Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 05-26-2016, 03:32 PM   #181
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,391
From the above article:

Per capita consumption of cheese in the US: 36 lbs/yr.
Per capital consumption of cheese in France: 57 lbs/yr.

Does cheese make the French fat?

Average BMI in the US: 28.6 for adult men, 28.7 for adult women.
Average BMI in France: 25.3 average for both sexes.

And I bet the French still eat tons of baguette. They drink less wine in recent years though. And the French have been getting bigger too. Actually, the whole world is getting bigger, except for those poor sub-Saharan Africans.
__________________

__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 05-26-2016, 03:44 PM   #182
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,391
Look here. The Brits are skinnier than the French, and in fact the skinniest of all Europe.

Body Mass Index (BMI) by Country
__________________

__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2016, 03:49 PM   #183
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Fedup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Southern Cal
Posts: 2,930
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW-Bound View Post
Look here. The Brits are skinnier than the French, and in fact the skinniest of all Europe.

Body Mass Index (BMI) by Country
They walk a lot. I'm already get my exercise in the last few days. I walk every where. Stairs up/down to take the tube and such.
__________________
Fedup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2016, 07:12 PM   #184
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,391
People walk a lot in Europe, particularly in large cities like Paris or London. However, the statistics are for entire nations, and we do not know if the British villagers walk more than the French paysans or Italian paesani. It may be the food they eat, or don't eat.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 08:28 AM   #185
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DFW_M5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,980
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW-Bound View Post
Look here. The Brits are skinnier than the French, and in fact the skinniest of all Europe.

Body Mass Index (BMI) by Country
But BMI is not the best indicator of health, as a lot of lean muscle mass can make one look unfit. Percent body fat would be more meaningful.
__________________
Doing things today that others won't, to do things tomorrow that others can't. Of course I'm referring to workouts, not robbing banks.
DFW_M5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 08:38 AM   #186
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,380
Quote:
Originally Posted by DFW_M5 View Post
But BMI is not the best indicator of health, as a lot of lean muscle mass can make one look unfit. Percent body fat would be more meaningful.
The great advantage of BMI is that it is available.

Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 09:02 AM   #187
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DFW_M5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,980
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
The great advantage of BMI is that it is available.

Ha
Of course, but it can be very misleading.
__________________
Doing things today that others won't, to do things tomorrow that others can't. Of course I'm referring to workouts, not robbing banks.
DFW_M5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 09:40 AM   #188
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,391
Quote:
Originally Posted by DFW_M5 View Post
But BMI is not the best indicator of health, as a lot of lean muscle mass can make one look unfit. Percent body fat would be more meaningful.
That is true for individuals.

But when looking at the entire populace, those muscular few do not change the statistics for nations. Or if they do, there's no reason to think the English are overall more muscular than other Europeans.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 09:48 AM   #189
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
photoguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,301
I thought BMI was explicitly designed for population studies and not for use on an individual level.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Early Retirement Forum mobile app
__________________
photoguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 10:11 AM   #190
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DFW_M5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,980
Thats true, it is not accurate for individuals, but rather populations. Here are some other points about the problems with BMI:
Top 10 Reasons Why The BMI Is Bogus : NPR
__________________
Doing things today that others won't, to do things tomorrow that others can't. Of course I'm referring to workouts, not robbing banks.
DFW_M5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 11:23 AM   #191
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Amethyst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 5,874
I've always suspected BMI to be bogus. My BMI is 20.4, which sounds thin, but my physique is quite substantial. I am one of those people who look thinner in clothes than in a bathing suit or gym outfit - so much so that people who see me in both types of garb have commented on the difference.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DFW_M5 View Post
Thats true, it is not accurate for individuals, but rather populations. Here are some other points about the problems with BMI:
Top 10 Reasons Why The BMI Is Bogus : NPR
__________________
If you understood everything I say, you'd be me ~ Miles Davis
'There is only one success – to be able to spend your life in your own way.’ Christopher Morley.
Amethyst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 11:29 AM   #192
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
photoguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,301
I hadn't seen a critique of BMI before but while the NPR comments may be true, they seem a little harsh. Their article seems to pan it for being essentially a curve fit that fails to account for many physiological factors -- but I wouldn't say that's bad statistics. It's just an approximation which for many uses is still perfectly good. It would be bad statistics however to apply a general approximation to an individual when you know the assumptions don't apply.

Is there an alternative measure that is better than relies only on height & weight?

