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Old 06-06-2011, 11:42 AM   #41
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While traveling in England my daughter got sick, used the emergency room. The hospital was filthy, guards at the door to keep the zombies out. It was a horrible experience, socialized medicine isn't for me.
That's more of a hospital thing than a 'socialized medicine' thing. Guess which country inspects restaurants and cruise ships for cleanliness, and tests equipment in food processing plants for bacterial content, but exempts hospitals from cleanliness and sanitation checks?
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Old 06-06-2011, 12:54 PM   #42
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Yeah, but our Doctors and pharma and health insurance executives get to drive 911s.

Even our pharmacists drive BMWs.
OTOH, DW/me are, and have done quite well with our VGHAX (Vanguard Health Care Adm) with a YTD return of just over 14%.

While we may not be able to pay less for pharma, at least we're sharing in the profits . BTW, pharma is only a portion of the health care spectrum that Ed Owens and Jean Hynes invest in.
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Old 06-06-2011, 01:03 PM   #43
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While traveling in England my daughter got sick, used the emergency room. The hospital was filthy, guards at the door to keep the zombies out. It was a horrible experience, socialized medicine isn't for me.
DW/me spent a month "down under" a few years ago.

Our tour guide (an Oz native) spoke about the health care situation. I'm not sure if it is the same plan as England, but she said that while she was eligible for the public health care system (AKA Medicare), she still paid for private coverage, due to what she felt was lacking in the public sector. She told a story (true or not - who knows) mentioning her experience with the public (hospital) system which sounds like what you went through.

As for me? I'm happy with my (U.S.) private coverage, as a pre-Medicare retiree. Of course, while I still co-pay for coverage, it's not too bad since it's provided via my former employer and runs a bit less than $500/month for both of us with little out-of-pocket expense (e.g. co-pay). For those that go it alone and pay high rates for high deductable plans, I well understand the concern (I was there in my "early life").
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Old 06-07-2011, 03:15 PM   #44
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Old 06-07-2011, 03:21 PM   #45
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I have met a number of Canadians that are not so fond of socialized medicine either. Don't think it's free someone is paying the bills and that money comes from you know who.
The ones you met are buying the Koolaid from down south. We have private hospitals that are funded by rich local donors. We also have a single payer insurance system that prevents usurious profits by HMOs and insurance companies.

The system is great! It is not perfect because we can't afford perfect.

(BTW we also have private coverage for drugs, dental and Blue Cross.)
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Old 06-07-2011, 04:02 PM   #46
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I would embrace the Canadian system down here. But only Rep Weiner was for it, and I am afraid that he may be on his way out.

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Old 06-07-2011, 11:24 PM   #47
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I would embrace the Canadian system down here.
I agree but I've heard that those cheap SOB's don't want to pay for my health care. I say cut off their supply of drugs until they issue cards for the 300 mil of us to head north for treatment.
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Old 06-07-2011, 11:27 PM   #48
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(BTW we also have private coverage for drugs, dental and Blue Cross.)
What's the point of that?
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Old 06-08-2011, 11:21 AM   #49
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It is funny that you mention drinking the Koolaid. We were travelling in the US during the debate. Some of the TV and billboard ads-on both sides of the issue, astounded us.

But the oddest thing occured on one of those few hour boat tours on Lake Tahoe. We were speaking with a few other couples. One lady, from LA, told us she had a sister who 'knew' about the health care in Canada and had it on 'very good authority' that the hospitals in Canada were 'dirty' and many of the nurses wore burkas (sp).

I was fortunate to catch the pricelesslook on DW's face as she turned around to hide her surprise and her amusement. DW, as an RN, spent many years working in hospitals in Ontario, British Columbia, and Alberta. I had been in the hospital several times and our late parents had hospital stays multiple time in British Columbia. We laughed about it later, both agreeing that the reason we did not comment is that it would have served no purpose. We still laugh about it.
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Old 06-08-2011, 11:36 AM   #50
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It is funny that you mention drinking the Koolaid. We were travelling in the US during the debate. Some of the TV and billboard ads-on both sides of the issue, astounded us.

But the oddest thing occured on one of those few hour boat tours on Lake Tahoe. We were speaking with a few other couples. One lady, from LA, told us she had a sister who 'knew' about the health care in Canada and had it on 'very good authority' that the hospitals in Canada were 'dirty' and many of the nurses wore burkas (sp).

