What would you do?

[Martha]

I want to say that I would do it and bill afterwords.

But. When this situation came up at the law office I would usually require a retainer up front if I had any question of the client's ability or desire to pay. Burned too many times. Our policy was to require a retainer for most new clients and to have a fee agreement in any event. I did some work for free but I wanted to chose what I would do for free. Of course, they weren't in the hospital either.

EDIT: posted before I read Meadbh's post with the facts.

 

[Moemg]

What if you did the consult for free and later they decided to sue and of course named everybody including you to get more money how would you feel then ?

 

[Texas Proud]

I have two completely different thoughts here....

First, I would want to know UPFRONT that you were going to bill me if that is what you were planning on doing... I can make an informed decision if I want to spend the money or not... if you just came in and consulted, and later I found out that it was 'chargeable', I would be upset as the patient.


My second is one of experience. When I was in my early 20s I had a dentist remove my wisdom teeth... as a side note, it was PAINFUL as they were all impacted and he could not get them out easily... cut through my jaw and hammered them out.... OUCH... ok, end of sidetrack... Well, he 'packed' the holes he created so I would not get dry socket... but I was going to college in a different town... he said wait a week and go to another dentist to get them repacked...

Well, I made an appointment, went to the dentist.... he looked at what I had... made jokes about the boot print on my chest (I asked 'what?', he said that is the only way he could think someone could have ripped them out of my mouth ).... but he said they sould not be packed again... so I thanked him and asked how much.... he said "Free"!!!

SOO, he spent his time, his assistants time, had to clean his tools etc... and did not charge me at all.... a very nice gesture for a college kid....

 

[FUEGO]

I spoke briefly with the patient and offered the choice of having the consult as a noninsured service for which a bill would be generated, or declining it. The patient indicated that he/she had a budget for his/her healthcare and did not consider that this consult was a priority, therefore he/she declined the service.

I wish the Dr's were that explicit about costs here in the US of A. The more likely scenario is, you'd get the 5 minute consult (including a quick scan of the chart) and a bill for $210 two months later which your insurance refuses to pay for some arcane reason. Then you waste hours of your time, the insurance company's time, and the Dr's billing staff's time arguing the bill. Medicine. American style.

 

[Walt34]

What you did seems reasonable to me. If the person wants your expertise, which you have spent many years obtaining, then it is reasonable to expect them to pay for it. Everyone can afford to donate some time, but no one can afford to donate all of it.

Safeway (food store chain for those out of the U.S.) doesn't take good feelings, they want cold hard cash.

 

[Bestwifeever]

Good idea to boot the decision to the patient. Since your colleague seems to have generated the idea for your consult, it might not even have been something the patient was interested in.

Now, could you just take a quick look at this rash on my leg

 

[Meadbh]

What if you did the consult for free and later they decided to sue and of course named everybody including you to get more money how would you feel then ?

Exactly!!! Why should I accept the liability AND the cost

 

[Meadbh]

First, I would want to know UPFRONT that you were going to bill me if that is what you were planning on doing... I can make an informed decision if I want to spend the money or not... if you just came in and consulted, and later I found out that it was 'chargeable', I would be upset as the patient.

I quite agree!

 

[bbbamI]

So......do I get a cookie?

 

[Meadbh]

Why not? A cookie for everyone who answered #4

 

[bbbamI]

YAY!!!

 

[MichaelB]

I voted 4 - which is the way I would want this to be handled if I were the patient. I have been in this situation, as have my children, and I find it terribly offensive that 1) a physician engaged in my health care can involve another physician without my prior consent or involvement, 2) a physician can make a choice regarding my healthcare without determining my capacity or willingness to pay.

Meadbh handled it quite well, IMHO. And cookies without calories - what a great idea.

 

[toofrugalformycat]

Thanks heaven these are calorie free cookies or you would have ruined my diet!

 

[ZZTWP]

Doctors !

You know it makes me sick :
I have a dental problem and I can not find any doc that will let me pay out dental work:
This just makes me want to puke ; why you say, cause they wnat to look at how much money you have first before work is done !
What happened to the good willed men of the U S A ?
Money is more IMPORTANT that care for you fellow man !

 

[NW-Bound]

Basically, it shows that when health care is "free" people don't give much thought to using it. When they are paying for it, they more carefully consider cost/benefit.
-ERD50

DING DING DING

I think, no, believe any system that allows "all you can eat" will have problems. There has to be a copay or something to slow down the hypochondriac or the patients who want MRI for any headache. Yes, medical care is a resource, a limited one like any others.

By the way, I didn't vote because of "insufficient information". I thought this was a trick puzzle, and did not give the choices serious consideration.

 

[bubba]

What if you did the consult for free and later they decided to sue and of course named everybody including you to get more money how would you feel then ?

