold Rice tablets? Someone recommended me to try as alternative to statins but from my internet research, Red Mold Rice supplement in form of tablets also have side effects. Any comments appreciated.


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[cantlogin]

"Any comments"?

Well, I think that looking for a magic bullet isn't the most likely route to success.
Adding things to one's diet is more attractive than removing some, but removing carbohydrates does have an effect.

That's my comment.

 

[d0ug]

Just through out your statins there has been a scam on cholesterol for years and finally exposed this year.
http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303678404579533760760481486
There is no diseased caused by high cholesterol that is a myth and natural cholesterol should be 220-270 if it is higher than that it means your body is making it to save your life from artery damage from free radicals

 

[paul2102]

I am 62, have been taking red rice yeast for years, no red meat, no trans fats. No family history under 60 years old, blood pressure fine, non smoker, very little alcohol, not overweight, and very active. Chol. between 200 and 230.
Everyone I know that is my age or older is taking statins. They eat everything and are doing fine.
I just had a heart attack and had to have 3 stents. Now, I am taking statins.
At this point, I would say, listen to your Dr. and take your statins!


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