Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 02-16-2009, 06:40 PM   #61
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by opting out View Post
What difference would it make if I am terminated or retire? Either way, there is a potential slot for a new employee. That's a stimulus.
Perhaps. But I think part of the idea is that if someone has most of their health insurance covered for a few months after a layoff, they may not be quite as fearful about a layoff and they may not feel like they need to build that "financial bomb shelter" as high and as nuke-proof as before.

At least that's one way to look at how the COBRA subsidies, like them or not, could be seen as something to encourage economic activity from people who are still working and had paying for health insurance in unemployment as one of the fears they had to hoard cash for. I know that makes the potential for a layoff a lot easier for me to take. Between that, severance pay and unemployment we could probably go for several months without depleting our savings below where it is today. A big assist goes to a simple lifestyle and a paid-off house.
__________________

__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is online now   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 02-16-2009, 06:44 PM   #62
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 654
Quote:
Originally Posted by opting out View Post
What difference would it make if I am terminated or retire? Either way, there is a potential slot for a new employee. That's a stimulus.
From what I have read, the subsidy applies only to people laid off. They can even beat you out of it if you are fired for gross misconduct. In other words fired with cause.
Of course I haven't seen the actual documents.
Steve
__________________

__________________
Stevewc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2009, 06:47 PM   #63
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
FIRE'd@51's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29 View Post
Perhaps. But I think part of the idea is that if someone has most of their health insurance covered for a few months after a layoff, they may not be quite as fearful about a layoff and they may not feel like they need to build that "financial bomb shelter" as high and as nuke-proof as before.
Also, by making COBRA more affordable, I would think one would be more likely to keep it. Once you drop creditable insurance coverage for 61 days, you may have a real problem getting insurance again, and even if you get it, you may be subject to waiting periods for pre-existing conditions.
__________________
FIRE'd@51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2009, 02:58 PM   #64
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 69
Where does one find a summary of the now law pertaining to the COBRA stipulation? I have tried reading thru the bill, but no luck finding it.

I was separated from my company and started on COBRA in May 08 and it will run out in Oct 09.

Seems I would be able to get the subsidy but heard that you must be laid off within the period of August 08 and Jan 10, which would leave me out.

If that is true, it makes no sense as to helping those still unemployed that were separted prior to August 08.

Any assistance to understanding this better, is appreciated.

Thanks
__________________
oliverdickens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2009, 03:09 PM   #65
Moderator Emeritus
Martha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,212
Here is a link that does a good job of summarizing the law:

President Signs Stimulus Bill With Significant COBRA Changes for Employers

From the article:

Subject to income limitations, employees who are terminated “involuntarily” – a term that is not further defined in the Act or the accompanying Conference Report – between September 1, 2008, and December 31, 2009, and their covered dependents, would be eligible for a subsidy of 65 percent of the premiums they would be required to pay for up to nine months for any group health plan in which they participated at the time of termination, excluding health flexible spending accounts (FSAs). These “assistance eligible individuals” would be required to pay only 35 percent of the premium charged under a plan. Employers would not receive any subsidy payment upfront, but would be able to recover the other 65 percent of premiums in the form of a credit against their income tax withholding and FICA taxes (employer and employee portion). If the premiums due an employer exceeded its tax obligations in any given quarter, the U.S. Treasury would issue a check to make up the difference. This tax credit arrangement also applies to insurers and multiemployer plans to whom COBRA premiums are payable.
This subsidy would not apply to employees (or their dependents) who have an adjusted gross income of more than $125,000 ($250,000 for joint filers) in the year in which they would receive a subsidy. If a taxpayer with an income of more than $125,000 ($250,000 for joint filers) receives any COBRA premium assistance, that assistance will be added directly to the taxpayer’s income tax liability in the relevant year (subject to a phase-in for incomes up to $145,000 or $290,000 for joint filers). We would expect future regulations to clarify what would happen to an employer’s tax credits in these cases. These high-income terminated employees have the option under the Act to permanently waive the right to premium assistance.
__________________
.


No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA

Martha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2009, 03:28 PM   #66
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
FIRE'd@51's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,322
Pretty thoughtless on the part of Congress to not provide assistance for those laid off prior to Sep 1, 2008. If those folks haven't found work by now, they most likely need the subsidy even more than those laid off after Sep 1, 2008. IMO, the subsidy should have been for anyone who was laid off and still on COBRA.
__________________
FIRE'd@51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2009, 03:40 PM   #67
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 69
Thanks for this information, really helpful and sustantiated what I thought. ie I will not be eligilbe since I separated prior to Sept 08.

