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01-26-2019, 09:43 AM
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#2141
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 26,819
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpeirce
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I think it is reasonable for Tesla to raise prices, though it is a sign they are reaching for cash flow. What really struck me though, was this article:
https://electrek.co/2019/01/22/tesla...omer-backlash/
Tesla cuts Supercharger prices back down after customer backlash over increase
Quote:
Now Tesla told Electrek that it listened to customer feedback and decided to reduce the Supercharger price increase by 10% globally.
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I'm a little surprised that the customers would complain so much about a little increase. Don't most charge at home? Isn't it still cheaper than gasoline?
Is this a sign that the 'honeymoon' is over?
Quote:
Originally Posted by oneill225
I ...TSLA stock price is trending higher in the pre-market. Looks like it may be bouncing back a little for those who bought on Friday's dip.
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That pre-market rise fizzled before it went anywhere. We've seen maybe just a few minutes where an astute & lucky trader might have made a small profit if they bought at the very low on Friday, and sold at the very peak on Tuesday. A very slim opportunity at all, and would have to have been played just right to make maybe a 2.5% profit.
That same astute & lucky trader could have made over 7% last week in stodgy old F.
-ERD50
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01-26-2019, 05:23 PM
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#2142
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,499
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Wondering why tesla is marketed as an expensive performance car. Oh, and why is the goverment subsidizing a performance car? Much noise is generated about how fast it can accelarate.
Is not the idea of electric cars to be more economical to buy, operate, and be truly more environmentaly friendly than any ICE car. Anotherwords total cost of ownership, compred to generally affordable ICE cars?
Seems Tesla can't compete on price, range, all region, all season useability like even the lowest cost Ford , Chevy or Dodge. What they spout off about is how brutally fast it can accelarate from zero to whatever. Plus all the expensive whiz bang doodads.
__________________
There must be moderation in everything, including moderation.
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01-26-2019, 05:44 PM
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#2143
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ls99
Wondering why tesla is marketed as an expensive performance car. Oh, and why is the goverment subsidizing a performance car?
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Crony Capitalism, and, very effective lobbyists in D.C.. and the CA state capitol. The San Francisco Bay Area is ground zero for these things on the left coast.
EDIT: Currently CA has billions of $ in un funded road and bridge repairs in the state. So, the state is instead doing things like spending $60 million to remove convex lane marker bumps , and re stripe with wider stripes to accommodate sensor systems on self driving cars. Screw the existing owners of 28 million registered vehicles to accommodate technology on a couple hundred thousand vehicles. The explanation from Caltrans is the lane safety bumps sometimes confuse the self driving systems.
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01-26-2019, 06:03 PM
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#2144
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gone traveling
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 1,196
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Musk claims to work 120 hours a week, doesn't take vacations, goes on no sleep or takes Ambien. He must be high but then again there is a video of him doing just that.
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01-26-2019, 08:54 PM
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#2145
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,499
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Further hinking about tela owners getting a free ride on public highways. They pay zero road tax. The roads are funded via what is known as "liquid fuel taxes" which are collected on a per gallon bases at various rates by the states and distributed to municapalities for maintaining roadways. Plus the feds get their ounce flesh as well at the pump.
In PA we pay 50.7 cents per gallon plus fed tax of roughly 18 cents per gallon.
How about taxing the tesla owners on a gasoline equivalent bases. TIme for these freeloaders to cough up some cash for the roads they use.
" Gasoline gallon equivalent ( GGE) or gasoline-equivalent gallon ( GEG) is the amount of alternative fuel it takes to equal the energy content of one liquid gallon of gasoline. GGE allows consumers to compare the energy content of competing fuels against a commonly known fuel—gasoline. GGE also compares gasoline to fuels sold as a gas (natural gas, propane, hydrogen) and electricity."
Per wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasoli...quivalentthere is a gasoline equivalant cost table, part of which copied here:
If for example electric cost is 10cents/KWh, it is same as $3.340/gallon of gas. Then add fuel taxes.
The colums did not copy well, welcome to look at the wiki site linked.
Electricity cost for 1GGE.
1 GGE = 33.40 kWh For local rate
per kWh $/gallon
equivalent $0.03 $1.000 $0.04 $1.333 $0.05 $1.667 $0.06 $2.000 $0.07 $2.338 $0.08 $2.670 $0.09 $3.006 $0.10 $3.340 $0.11 $3.674 $0.12 $4.000 $0.13 $4.342 $0.14 $4.670
__________________
There must be moderation in everything, including moderation.
