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09-29-2008, 06:29 AM
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#321
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,543
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Wachovia bites the dust
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09-29-2008, 09:17 AM
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#322
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,983
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Wow!
" Wachovia shares fell more than 90% in premarket trading, and the New York Stock Exchange did not open the shares for trading. Citigroup was off 1% at $19.95 shortly after the market opened."
This is getting real. Wachovia was supposed to be a good bank. Interesting investing sidelight was that insiders bought shares heavily several times on the way down, including just 2 weeks ago.
09/15/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase25,000$12.25306,250.0009/15/08 GOODWIN WILLIAM H JRPurchase1 Mil$11.0011.00 Mil08/19/08 SHERBURNE JANE CECILE*Grant164,107NANA07/23/08 KELLY STANHOPE AGift5,000NANA07/22/08 KELLY STANHOPE ASold5,000$13.9569,755.0007/22/08 STEEL ROBERT KINGPurchase1 Mil$16.1716.17 Mil07/15/08 STEEL ROBERT KINGGrant1.99 MilNANA03/05/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$28.75287,450.0003/03/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$30.37303,700.0002/28/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$32.00320,000.00
Ouch!
Ha
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
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09-29-2008, 09:25 AM
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#323
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 549
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haha
Interesting investing sidelight was that insiders bought shares heavily several times on the way down, including just 2 weeks ago.
09/15/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase25,000$12.25306,250.0009/15/08 GOODWIN WILLIAM H JRPurchase1 Mil$11.0011.00 Mil08/19/08 SHERBURNE JANE CECILE*Grant164,107NANA07/23/08 KELLY STANHOPE AGift5,000NANA07/22/08 KELLY STANHOPE ASold5,000$13.9569,755.0007/22/08 STEEL ROBERT KINGPurchase1 Mil$16.1716.17 Mil07/15/08 STEEL ROBERT KINGGrant1.99 MilNANA03/05/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$28.75287,450.0003/03/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$30.37303,700.0002/28/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$32.00320,000.00
Ouch!
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Another example of just HOW CRAZY all of this is.....and my
gut instinct tells me that we haven't seen the last of the craziness!
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09-29-2008, 09:48 AM
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#324
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 479
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Anybody know how this will effect WB pensions or where/how I could find out?
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09-29-2008, 11:04 AM
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#325
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,558
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Define "good bank". Wachovia was a decent bank at one point. However,
"Wachovia's current problems stem largely from its acquisition of mortgage lender Golden West Financial Corp. in 2006 for roughly $25 billion at the height of the nation's housing boom. With that purchase, Wachovia inherited a deteriorating $122 billion portfolio of Pick-A-Payment loans, Golden West's specialty, which let borrowers skip some payments"
Oops.
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha
Wow!
This is getting real. Wachovia was supposed to be a good bank. Interesting investing sidelight was that insiders bought shares heavily several times on the way down, including just 2 weeks ago.
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09-29-2008, 11:07 AM
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#326
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,543
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apparently they are skipping too many payments
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09-29-2008, 11:38 AM
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#327
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy
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Here is an interesting bit of advice from Barron on how to play the bottom in financials back in July, wouldn't have worked out to well. Never try to catch a falling knife...
Quote:
But at today's prices, preferred shares are much more attractive
Besides Fannie Mae, there are plenty of other preferreds with double-digit yields, including Lehman Brothers , Wachovia and Washington Mutual . WaMu's is among the riskiest financial preferreds, trading for just 6.50, a fraction of its face value of $25, but WaMu says it's adequately capitalized. Many companies like Lehman, Citigroup and Wachovia have issued both fixed-rate "straight" preferred and convertibles. A convert, like the Lehman issue in the table, has the advantage of giving investors a call option on the stock. Converts usually yield less than straight preferred.
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__________________
But then what do I really know?
https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f44/why-i-believe-we-are-about-to-embark-on-a-historic-bull-market-run-101268.html
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09-29-2008, 01:26 PM
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#328
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,052
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Again, check out HBAN for a bank I believe is on the upswing.
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09-29-2008, 03:00 PM
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#329
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art G
Again, check out HBAN for a bank I believe is on the upswing.
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What do you see in this bank? The stock is down 39% from Sept 19th when you first reccomended it and 45 cents above it's 52 week low. It is in the middle of a depressed area in Michigan. What makes it better than other regional banks?
__________________
But then what do I really know?
https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f44/why-i-believe-we-are-about-to-embark-on-a-historic-bull-market-run-101268.html
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09-29-2008, 03:10 PM
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#330
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,052
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First off, HBAN is in a depressed part of Ohio!
Secondly, they were hit pretty hard in '07 and they made their way through it. They are still making a profit, which seems to be unheard of in the banking industry. They've already written off a bunch of their bad debt, so I believe they have a much greater upside potential than most banks right now.
BTW, I think I first recommended the stock earlier than that. You may have just seen my most recent.
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09-29-2008, 03:53 PM
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#331
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art G
First off, HBAN is in a depressed part of Ohio!
Secondly, they were hit pretty hard in '07 and they made their way through it. They are still making a profit, which seems to be unheard of in the banking industry. They've already written off a bunch of their bad debt, so I believe they have a much greater upside potential than most banks right now.