I was fortunate to catch the pricelesslook on DW's face as she turned around to hide her surprise and her amusement. DW, as an RN, spent many years working in hospitals in Ontario, British Columbia, and Alberta. I had been in the hospital several times and our late parents had hospital stays multiple time in British Columbia. We laughed about it later, both agreeing that the reason we did not comment is that it would have served no purpose. We still laugh about it.
Sadly, your story doesn't surprise me. Many Americans seem to enjoy putting down the way other countries operate. Can't stand to think anyone has figured out a better system than we have in the good old USofA.

I've seen this first hand when traveling overseas. When it's happened, I've always been tempted to say "Don't look at me, I'm Canadian".
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Old 06-08-2011, 11:40 AM   #51
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Sadly, your story doesn't surprise me. Many Americans seem to enjoy putting down the way other countries operate. Can't stand to think anyone has figured out a better system than we have in the good old USofA.
True, but on the flip side there are an awful lot of Americans who act apologetic for their country, act ashamed to be American, and have little good to say about it relative to other nations (usually citing statistics about being "82nd in the world in X" or some such). It takes all kinds, really. There are some things we do very well and some things that need a lot of improvement. The telling thing is that so many people focus on one of these and ignore the other.
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Old 06-08-2011, 02:12 PM   #52
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What's the point of that?
Well it is because we don't have socialized medicine. We have a single payer insurance scheme for basic coverage. Things like private rooms, Viagra and sparkling teeth are consider extra cost items.
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Old 06-08-2011, 03:19 PM   #53
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True, but on the flip side there are an awful lot of Americans who act apologetic for their country, act ashamed to be American, and have little good to say about it relative to other nations (usually citing statistics about being "82nd in the world in X" or some such). It takes all kinds, really. There are some things we do very well and some things that need a lot of improvement. The telling thing is that so many people focus on one of these and ignore the other.
When I am out of the country I always brag that we, in the USofA, spend more per person for health care than any other country on earth.
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Old 06-08-2011, 03:25 PM   #54
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When I am out of the country I always brag that we, in the USofA, spend more per person for health care than any other country on earth.


Seriously though everyone, I'm proud of many things about the USA. Health care? Not so much.
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Old 06-08-2011, 03:33 PM   #55
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It is funny that you mention drinking the Koolaid. We were travelling in the US during the debate. Some of the TV and billboard ads-on both sides of the issue, astounded us.

But the oddest thing occured on one of those few hour boat tours on Lake Tahoe. We were speaking with a few other couples. One lady, from LA, told us she had a sister who 'knew' about the health care in Canada and had it on 'very good authority' that the hospitals in Canada were 'dirty' and many of the nurses wore burkas (sp).

I was fortunate to catch the pricelesslook on DW's face as she turned around to hide her surprise and her amusement. DW, as an RN, spent many years working in hospitals in Ontario, British Columbia, and Alberta. I had been in the hospital several times and our late parents had hospital stays multiple time in British Columbia. We laughed about it later, both agreeing that the reason we did not comment is that it would have served no purpose. We still laugh about it.
Yeah, I'm sure that your DW wouldn't want to wear her burka somewhere where it could get dirty.

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Old 06-08-2011, 03:35 PM   #56
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When I am out of the country I always brag that we, in the USofA, spend more per person for health care than any other country on earth.
Don't forget to point out how 'they' are worse off than 'us' because of 'socialist medicine'. This goes over particularly well in Switzerland. Oh, and when in Vienna, be sure to complain about not being able to get a cup of coffee.

(I saw fellow countrymen pull both these stunts while in Europe a couple years ago. It would have been entertaining if it wasn't so massively cringeworthy. Picture a 350 pound gentleman in some distress, but absolutely refusing to cooperate with a Swiss hotel manager and doctor because of a dislike of what he called 'socialist medicine'. The coffee thing was pretty funny, too. For American style coffee you have to ask for filterkaffee. 'Coffee' is just an ingredient.)
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Old 06-08-2011, 03:55 PM   #57
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While traveling in England my daughter got sick, used the emergency room. The hospital was filthy, guards at the door to keep the zombies out. It was a horrible experience, socialized medicine isn't for me. I have met a number of Canadians that are not so fond of socialized medicine either. Don't think it's free someone is paying the bills and that money comes from you know who.
You might have a point, if the only choices were the US or UK systems. Most European countries do a lot better than the UK. Here in France, yesterday I got my teeth scale-and-polished for $40 and two weeks ago I had a $35 doctor's visit where he prescribed me 4g of Amoxicillin for 15 days, total cost $15. And I'll get 90% of those costs back from my insurance.
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