I agree, once again, congress was shortsided and is hurting many people currently struggling to pay for COBRA but have been laid off prior to Sept 08. Totally shows lack of understanding on our leaders part and being out of touch with those needing it the most.
__________________
oliverdickens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-2009, 04:54 AM   #68
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,798
Therein lays the problem, where to draw the line. Either someone feels they were left out, or everyone receives the handout. We can always do more until we can't.
__________________
You don't want to work. You want to live like a king, but the big bad world don't owe you a thing. Get over it--The Eagles
lets-retire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-2009, 08:52 AM   #69
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by lets-retire View Post
Therein lays the problem, where to draw the line. Either someone feels they were left out, or everyone receives the handout. We can always do more until we can't.
I guess that's part of the reason why they create a lot of these things with "phase-out" stipulations so that it's not an all-or-nothing thing by changing one day or one dollar.
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2009, 03:43 PM   #70
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
OAG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Central, Ohio, USA
Posts: 2,598
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Visitor View Post
Hello all - any thoughts on whether these goodies will be available to voluntary retirees? All the coverage I can find equates COBRA with workers who have "lost their jobs"...
Here is a Washington Post article on 55 yo may be able to purchase Medicare Coverage. Very last paragraph: Obama to Unveil an Ambitious Budget Plan
__________________
Vietnam Veteran, CW4 USA, Retired 1979
OAG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2009, 03:53 PM   #71
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by OAG View Post
Here is a Washington Post article on 55 yo may be able to purchase Medicare Coverage. Very last paragraph: Obama to Unveil an Ambitious Budget Plan
Interesting. Didn't President Clinton float this idea once upon a time -- for people from 55-64 to "buy into" Medicare?
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 06:52 AM   #72
Dryer sheet aficionado
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 32
Any thoughts on what the cost might be to buy into Medicare? The article put the 2007 combined cost of Medicare/Medicaid at $561B for 100M people, or about $5600/person. I would guess 2009 will be at least 10% higher per person. And Medicare coverage alone isn't that great. If the buy-in is in that ballpark I would think it will only be useful to people who can't get other coverage, in turn driving the cost even higher...
__________________
A Visitor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 07:03 AM   #73
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
OAG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Central, Ohio, USA
Posts: 2,598
AT LEAST $96.40 a month and probably a LOT MORE (some magic formula like: years below 65 X the current rate (example: 55 yo so 65-55=10 then 10X$96.40X12 so buy in would be $11,568, in this example) and, of course, current and ongoing monthly payments). Just a WAG and maybe a SWAG, on my part, since, they have not even considered approving it (the Congress).
__________________
Vietnam Veteran, CW4 USA, Retired 1979
OAG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 02:03 PM   #74
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
FIRE'd@51's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Visitor View Post
Any thoughts on what the cost might be to buy into Medicare?
From the AARP web site:

• Allowing buy-ins for people 55 to 64 Baucus would allow temporary Medicare buy-ins for those in this age group until universal coverage becomes a reality. For over 4 million uninsured Americans ages 55 to 64, the only option now is to buy individual insurance, which is often unaffordable or even unavailable to people with preexisting health conditions.

But a guarantee of full Medicare coverage, regardless of health status, wouldn’t come cheap. Enrollees would have to pay full premiums for Part A (hospital insurance) and Part B (outpatient services), without the subsidies that beneficiaries age 65 and over receive. Those premiums could add up to at least $800 a month.


And this would still leave you with substantial copays, and provide no drug coverage.
__________________
FIRE'd@51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 02:13 PM   #75
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
OAG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Central, Ohio, USA
Posts: 2,598
That is far more expensive than my "guess" would have been. Wonder about the selective application issue and how it would be covered.
__________________
Vietnam Veteran, CW4 USA, Retired 1979
OAG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 04:54 PM   #76
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,798
I believe if they do allow the buy ins for Medicare, people would see that it is not much cheaper than private insurance and complain loudly. The buy-ins would then become subsidized and de facto Medicare coverage for people it was never intended to cover. When the government starts to offer the subsidies I think private insurance would stop providing coverage for those people. Similar to how a private disability insurance requires the recipient to apply for SSDI and then subtracts any SSDI payments amounts from their payments.
__________________
You don't want to work. You want to live like a king, but the big bad world don't owe you a thing. Get over it--The Eagles
lets-retire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 05:33 PM   #77
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
OAG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Central, Ohio, USA
Posts: 2,598
Not to mention the Medical Insurance Lobby becoming unglued!
__________________
Vietnam Veteran, CW4 USA, Retired 1979
OAG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 05:42 PM   #78
Dryer sheet aficionado
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by lets-retire View Post
When the government starts to offer the subsidies I think private insurance would stop providing coverage for those people.
And maybe employers as well? They would be incented to give employees the money to buy the cheaper coverage on their own...
__________________
A Visitor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2009, 07:09 PM   #79
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,615
Rather than being a "gap filler" until socialized medicine/universal care/etc is enacted, I think this is likely the actual piecemeal enactment of the plan (whether that is the Administration's goal or not). A new block of 55-65 YO enrollees, then employers stop offering coverage, subsidies for these folks due to the high costs, then growing pressure to allow younger folks in (to help spread the costs by allowing younger, healthier people into the government plan). Tah Dah! We have arrived at nirvana!
__________________

__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What happens after COBRA? simplelindasky Health and Early Retirement 7 09-12-2008 04:46 PM
Cobra eligability vkanard Hi, I am... 1 08-19-2008 03:57 PM
Long-term care subsidies aren't working Nords Health and Early Retirement 18 12-06-2006 10:45 AM
COBRA Ginger Other topics 1 11-15-2005 06:27 PM
COBRA Marshac Other topics 16 10-02-2004 06:46 AM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:44 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.