BTW, I think I first recommended the stock earlier than that. You may have just seen my most recent.
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They are in Ohio, but from my memory of a year ago when I looked at them when they were reccomended as a dividend play at 18, I believe the largest amount of loans they had were in the state of Michigan and very vunerable to the auto industry, at least that is my memory.
If I am remembering the right bank they had bought another bank which had a whole bunch of subprime loans on it's books that it had to eat and that prior to that they had been a real conservative bank. I may have to look at my old file on this guy again.
__________________
But then what do I really know?
https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f44/why-i-believe-we-are-about-to-embark-on-a-historic-bull-market-run-101268.html
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09-29-2008, 05:07 PM
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#332
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Upstate
Posts: 2,948
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copyright1997reloaded
Bought 400 WB @ 8.93 on Friday afternoon, still holding it.
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Well, this was certainly bad timing on my part. But I would be jumping for joy if this was the only loss on the day or even 1/10th of the days loss.
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09-29-2008, 05:08 PM
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#333
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Lou-evil
Posts: 2,025
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haha
Wow!
" Wachovia shares fell more than 90% in premarket trading, and the New York Stock Exchange did not open the shares for trading. Citigroup was off 1% at $19.95 shortly after the market opened."
This is getting real. Wachovia was supposed to be a good bank. Interesting investing sidelight was that insiders bought shares heavily several times on the way down, including just 2 weeks ago.
09/15/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase25,000$12.25306,250.0009/15/08 GOODWIN WILLIAM H JRPurchase1 Mil$11.0011.00 Mil08/19/08 SHERBURNE JANE CECILE*Grant164,107NANA07/23/08 KELLY STANHOPE AGift5,000NANA07/22/08 KELLY STANHOPE ASold5,000$13.9569,755.0007/22/08 STEEL ROBERT KINGPurchase1 Mil$16.1716.17 Mil07/15/08 STEEL ROBERT KINGGrant1.99 MilNANA03/05/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$28.75287,450.0003/03/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$30.37303,700.0002/28/08 BAKER JOHN D IIPurchase10,000$32.00320,000.00
Ouch!
Ha
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Makes me think some of these bank execs don't even know and understand the exposure they have in these financial derivatives.
__________________
"These walls are kind of funny. First you hate 'em, then you get used to 'em. Enough time passes, gets so you depend on them"
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09-29-2008, 05:17 PM
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#334
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 479
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wildcat
Makes me think some of these bank execs don't even know and understand the exposure they have in these financial derivatives.
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Good. I hope they lose their jobs, houses, and shirts.
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10-03-2008, 11:34 AM
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#335
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,052
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Running_Man
They are in Ohio, but from my memory of a year ago when I looked at them when they were reccomended as a dividend play at 18, I believe the largest amount of loans they had were in the state of Michigan and very vunerable to the auto industry, at least that is my memory.
If I am remembering the right bank they had bought another bank which had a whole bunch of subprime loans on it's books that it had to eat and that prior to that they had been a real conservative bank. I may have to look at my old file on this guy again.
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No, you're right. They bought out another bank and all their bad debt. Gave the CEO a nice retirement package then patted themselves on the back as the stock price died. They deserve a class action suit for mismanagement.
All that said, I think the stock has some upside.
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10-03-2008, 05:49 PM
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#336
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Laurel, MD
Posts: 8,309
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art G
No, you're right. They bought out another bank and all their bad debt. Gave the CEO a nice retirement package then patted themselves on the back as the stock price died. They deserve a class action suit for mismanagement.
All that said, I think the stock has some upside.
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If you're referring to Wachovia, I think they bought Golden West Financial, a California institution that invented the pick-a-payment loan, or at least it was thier growth engine until they had a spill.
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10-03-2008, 06:39 PM
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#337
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Where the stars at night are big and bright
Posts: 2,847
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazz4cash
If you're referring to Wachovia, I think they bought Golden West Financial, a California institution that invented the pick-a-payment loan, or at least it was thier growth engine until they had a spill.
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The Sandlers built GWF on ARMs and then sold the whole shebang to Kenny Thompson because they saw the end of the show was coming. I remember reading an article about the sale in the WSJ, which all but accused Thompson of being a fool and the Sandlers of selling a ticking time bomb.
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There is no pleasure in having nothing to do; the fun is having lots to do and not doing it. - Andrew Jackson
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10-03-2008, 07:10 PM
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#338
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Laurel, MD
Posts: 8,309
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10-06-2008, 04:41 PM
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#339
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,840
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Bank of America announces it is cutting dividend 50% Bloomberg.com: Worldwide
__________________
But then what do I really know?
https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f44/why-i-believe-we-are-about-to-embark-on-a-historic-bull-market-run-101268.html
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10-06-2008, 04:43 PM
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#340
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,052
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazz4cash
If you're referring to Wachovia, I think they bought Golden West Financial, a California institution that invented the pick-a-payment loan, or at least it was thier growth engine until they had a spill.
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No, we were talking about HBAN. They bought out Skye Financial which dumped a whole lot of bad loans on them.
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