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Old 09-11-2016, 11:35 AM   #1261
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Since summer, the media has been screaming crash-crash-crash without letup. Can anyone say that this Friday decline was a surprise? Of course not.

When the big boys want it to go down, they sell, then fire up their robot algos and --- down it goes!!

When they decide its time to buy, they do so, then fire up their robot algos -- up it goes!

We retail types are corks in the sea, bobbing along with the waves and troughs created by the big boys. Totally helpless.

Don't know what's coming down tomorrow, but will sit tight with the income stocks I hold, and hope for the best.
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Old 09-11-2016, 01:39 PM   #1262
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I was not saying to sell any present positions, but I think when you have the first day in months that is more than 1% down it is likely that the move down will continue, that is just the probability of the history of the market, my comment was on someone looking to buy the odds are there will be significantly lower prices by Wednesday ( I define significant as 2-3 percent or more than the close on Friday or the open on Monday. Let’s review this assumption Wednesday after the markets close!!
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Old 09-11-2016, 02:07 PM   #1263
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I would tend to go with your guess too. Although with some of my issues they never trade anyways despite what is going on...AILNP my favorite during the 2008-09 crisis that rocked everything was actually UP 6%. Traded about 300 shares during that 2 years so it was VERY active. It has traded ZERO shares in the past 14 months.
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Old 09-11-2016, 06:34 PM   #1264
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RM - that is exactly the what I was looking for, a clarification of the meaning.

My only intent is to buy and Vanguard may force it to be Tuesday or later due to their settlement fund thing.

And I totally understand, nobody can predict the market, so if it pops up Monday, I'll be happy on Friday a couple of orders touched my low bids. If it drops more I'll look for more buying opportunities.
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Old 09-11-2016, 08:49 PM   #1265
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Quote:
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RM - that is exactly the what I was looking for, a clarification of the meaning.

My only intent is to buy and Vanguard may force it to be Tuesday or later due to their settlement fund thing.

And I totally understand, nobody can predict the market, so if it pops up Monday, I'll be happy on Friday a couple of orders touched my low bids. If it drops more I'll look for more buying opportunities.


Are you sure about that Sunset? I have money in Vanguard under going same process. It still shows in above box that I can use the money to trade. Its just not in the new account yet as the money is settling from a previous trade. But I can use it. It just isnt where it is going to be in a few days due to the conversion.
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Old 09-11-2016, 11:04 PM   #1266
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Are you sure about that Sunset? I have money in Vanguard under going same process. It still shows in above box that I can use the money to trade. Its just not in the new account yet as the money is settling from a previous trade. But I can use it. It just isnt where it is going to be in a few days due to the conversion.
For "my" Vanguard account as of Friday afternoon, it was like below, and there was no use my checking on it until Monday so I have not looked, but this is what it was:
  • The settlement money was called a money market fund.
  • They now made my settlement fund a federal money market fund.
  • The moved the old money market fund to where all the funds are and it shows the full balance of what was the settlement amount.
  • The new settlement fund a federal money market fund shows the same amount of money and has a debit of the same amount of money equaling $0.
I asked the vanguard rep what I needed to do to get the $$ back into the settlement fund and she said to sell: the old money market fund

Maybeyou will be lucky and your money will settle into the new federal money market fund and miss the entire process of going into the old to be sold so can go back into the new.
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Old 09-11-2016, 11:12 PM   #1267
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I dont have it open now, but sounds similar to mine except I have unsettled funds now. But it clearly says I can use it though to trade as of this morning when I checked. I just couldnt sell until the original unsettled money from first transaction clears. So if you wanted something couldnt you sell the old money market fund and then it would go into unsettled funds and then purchase? I know the reason why they are doing this but the process is wonky to me.
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Old 09-12-2016, 12:32 AM   #1268
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I expect when I look at it Monday that the dust will have settled and my settlement fund is showing a plain $0 , and then I will sell the Old money market fund, so it goes back into the settlement fund and I will be free to buy.

I'm not in a rush for this, so that's why I didn't go nuts on the phone with them.
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Old 09-12-2016, 07:08 AM   #1269
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In my Vanguard accounts, the only change was the creation of the settlement account using a Federal MM fund. Stock distributions and sales proceeds deposited in, stock purchases withdrawn from.