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01-27-2019, 12:14 AM
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#2146
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ls99
Further hinking about tela owners getting a free ride on public highways. They pay zero road tax. The roads are funded via what is known as "liquid fuel taxes" which are collected on a per gallon bases at various rates by the states and distributed to municapalities for maintaining roadways. Plus the feds get their ounce flesh as well at the pump.
In PA we pay 50.7 cents per gallon plus fed tax of roughly 18 cents per gallon.
How about taxing the tesla owners on a gasoline equivalent bases. TIme for these freeloaders to cough up some cash for the roads they use.
" Gasoline gallon equivalent ( GGE) or gasoline-equivalent gallon ( GEG) is the amount of alternative fuel it takes to equal the energy content of one liquid gallon of gasoline. GGE allows consumers to compare the energy content of competing fuels against a commonly known fuel—gasoline. GGE also compares gasoline to fuels sold as a gas (natural gas, propane, hydrogen) and electricity."
Per wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasoli...quivalentthere is a gasoline equivalant cost table, part of which copied here:
If for example electric cost is 10cents/KWh, it is same as $3.340/gallon of gas. Then add fuel taxes.
The colums did not copy well, welcome to look at the wiki site linked.
Electricity cost for 1GGE.
1 GGE = 33.40 kWh For local rate
per kWh $/gallon
equivalent $0.03 $1.000 $0.04 $1.333 $0.05 $1.667 $0.06 $2.000 $0.07 $2.338 $0.08 $2.670 $0.09 $3.006 $0.10 $3.340 $0.11 $3.674 $0.12 $4.000 $0.13 $4.342 $0.14 $4.670
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Regarding taxing Tesla owners:
The government is trying to get you to get rid of the smelly polluting ICE vehicles, and transition you to EV's, or whatever else gets invented.
Expect more taxation from the government. Look what France tried (unsuccessfully).
Efforts to stop climate change are going to be rammed down peoples throats.
If you don't believe me, examine what the new Representatives (voted in this month) are pushing for.
I'd say you have about 21 months til things get crazy.
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01-27-2019, 07:14 AM
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#2147
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,499
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Tightwad
Regarding taxing Tesla owners:
The government is trying to get you to get rid of the smelly polluting ICE vehicles, and transition you to EV's, or whatever else gets invented.
Expect more taxation from the government. Look what France tried (unsuccessfully).
Efforts to stop climate change are going to be rammed down peoples throats.
If you don't believe me, examine what the new Representatives (voted in this month) are pushing for.
I'd say you have about 21 months til things get crazy.
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That is all very nice for a few in the government to try and get rid of ICE cars. Wish them luck. Meantime it does not justify EV owner's getting a free ride on the roadways.
As for the new representatives, the electorate deserves exactly what their elected reps give them. And if they don't like it, recall them.
For manmade climate change, the jury is till out. The climate has been changing ever since there was climate. And will continue to do so long after Homo Sapiens is extinct. There is a reason Greenland is maned as such.
__________________
There must be moderation in everything, including moderation.
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01-27-2019, 08:10 AM
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#2148
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ls99
Wondering why tesla is marketed as an expensive performance car. Oh, and why is the goverment subsidizing a performance car? Much noise is generated about how fast it can accelarate.
Is not the idea of electric cars to be more economical to buy, operate, and be truly more environmentaly friendly than any ICE car. Anotherwords total cost of ownership, compred to generally affordable ICE cars?
Seems Tesla can't compete on price, range, all region, all season useability like even the lowest cost Ford , Chevy or Dodge. What they spout off about is how brutally fast it can accelarate from zero to whatever. Plus all the expensive whiz bang doodads.
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Your post just shows your ignorance on this topic and how little research you apparently have done or how closely you have been watching Tesla over the years and recently. Have you reviewed their 10yr plan and the minor chgs. Have you looked at the MR and SR 3 cars or plans for Y. Have you seen which level of cars they are going to be making in the new China factory EOY19/BOY20. Have you seen the EU sales figures. The sales scorecard on insideevs.com over the past couple of years. Then the dozens of announcements and prototypes by competing car companies.
Seriously your post was so bad it was laughable ignorant (lacking knowledge or awareness).