It also doesn't bother me that it's systematically biased against fit, lean, healthy people. I mean it's going to be obvious if that's the case.
__________________
photoguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 11:41 AM   #193
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,391
BMI also does not take into account body shape, or bone structure. The same BMI on a person with large bones may be OK, but on someone who is lanky may indicate obesity.

While BMI may not be good as an absolute measure of health, the fact that it is creeping up world-wide over the years is undeniable. And we can just look at photos of people or movies back in the 50s or even as late as 70s to see that BMI does not lie.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 12:05 PM   #194
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DFW_M5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,980
Quote:
Originally Posted by photoguy View Post
Is there an alternative measure that is better than relies only on height & weight?
The best measure is % body fat, but that measure is independent of height and weight.
__________________
Doing things today that others won't, to do things tomorrow that others can't. Of course I'm referring to workouts, not robbing banks.
DFW_M5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 12:16 PM   #195
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Fedup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Southern Cal
Posts: 2,930
How do they know of everybody BMI? I don't even know my BMI.
__________________
Fedup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 12:23 PM   #196
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 60
I subscribe the the calories in/calories out school of weight gain/loss. For me, increased exercise and restricting calories really work to control weight. I just have to find that happy median where I can sustain a healthy weight without feeling deprived.

This:
IMG_20151117_125122064.jpg
(homemade sourdough cheese bread, OMG good!)

and a sedentary lifestyle is why I got overweight. Well, that and former cravings for ice cream and chocolate bars.

I was diagnosed with diabetes earlier this month, with an HgA1C of 13.5%! But things are getting better. Fasting BG this morning was 5.0mmol/l - or 90mg/dl as the US measures things.

Metformin, and a few other diabetes drugs, along with diet changes and increased exercise, seem to have brought the blood sugar under control. I no longer have large BG swings during the day.

Cutting back on bread and pasta, and this:
IMG_20160512_100211770_HDR.jpg

is why I'm starting to lose weight. My exercise buddy and I go for a 6 km walk two or, rarely, three times a day. Starting to do some walk-runs now. I've lost 3 kg since the diagnosis. Ideally, I really need to lose another 9kg to get rid of the excess fat around my middle.
__________________
Viking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 12:49 PM   #197
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 5,562
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fedup View Post
How do they know of everybody BMI? I don't even know my BMI.
Sure you do:

http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/educ...MI/bmicalc.htm


I believe there are several different ideal weight calculators not sure any of them are any better than BMI. Since these just work on height/weight/sex they all appear to have the same limitations.
__________________
MRG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 01:41 PM   #198
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
photoguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,301
Quote:
Originally Posted by DFW_M5 View Post
The best measure is % body fat, but that measure is independent of height and weight.
I don't doubt that BMI is going to be the least accurate way of measuring obesity for an individual, but the advantage of it, as noted earlier, is that it's available *everywhere*. And it's probably good enough as a general screening tool (not diagnostic).

Sure if you have access to a more accurate method for determining body fat and can afford the cost, then go for it.

But I will note that even a "gold standard" method like a dunk tank doesn't directly measure body fat. Pretty much all methods measure something else and then convert it to a body fat percentage using a mathematical approximation (ultimately calibrated against cadavers that have been chopped up/dissolved). Each of these approximations have varying accuracy, assumptions and costs.
__________________
photoguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 02:16 PM   #199
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,380
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amethyst View Post
I've always suspected BMI to be bogus. My BMI is 20.4, which sounds thin, but my physique is quite substantial. I am one of those people who look thinner in clothes than in a bathing suit or gym outfit - so much so that people who see me in both types of garb have commented on the difference.
How very polite!
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2016, 02:40 PM   #200
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DFW_M5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,980
I think most folks that are involved in fitness/sports science or even a medical Dr would say a dunk tank is a reasonable measure, while a dexa scan is even better. For me, I use the mirror, and the mirror does not tell me I'm overweight like my BMI suggests. If you are happy with what BMI tells you, fine, stick with it.
__________________

__________________
Doing things today that others won't, to do things tomorrow that others can't. Of course I'm referring to workouts, not robbing banks.
DFW_M5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Big-Name Investors Get Long, Get Loud and Get Richer timo2 Stock Picking and Market Strategy 2 08-16-2013 09:02 AM
Why We’re Fat: It’s the Government and Wall Street’s Fault, Marion Nestle Says Midpack Health and Early Retirement 73 06-23-2012 08:46 PM
The Fat Pension newellcr Young Dreamers 34 07-26-2005 09:23 AM
Kung Hei Fat Choi SDY888 Other topics 4 02-14-2005 11:55 AM
You can't drink a fat girl thin John Galt Other topics 9 01-06-2005 02:07 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:05 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.