Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Next they'll be recommending bed rest
Old 06-04-2012, 11:34 AM   #1
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,387
Next they'll be recommending bed rest

Ultra Marathons Might Be Ultra Bad for your Heart - Yahoo! News

According to an unattributed source, ideal amount of endurance exercise may be much less than we might have thought.

Ha
__________________

__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 06-04-2012, 11:52 AM   #2
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DFW_M5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,982
And how many times will they swing back and forth on subjects like this based on the latest study du jour
__________________

__________________
DFW_M5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 11:56 AM   #3
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
braumeister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Northern Kentucky
Posts: 8,630
I don't doubt the results of the Mayo Clinic study; they're generally reliable.
But I'm pretty confident it's only part of the story.

For example,
Quote:
... many of these athletes had temporarily elevated levels of substances that promote inflammation and cardiac damage.
I would think that closely following those readings, they showed similarly elevated levels of substances that repair that damage, probably lasting long enough to produce a net positive effect.

Personally, my marathoning days are over, but I still do at least a couple of half marathons per year, and I'm not likely to quit until I can't hack it any more, in which case I'll simply downgrade again and do more 10-Ks. The more exercise the better, in my book.
__________________
Pas de lieu Rhône que nous.
braumeister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 11:57 AM   #4
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,387
Quote:
Originally Posted by DFW_M5 View Post
And how many times will they swing back and forth on subjects like this based on the latest study du jour
Just like the dietary fat thing- she loves me, she loves me not, she loves me...

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 12:18 PM   #5
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 11,983
Stands to reason there's a limit at which 'too much of a good thing' becomes a factor. I can certainly believe excessive ultra marathoning (oxymoron?) could take a toll on the body and do more harm than good at some level. It's not new either, I remember Dr Ken Cooper (prominent at the time) in the 80's promoting "if you run further than 15 miles a week, you're doing it for reasons other than fitness."

From 1987
Quote:
Too many widows wrote and told me about so and so who followed my guidelines but had a heart attack. So I've broadened the fitness concept to make it one of moderation and balance. There are six components of wellness: proper weight and diet, proper exercise, breaking the smoking habit, control of alcohol, stress management and periodic exams.

Second, you can run a good thing into the ground. I used to think that it didn't make any difference how far you ran if you had a good, strong musculoskeletal system and no underlying cardiovascular problems. Run ultramarathons if you want. Now I say that if you run more than 15 miles a week, it's for something other than aerobic fitness. Once you pass 15 miles, you do not see much further improvement. It takes a tripling of the number of miles to get any minimal improvement in oxygen consumption. And there's an exponential increase in injuries. So, again, moderation and balance. Once you get to 15 miles, you're at the 95th percentile level; you've got only 5 percent of potential left.
AN INTERVIEW WITH KENNETH COOPER - New York Times
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 12:21 PM   #6
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
TromboneAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 11,201
This goes along with the Body by Science ideas, and even puts aside stress injuries.

When I get back from a 6 hour bike ride, and feel all beat up, I always think "I sure hope this isn't bad for me." But the intensity is so much less than that of a run.

My current thinking:

Daily running of 30 minutes or more is not a great idea (I used to think it was).
Interval training is very good.
Walking-level intensity is good (I used to think it wasn't).
Weight training good.
Rest days (or just walk days) are good.

Quote:
Just like the dietary fat thing- she loves me, she loves me not, she loves me...
For me it's: She loves me, I love her, she loves me, I love her...
__________________
TromboneAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 12:22 PM   #7
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
TromboneAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 11,201
I remember someone telling me that these Olympic-level athletes are not healthy people. They have gone way beyond the most effective dose.
__________________
TromboneAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 03:21 PM   #8
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
donheff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 8,649
I like recommendations that I like, like this one. The "good" ones fit my couch potato bias -- do some sprints and intense lifting for fitness and then just ride the bike for fun. Twenty minutes on the intense stuff works for me.
__________________
Every man is, or hopes to be, an Idler. -- Samuel Johnson
donheff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 03:31 PM   #9
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
grasshopper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,671
I run my daily 5k for the fun of it, take a couple of fat dogs with me and chase some jackrabbits and javelina's. I do find it to be the best way to keep the lbs off and the fitness level up.
__________________
For me experiences are not good or bad, just different
grasshopper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 03:56 PM   #10
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,104
Hmmmm. Will have to send link to DS who just did Comrades marathon in South Africa yesterday....56 miles! I did one regular ten years ago, box checked, no more thanks.
__________________
H2ODude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 07:14 PM   #11
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Amethyst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 5,900
No doubt ultra-exercise is another one of those things where one's DNA [not to mention youth] makes a difference. Some folks are just born to be better athletes.