That was exactly my thought when I first read the question. Maybe I'm too cynical, but I figure that's exactly what might happen so you'd better charge enough to cover those oh so expensive malpratice insurance premiums. Talk about adding insult to injury. Give away the service, and then get sued for your trouble.

 

[Martha]

You know it makes me sick :
I have a dental problem and I can not find any doc that will let me pay out dental work:
This just makes me want to puke ; why you say, cause they wnat to look at how much money you have first before work is done !
What happened to the good willed men of the U S A ?
Money is more IMPORTANT that care for you fellow man !

Well, dentists do get burned on unpaid bills. Maybe try to save up for a significant down payment and ask for a payment plan on the rest?

BTW, my dentist offers a discount for immediate payment and does not ask for money up front.

 

[W2R]

My dentist would probably bill me if I wanted him to, but I prefer to pay on the way out of the office so that it is done with and so that I can save the cost of a stamp. I have done that since I first saw him in 1999, when I was a walk-in with a dental emergency. He always gives me a substantial courtesy discount which I presume is due to the fact that I do not have dental insurance.

My daughter doesn't have much money and doesn't seem to have any trouble finding a dentist that will let her make payments on her dental work. Her problem is making the payments on time!

 

[Moemg]

You know it makes me sick :
I have a dental problem and I can not find any doc that will let me pay out dental work:
This just makes me want to puke ; why you say, cause they wnat to look at how much money you have first before work is done !
What happened to the good willed men of the U S A ?
Money is more IMPORTANT that care for you fellow man !

I worked at a Surgery Center and before they tightened up their payment options they were in big financial trouble due to people having elective surgery and not paying especially their co-pays . So now they require all co-pays paid before surgery . Doctors and Dentists have a lot of overhead so they can not just give their services away . If you want cheaper dental care look for a clinic they will work with you on the payment .

 

[ERD50]

What happened to the good willed men of the U S A ?
Money is more IMPORTANT that care for you fellow man !

If you want cheaper dental care look for a clinic they will work with you on the payment .

Better yet, ZZTWP should go to school, get a degree and license in Dentistry, buy all the equipment needed, get his insurance in line, and a staff, and then give free service to all who ask.

Then we can give him a plaque for being a " good willed man/woman of the U S A", and "caring for your fellow man above money".

Of course, he won't be able to pay his rent, and will have to shut down, default on student loans, etc...., and then he/she won't be helping anybody. Oh well, it's the thought that counts.

I consider my Dentist to be my "fellow man/woman" as well. And they can set the payment terms as they please, and I can chose to do or not do business with them.

I'm always curious what sort of line of work the poster is in when they post stuff like this. If they are salaried or hourly, would it be OK if the boss came around and said - "hey, we didn't make a profit this quarter, no paycheck for you. But don't worry, we really, really, really expect to be profitable next quarter, we will pay you then! Now, get back to work!".

-ERD50

 

[FUEGO]

I'm always curious what sort of line of work the poster is in when they post stuff like this. If they are salaried or hourly, would it be OK if the boss came around and said - "hey, we didn't make a profit this quarter, no paycheck for you. But don't worry, we really, really, really expect to be profitable next quarter, we will pay you then! Now, get back to work!".

Wait, this isn't the attitude of most employers?

"Sure we know your contract says 40 hrs a week, but if you just work a little more, think of all the extra money you can make us!"

 

[ERD50]

Wait, this isn't the attitude of most employers?

"Sure we know your contract says 40 hrs a week, but if you just work a little more, think of all the extra money you can make us!"

Seems very different to me.

Yes, the employer is looking for a bit of a freebie, but the employee also figures there is something in it for him/her in the long run to stick it out. Or they can leave for greener pastures.

But to voluntarily give free services to an individual? That would be more like if I was a contract engineer, had three companies that wanted my services - two offered $X paid weekly, and one said "I'll pay you when I can". You have bills to pay, emergency fund is tapped, which one are you going for?

-ERD50

 

[FUEGO]

Seems very different to me.

Yes, the employer is looking for a bit of a freebie, but the employee also figures there is something in it for him/her in the long run to stick it out. Or they can leave for greener pastures.

Yeah, I should have put a smiley face in my post!

At least at my current employer, it is clear that hard work will not be rewarded for quite a while ("in these difficult times", "cost cutting measures", "reducing labor-related expenses" blah blah blah etc). Which leaves greener pastures I guess.

 

[haha]

Imagine you are a physician who is asked to consult on a patient. The problem is not life threatening, there is no diagnostic or therapeutic dilemma, and the main function of the consult is to provide information and support to the patient......who does not have insurance.

I thought in that Canada everyone had insurance?

 

[Meadbh]

I thought in that Canada everyone had insurance?

The patient was a foreigner. She was here on a visitor's visa from a European country.