This thread has become so far off (wacky) that it is not even worth subscribing to. This forum, in general, has a handful of posters that really bring down many threads. Peace out.
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01-27-2019, 08:32 AM
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#2149
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pacific latitude 20/49
Posts: 7,677
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ls99
There is a reason Greenland is maned as such.
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I agree with your post but I wanted to correct your misstatement: Greenland was named for Iceland by mistake and Iceland was green because of volcanic action. Not because Greenland was farmed by the Vikings back in the day.
__________________
For the fun of it...Keith
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01-27-2019, 09:11 AM
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#2150
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,499
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eroscott
Your post just shows your ignorance on this topic and how little research you apparently have done or how closely you have been watching Tesla over the years and recently. Have you reviewed their 10yr plan and the minor chgs. Have you looked at the MR and SR 3 cars or plans for Y. Have you seen which level of cars they are going to be making in the new China factory EOY19/BOY20. Have you seen the EU sales figures. The sales scorecard on insideevs.com over the past couple of years. Then the dozens of announcements and prototypes by competing car companies.
Seriously your post was so bad it was laughable ignorant (lacking knowledge or awareness).
This thread has become so far off (wacky) that it is not even worth subscribing to. This forum, in general, has a handful of posters that really bring down many threads. Peace out.
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Thank you for the compliment.
Pipe dreams are nice. I am still interested as to why This EV performance car or any EV car getting government subsidy. And why they get a free ride on the public roadways.
__________________
There must be moderation in everything, including moderation.
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01-27-2019, 09:13 AM
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#2151
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,499
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcowan
I agree with your post but I wanted to correct your misstatement: Greenland was named for Iceland by mistake and Iceland was green because of volcanic action. Not because Greenland was farmed by the Vikings back in the day.
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Thanks, appreciate the clarification. AFIK there was farming done on greenland.
__________________
There must be moderation in everything, including moderation.
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01-27-2019, 09:16 AM
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#2152
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Miami
Posts: 337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ls99
Wondering why tesla is marketed as an expensive performance car. Oh, and why is the goverment subsidizing a performance car? Much noise is generated about how fast it can accelarate.
Is not the idea of electric cars to be more economical to buy, operate, and be truly more environmentaly friendly than any ICE car. Anotherwords total cost of ownership, compred to generally affordable ICE cars?
Seems Tesla can't compete on price, range, all region, all season useability like even the lowest cost Ford , Chevy or Dodge. What they spout off about is how brutally fast it can accelarate from zero to whatever. Plus all the expensive whiz bang doodads.
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These comments remind me of the arguments about cars repacing horses in 1910:
https://www.saturdayeveningpost.com/...t-automobiles/
quote:
You’re crazy if you think this fool contraption you’ve been wasting your time on will ever displace the horse.”From my pocket I took a clipping from the New York World of November 17, 1895, and asked him to read it. He brushed it aside. I insisted. It was an interview with Thomas A. Edison: “Talking of horseless carriage suggests to my mind that the horse is doomed. The bicycle, which, 10 years ago, was a curiosity, is now a necessity. It is found everywhere. Ten years from now you will be able to buy a horseless vehicle for what you would pay today for a wagon and a pair of horses. The money spent in the keep of the horses will be saved and the danger to life will be much reduced.”
“It is only a question of a short time when the carriages and trucks of every large city will be run by motors. The expense of keeping and feeding horses in a great city like New York is very heavy, and all this will be done away with
__________________
FIRE July 2015
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01-27-2019, 10:56 AM
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#2153
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eroscott
Your post just shows your ignorance on this topic and how little research you apparently have done or how closely you have been watching Tesla over the years and recently. Have you reviewed their 10yr plan and the minor chgs. Have you looked at the MR and SR 3 cars or plans for Y. Have you seen which level of cars they are going to be making in the new China factory EOY19/BOY20. Have you seen the EU sales figures. The sales scorecard on insideevs.com over the past couple of years. Then the dozens of announcements and prototypes by competing car companies.
Seriously your post was so bad it was laughable ignorant (lacking knowledge or awareness).
This thread has become so far off (wacky) that it is not even worth subscribing to. This forum, in general, has a handful of posters that really bring down many threads. Peace out.
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Absolutely correct about a handful of posters. They spread their negativity and one in particular insults anyone who doesn't think like him.
Shame to see an otherwise good forum go down the toilet.