For most of us, moderate regular exercise seems to be good medicine.

Amethyst
__________________
If you understood everything I say, you'd be me ~ Miles Davis
'There is only one success – to be able to spend your life in your own way.’ Christopher Morley.
Amethyst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 09:39 PM   #12
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,201
Hmm, my first instinct is to dismiss this as crap, but I've heard before the safest thing is to train for a marathon but not run it. The training tends not to be at the same level as the race.

The problem I have is that if I don't run, I put on weight, and I just don't feel as good. I could find another activity or watch my diet better, but it's easiest to do something I enjoy and can stick with, and that's running. Right now I can't run because of a knee injury and I'm putting weight on. I am lifting weights and my PT has me doing something 1-3 hours a day, but it's still creeping up. So once I'm cleared to run again, I'll be getting back into marathons and ultras. Any risk from doing that is countered by the risks of losing the weight battle.

And for me, it can't just be the 20 miles a week as suggested in the article. I used to be a 10-20 mile/week runner, and I was putting on a pound or two per year. When I started marathon training and going to 40 or more, weight came off. A couple years ago I increased it to 55-60, and got down to my high school weight, and felt great. Which doesn't mean much if I've got hidden heart disease, but means a whole lot if I don't.

Another side to this is that many ultra runners have an addictive personality. I don't know the numbers vs. the general population, but I know of some recovered alcoholics and drug addicts who have replaced one addiction with a healthier one. And there are people like me who managed never to get addicted to anything too harmful, but the running addiction may have helped avoid it.
__________________
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2012, 10:00 PM   #13
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
TromboneAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 11,201
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunningBum
I used to be a 10-20 mile/week runner, and I was putting on a pound or two per year. When I started marathon training and going to 40 or more, weight came off. A couple years ago I increased it to 55-60, and got down to my high school weight, and felt great. .
Are you sure you didn't make any other changes? That is, when the weight came on, did you start running more and also, for example, cut down on desserts?
__________________
Al
TromboneAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2012, 12:24 AM   #14
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
clifp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,451
I former coach/friend of mine has done two duo-deca triathlons that is 20x ironmans over a roughly 2 week period. The crazy guy has now signed up for 30x ironman 72 miles of swimming, 3300+ miles of biking and 786 miles of running over a month.

He is 53 and is pretty much certifiably crazy.
__________________
clifp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2012, 01:54 AM   #15
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,387
Quote:
Originally Posted by clifp View Post
I former coach/friend of mine has done two duo-deca triathlons that is 20x ironmans over a roughly 2 week period. The crazy guy has now signed up for 30x ironman 72 miles of swimming, 3300+ miles of biking and 786 miles of running over a month.

He is 53 and is pretty much certifiably crazy.
He must have been fun as a coach.
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2012, 06:41 AM   #16
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,201
Quote:
Originally Posted by TromboneAl View Post
Are you sure you didn't make any other changes? That is, when the weight came on, did you start running more and also, for example, cut down on desserts?
You're smart, Al. I actually did cut down on both portions and between meal snacking. I rarely do desserts anyway. The weight came off more quickly, but I definitely have seen weight come off with just running being the only change. What I should be doing now is going back to that diet while I'm less active, but the motivation hasn't been there. I had a specific goal in 2010 to drop weight and get faster to qualify for the Boston marathon, and once I did that I found it hard to maintain.
__________________
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2012, 10:34 AM   #17
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
donheff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 8,649
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
The problem I have is that if I don't run, I put on weight, and I just don't feel as good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
You're smart, Al. I actually did cut down on both portions and between meal snacking. I rarely do desserts anyway.
Harvard Health Blog today provides some info on why exercise may help with weight loss. Apparently it releases a hormone called Irisin which transforms white fat cells to energy producing brown fat cells. Drugs are quite a ways off. But couple the exercise with a reduction in sweets and you will be home free.
__________________
Every man is, or hopes to be, an Idler. -- Samuel Johnson
donheff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2012, 08:26 AM   #18
Moderator
Walt34's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eastern WV Panhandle
Posts: 16,579
All things in moderation. I still remember reading a study in the '70's or so in which scientists bought a bunch of steaks to analyze the fat content and found that (surprise!) steaks are high in fat and too much is bad for you.

The part that struck me though was that they were so concerned about the results of this study that they grilled and ate the remaining steaks.
__________________

__________________
I heard the call to do nothing. So I answered it.
Walt34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:04 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.