But they did not transfer money from my old Prime MM funds to the settlement account automatically, I had to initiate the exchange between the funds. Since I also had VG funds where distributions were deposited into Prime, I had to manually go into each fund and change them to go into the settlement account which was my desire.

For my son's Roth brokerage account, he's had the settlement account for months but money is still in the old Prime MM account, he has to initiate the transfer.

May be worth noting that we have not yet opted for the consolidated account where everything is held within the brokerage account, separate accounts for mutual funds and brokerage services.
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Old 09-12-2016, 09:05 AM   #1270
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OK so the market after about 5 minutes was at 2120 on the S&P500 and the ten year bond yield was at 1.68 percent. Will review final numbers and see how much a delay costs Wednesday night!
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Old 09-12-2016, 01:56 PM   #1271
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunset View Post
I expect when I look at it Monday that the dust will have settled and my settlement fund is showing a plain $0 , and then I will sell the Old money market fund, so it goes back into the settlement fund and I will be free to buy.

I'm not in a rush for this, so that's why I didn't go nuts on the phone with them.


Ok Sunset, explain this to me as I hate to learn anything anymore that I do not want to... Presently in my Vanguard I have Money in my Vanguard Federal Money Market fund and now apparently money also in my Prime Money Market fund... Which one of these funds do I use to trade out of if I want to buy?
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Old 09-12-2016, 02:08 PM   #1272
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I know you didn't ask me, but amount available to trade on the order form only indicates the monies in the settlement fund.

Vanguard told me that they will not force you out of the Prime MM fund, it is your choice where you park your money. It is your decision to transfer money from the Prime MM to the settlement fund as you choose.
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Old 09-12-2016, 02:12 PM   #1273
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Thanks Re, but now u get another question....Can I buy out of both accounts or do I have to move into one of them? I really never even paid attention to begin with to know which is the new one...I assume Federal?
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Old 09-12-2016, 02:22 PM   #1274
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Thanks Re, but now u get another question....Can I buy out of both accounts or do I have to move into one of them? I really never even paid attention to begin with to know which is the new one...I assume Federal?
I cannot answer for your account as I don't know the history, but today when I logged into "my" account.

It showed the federal money market settlement = $0

and down below in the listing of all the funds it showed the old money market fund (that used to be the settlement fund) with the full amount of what used to be in the settlement fund. I'm going to call this Oldie fund

So I sold a chunk of that Oldie fund directing the proceeds to go into my settlement fund.

When I refreshed it showed nothing available to trade, so I exited and have not looked back for today. Later I got an email, but I still expect since its a fund that it will only happen at the end of the day.
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Old 09-12-2016, 03:32 PM   #1275
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Ok SS, your situation mirrors mine. So I need to sell my "oldie funds" and at end day like mutuals it will switch over to the settlement fund. I will try that... I guess my timing of my last sell, just caused the proceeds to fall into federal market fund by coincidence of the sell date.
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Old 09-12-2016, 03:36 PM   #1276
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Thanks Re, but now u get another question....Can I buy out of both accounts or do I have to move into one of them? I really never even paid attention to begin with to know which is the new one...I assume Federal?

I do not know about your account, but my account clearly states which is the settlement fund...

Also, it is now inside the brokerage section... my old settlement was inside my ROTH IRA account..
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Old 09-12-2016, 04:04 PM   #1277
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Yes the new one states it off to the right... I just never really paid attention as I only had a money market fund and never really paid attention to the name. It just seemed like the money split apart on its own without my doing. But unlike Sunset, I just had a "well timed" trade where it naturally transferred to new account without me doing anything. So I just need to treat the old money market fund like a mutual fund and sell it so it can go with the other money.
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Old 09-12-2016, 04:09 PM   #1278
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Ok, I transferred it. We will see when it hits the new one....I really dont like change...I guess this old fund will just sit empty now as I see no use for it.
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Old 09-13-2016, 09:22 AM   #1279
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Sold out half my AES-C and locked down the quick profits at $51.10 this morning... Sold off my ill fated PJS flip that netted a minus $10 basically breaking even that they would not call....they did... I should have flipped the other half when I had a chance as I made money on those 400 shares...Got greedy, oh well. There are worse things in life than complaining about a $10 loss, ha.
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Old 09-13-2016, 10:09 AM   #1280
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So I go through all the money moving to get it back into the settlement fund and try to buy MONMP at Vanguard, and it says I have to phone in as cannot do it online
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