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01-27-2019, 11:13 AM
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#2154
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ls99
Thank you for the compliment.
Pipe dreams are nice. I am still interested as to why This EV performance car or any EV car getting government subsidy. And why they get a free ride on the public roadways.
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I already answered you. But I will repeat it.
The answer is because ICE cars pollute the earth. The government is encouraging you to transition to emission free cars. You will be taxed more in the future if you keep your ICE vehicle. EV's will be paying up as well. The government wants money from them too.
Whether any of this is good or bad, or whatever you want to complain about regarding EV's, the direction we are headed is obvious.
There are lawmakers in power who are determined to make ICE cars obsolete.
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01-27-2019, 12:21 PM
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#2155
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 40,581
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<mod hat on>
Let’s all remember our Dale Carnegie and be polite.
If anyone feels a post is objectionable, it should be reported
The “ignore” button is quite useful for members that simply cannot get along.
Thank you and have a nice day
<mod hat off>
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01-27-2019, 12:29 PM
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#2156
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,499
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Tightwad
I already answered you. But I will repeat it.
The answer is because ICE cars pollute the earth. The government is encouraging you to transition to emission free cars. You will be taxed more in the future if you keep your ICE vehicle. EV's will be paying up as well. The government wants money from them too.
Whether any of this is good or bad, or whatever you want to complain about regarding EV's, the direction we are headed is obvious.
There are lawmakers in power who are determined to make ICE cars obsolete.
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Very well, we shall see how this charming experimet of the electorate will turn out.
Cheers!
Carry on
__________________
There must be moderation in everything, including moderation.
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01-27-2019, 12:44 PM
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#2157
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 17,203
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueskies123
These comments remind me of the arguments about cars repacing horses in 1910:
https://www.saturdayeveningpost.com/...t-automobiles/
quote:
You’re crazy if you think this fool contraption you’ve been wasting your time on will ever displace the horse.”From my pocket I took a clipping from the New York World of November 17, 1895, and asked him to read it. He brushed it aside. I insisted. It was an interview with Thomas A. Edison: “Talking of horseless carriage suggests to my mind that the horse is doomed. The bicycle, which, 10 years ago, was a curiosity, is now a necessity. It is found everywhere. Ten years from now you will be able to buy a horseless vehicle for what you would pay today for a wagon and a pair of horses. The money spent in the keep of the horses will be saved and the danger to life will be much reduced.”
“It is only a question of a short time when the carriages and trucks of every large city will be run by motors. The expense of keeping and feeding horses in a great city like New York is very heavy, and all this will be done away with
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Not a good comparison IMO... the difference between horses and cars was huge... it was a game changer... now, if they were arguing about which kind of horse to use then it would be comparable...
EVs are basically the same as ICE in their function... it is basically the fuel that is different... now, if there was a legit flying car that was safe to use compared to a car on the ground that would be more of a comparison to the buggy and car...
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01-27-2019, 12:46 PM
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#2158
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 2,691
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas Proud
Not a good comparison IMO... the difference between horses and cars was huge... it was a game changer... now, if they were arguing about which kind of horse to use then it would be comparable...
EVs are basically the same as ICE in their function... it is basically the fuel that is different... now, if there was a legit flying car that was safe to use compared to a car on the ground that would be more of a comparison to the buggy and car...
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Well said Texas. Or maybe if the change was from mule to horse?
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01-27-2019, 01:17 PM
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#2159
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Conroe, Texas
Posts: 18,642
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If you REALLY want pollution - free transportation, one needs to GO BACK to the horse and buggy. (disallow motorized vehicles)
Then all we would need fuel for is our whale oil lamps, and they would be free of crude oil based fuel too.
__________________
*********Go Astros!*********
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01-27-2019, 01:32 PM
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#2160
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 717
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aja8888
If you REALLY want pollution - free transportation, one needs to GO BACK to the horse and buggy. (disallow motorized vehicles)
Then all we would need fuel for is our whale oil lamps, and they would be free of crude oil based fuel too.
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Exactly. That seems to be something that proponents of electric vehicles often conveniently overlook. Somewhere there is a power plant that is running the power grid that the electric vehicle plugs into . Just because they don’t have exhaust coming from the vehicle doesn’t mean it’s pollution free...
__________________
Whatever failures I have known, whatever errors I have committed, whatever follies I have witnessed in private and public life have been the consequence of action without thought... - Bernard Baruch
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